ATP Seminole Crash

[Kaman]

Hello,
I did a portion of my training with ATPs in Jax, and I never heard of or observed anyone doing instruction from the backseat. I cannot say with 100% certainty, but I don't think that their insurance would permit that. However, it wasn't uncommon to have an observer aboard.
I only saw a brief clip on FOX, but based on the appearance of the wreckage, it appears that the airplane impacted in a flat attitude with the direction of rotation to the left. It was my experience that Vmc demo in the Seminole was very benign and when done correctly the airplane would stall before loss of directional control.
Bottom-line is that I was in shock seeing the ATP logo on the tail of the wreckage. I am deeply saddened and my family's thoughts and prayers are with the lost pilots families.

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead

 

[dav8or]

I met Josh on friday when I took my ATP written @ RDU he was very professional. We talked about his career track and the industry.

I instructed with Irene at RUQ back in the day. She was an accomplished pilot and instructor. Her dog went everywhere with her and probly had more flight hours than I did. The last time I saw Irene was at Sun and Fun, just walking up the vendor isles and there she was with the dog in here purse. They'll all be missed.

Everybody fly safe.

 

[prodigal]

ATP

I went through ATP's career pilot program in the summer of 2000 and at that time there was NO instruction being done from the backseat. My understanding was that it had been stopped sometime shortly before that time frame.
I feel for those lost and for the families. Please let this be a reminder again complacence.
God Bless.

 

[SkySpray]

Since we're on the topic, here's a case where backseat instructing wasn't a very good idea. I just don't understand.

www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20020702X01027&key=1

I wonder if this will motivate the FAA to do something about backseat instructing.

 

[LearLove]

The news reported wrong as always. The instructor was not in the back giving instruction. Our/my friend was in the back seat observing for her Comm Multi ride. Beth was awsome person and I miss her already.

Including military, commercial and GA flying Beth is the 10th person I've known personally or professionally that is now lost to aviation. The second person this year and 5th in the last five.

 

[Cadillac]

no backseat instructing

I did my ratings and instructed with ATP, and there was never any backseat instruction that I knew of. Its my understanding that they used to do it that way, XC with all 3 pilots logging PIC, but the FAA put a stop to it.

Very sad. My experience was that they were very standardized and professional, even though we were very fresh instructors for the most part.

What I don't understand is the dog. . .

 

[172driver]

Almost impossible to Vmc roll a Seminole unintentionally. Even with full control inputs held, the plane will recover itself. A SE stall/spin on the other hand would be a lot easier to induce.

 

[SigAV8R]

I finished ATPs Career Pilot program in February of this year. All of my instruction was done from the front seat. I don't know of any instruction which was done from the back seat. It's a shame this had to happen to ATP b/c I believe the program is an excellent start for career oriented people. When I went through the MEI part of the program, they were VERY specific about teaching Vmc demos and recovering at "first sign" of any stall indications. Being an ATP alum, I'm obviously bias. My prayers go out to the families of the people on board.

 

[EMcx2]

Has any one here spun a Seminole? Is it unrecoverable? I know a couple of people who have done full VMc rolls in them and they both said they lost 2,000 feet recovering.

I did my COM ME at ATP and training at

 

[350DRIVER]

Has any one here spun a Seminole? Is it unrecoverable?

I don't think you are going to find too too many that are going to do a spin in a airplane that is not approved for spins, I may be wrong but I don't think a seminole is approved for spins.

God Bless them

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