Avantair Hiring

[lowspeed]

im a two year fo and im going to clear 45 with a bit of overtime and straight three yr pay is 44k

 

[jonjuan]

im a two year fo and im going to clear 45 with a bit of overtime and straight three yr pay is 44k

You only have to suck it up for the first year or two according to hazmat which I take to mean you will upgrade your third year.

 

[HazMat]

Correct. I have no clue what the upgrade time is at NetJets a captain there told me 10 years. So you are comparing fo pay at netjets to captains pay at AvantAir from year three until you upgrade at netjets.

 

[wacoflyr]

Whenever somebody suggests that they Know when specific upgrades will take place, I wince. No one knows. If somebody asks, the only honest answer is that nobody knows. Any other answer is sunshine. The economy dictates, and we dance to the tune.

 

[FO 4 Life]

As an outsider, you can't compare NJA pay to Avantair for one reason. Time.

NJA started in the 60's. Avantair started in 2003.

I don't know when NJA signed their contract with the current rates, but I'm sure it took longer than the 6 years Avantair has been in business.

 

[-FlyAuburn-]

As an outsider, you can't compare NJA pay to Avantair for one reason. Time.

NJA started in the 60's. Avantair started in 2003.

I don't know when NJA signed their contract with the current rates, but I'm sure it took longer than the 6 years Avantair has been in business.

You can't compare the pay based on time in business true, but you can compare it based on the stated minimum qualifications for the job(2500tt, etc., same as the rest of the fracs). Based on the pay and the fact that "it has only been in business a short time" and it is "only a turboprop"(not my words), the mins should be around 500-1000 hours.

 

[C425Driver]

From AirlinePilotCentral:

I see that a 5 year F/O makes 43,000?

Nope. The APC information is out of date. FO payscales were increased several months ago and they are getting another bump on January 1.

 

[Willy21]

Correct. I have no clue what the upgrade time is at NetJets a captain there told me 10 years. So you are comparing fo pay at netjets to captains pay at AvantAir from year three until you upgrade at netjets.

I looked at the numbers, considering an f/o at AvantAir for 2 years followed by 8 years as captain, your base salary would be $732,000 over 10 years. At NetJets, considering 10 years as a f/o, your salary would be $697,000 over 10 years. (This is only comparing 7&7 schedules and base aircraft at NetJets, ie no >40,000 lbs catagory)

If you project an upgrade at NetJets for years 11 and 12 the total salary would be $947,000 and AvantAir is $936,000. (AvantAir only has a 12 year payscale so that is why I stopped at year 12)

If you look just at the numbers there isn't much of a difference. The big "IF" is will an AvantAir newhire upgrade in 3 years? NetJets went from ungrades in basic indoc to >4.5 years. (there has not been any upgrades in the past year so this number is growing daily) I hope AvantAir continues to have sucess, but if you are looking for the three year upgrade in my mind you have already missed the boat. This has been proven time and time again to be true. You need to look no further than the unfortunate situation 495 fellow pilots and there familes are dealing with through no fault of there own.

Again, I am not trying to bash anyone, but chasing upgrades, big contracts, new airframes ect. can be be good and also bad at the same time. If it were me looking into flying for AvantAir I would make sure I could make ends meet on f/o pay for 10 years and if an upgrade comes early that is just a bonus.

M. Williams

 

[glasspilot]

You can't compare the pay based on time in business true, but you can compare it based on the stated minimum qualifications for the job(2500tt, etc., same as the rest of the fracs).

You seem hung up on the published mins.

The reality is that there are so few pilot jobs out there, so few companies hiring, and so many pilots looking for work that it really doesn't matter what the mins are. That is why I tongue in cheek said you needed 5 shuttle missions and a landing in the Hudson.

The reality is that there are right now thousands of guys trying to get into a class of 4 at Avantair. If Avantair wanted to they could demand a 757 type with PIC time, time in the SR-71 or F-22 and a letter from a Congressmen who has personally flown with the applicant. With all of those requirements Avantair would still fill the class.

And the pay is 35K. The pay was only 30K when I came and I blew my entire first year pay on legal expenses (long story) and I am still very happy I came here instead of anywhere else.

I may drive over to see the next new hire class just so I can shake the hands of the best pilots in the world. Point is, relax on the whole 2500 TT posted min. It doesnt' really matter does it?

 

[-FlyAuburn-]

You seem hung up on the published mins.

The reality is that there are so few pilot jobs out there, so few companies hiring, and so many pilots looking for work that it really doesn't matter what the mins are. That is why I tongue in cheek said you needed 5 shuttle missions and a landing in the Hudson.

The reality is that there are right now thousands of guys trying to get into a class of 4 at Avantair. If Avantair wanted to they could demand a 757 type with PIC time, time in the SR-71 or F-22 and a letter from a Congressmen who has personally flown with the applicant. With all of those requirements Avantair would still fill the class.

And the pay is 35K. The pay was only 30K when I came and I blew my entire first year pay on legal expenses (long story) and I am still very happy I came here instead of anywhere else.

I may drive over to see the next new hire class just so I can shake the hands of the best pilots in the world. Point is, relax on the whole 2500 TT posted min. It doesnt' really matter does it?

Glass, believe me I get it it. It all has to do with what the market will bear, which isn't much at this point. I guess the point of my original post was in no way meant to bash AA, but to point out that the state of our industry and specifically our profession is very sad. Managers will use opportunities like this to justify lower pay, and we all eat it up because "that's just the way it is" etc. We all deserve more. It's not greed, it's just my opinion on what I know I have personally gone through financially and the sacrifices I've made. The return on investment just hasn't measured up IMO. I'm sure my story is very very similar to the other 494 furloughees at NJA and the rest at every other air carrier. It's just a big downer to be on the street and see another company hiring, but at such a low initial pay rate.

 

[lowspeed]

You only have to suck it up for the first year or two according to hazmat which I take to mean you will upgrade your third year.

Maybe...... in this enviroment i think sitting right seat makeing 44K on three year pay in a turbo- prop isnt all that bad. People know the pay when they come here and if it works for you great if not there are other options.

 

[lowspeed]

You can't compare the pay based on time in business true, but you can compare it based on the stated minimum qualifications for the job(2500tt, etc., same as the rest of the fracs). Based on the pay and the fact that "it has only been in business a short time" and it is "only a turboprop"(not my words), the mins should be around 500-1000 hours.

the problem with that is that now you have people that would have to possibly spend 4yrs to meet the company capt. mins. if they were hired at 500hr So if they can get people at 2500 why wouldnt you.

 

[smartelephant]

You seem hung up on the published mins.

The reality is that there are so few pilot jobs out there, so few companies hiring, and so many pilots looking for work that it really doesn't matter what the mins are. That is why I tongue in cheek said you needed 5 shuttle missions and a landing in the Hudson.

The reality is that there are right now thousands of guys trying to get into a class of 4 at Avantair. If Avantair wanted to they could demand a 757 type with PIC time, time in the SR-71 or F-22 and a letter from a Congressmen who has personally flown with the applicant. With all of those requirements Avantair would still fill the class.

And the pay is 35K. The pay was only 30K when I came and I blew my entire first year pay on legal expenses (long story) and I am still very happy I came here instead of anywhere else.

I may drive over to see the next new hire class just so I can shake the hands of the best pilots in the world. Point is, relax on the whole 2500 TT posted min. It doesnt' really matter does it?

Are you really serious about this? The best pilot's in the world? So, when the industry turns and everyone shuffles around to new jobs and Avantair is forced to hire people with much lower times and far less experience than you described above, you won't be willing to go shake their hands? Please......best pilot's in the world. If experience was the sole determining factor on labeling someone with the above mentioned title then how would you label the two ATP guys who had 50k hours between them and buried a 182 into the side of a mountain last year? With the above logic these guys would earn the title "Best Pilots in the World." I guess they could have it etched on their gravestone right above the accident report.

 

[hangarrat]

Are you really serious about this? The best pilot's in the world?

Uh, have ya met Glass? Duh, of course its a joke

 

[glasspilot]

Settle down out there.

I came up with the title "best pilots in the world" as simple way to emphasize the accomplishment of 4 guys to get hired out of thousands of applicants. (All with internal recs).

Re-freaking-lax. I'm sure the two guys who augured in a Cessna last year were great pilots. (they really should put those mountains near VGT on a chart or something), Sully is God and you're still a smart elephant. I was just trying to point out how competitive it is out there and making the point by saying whoever shows up for class must be Chuck Yeager's kid. It was obvious to everyone with an IQ over 60, but I'm happy to explain it to you. Let me know if anything else confuses you and I'll be happy to explain it.

 

[glasspilot]

Doh, hangarrat beat me. Curse those fast fingers!

 

[Dilligaff]

Glass,

Sometimes you talk too much. Sometimes you're entertaining. Sometimes both.

 

[wacoflyr]

Dilligaff,
sometimes you.....

 

[Dilligaff]

Waco,

Same to you.....

 

[mainiac]

.09

:beer: