Atlas going Teamsters

[dutch747]

The only airline to cross our (World Airways) picket line, during the stike three years ago, was a fellow IBT airline Challenge Air cargo. Gemini Air Cargo took a stand against their management and flew their aircraft out empty. I still buy beverages everytime I have the privilige of hanging with a GAC crew.

I and my fellow crewmembers have a different reaction when we run into Challange Air Cargo scabs.

On the other hand, the IBT loaders at Air Canada in LAX walk off our aircraft in support.

Bel

No brother... They had a letter from our local stating it was OK to fly our cargo. Remember Seth confronted them in Indi.

That left a sour taste in our mouths about Teamsters.

 

[Fliteidol]

Will Teamsters accept all of the old Eastern Scabs?

Well ALPA forgave the Continental job seekers!

 

[FreightBumper]

Teamsters picket? Really? When's the last time you saw a Teamster represented airline do that? Just asking.

You are right as usual, wait.. wasn't Delta IBT? No, my bad. They were alpa when they crossed Comair's line to fly all those people from Cincinnati and elsewhere. I guess neither group has the high ground in that arena. Just an observation.

 

[cfire]

Couldn't be much worse than Polar (ALPA) requesting relief to fly agreed upon Atlas (ALPA) struck work/aircraft during the last minutes to strike release by the NMB for Atlas. Then later have they have the audacity to call Atlas crews scabs after they went on a sympathy strike for Polar which resulted in a Federal court order to return to work.

https://crewroom.alpa.org/AAI072/DesktopModules/ViewDocument.aspx?DocumentID=41015

 

[dutch747]

Couldn't be much worse than Polar (ALPA) requesting relief to fly agreed upon Atlas (ALPA) struck work/aircraft during the last minutes to strike release by the NMB for Atlas. Then later have they have the audacity to call Atlas crews scabs after they went on a sympathy strike for Polar which resulted in a Federal court order to return to work.

https://crewroom.alpa.org/AAI072/DesktopModules/ViewDocument.aspx?DocumentID=41015

Yes, that was wrong... But how do the Polar guys feel about going to Teamsters?

 

[cfire]

They don't like it. They have favors due from the ALPA President for votes that have been called on by them. Resulting in all the past delays. The current attempt to go Teamsters would negate that. ALPA just came up with a merger push all-of-a-sudden between Atlas and Polar after the Teamsters push. Probably a PR move (and to keep dues at ALPA) to put a band-aid on the merger situation that should had been done a year and a half ago.

A single carrier situation between Atlas and Polar going to Teamsters would severely screw up the Polar contingents leverage within ALPA against Atlas that has played a big part of the delay for the last year and a half.

 

[tzskipper]

Cfire and all,

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I have to comment anyway....

It appears (from what is posted) that you think that ALPA Nat'l is dictating the direction and efforts of the Atlas MEC. I, for one, seriously doubt that is true.

Question: Have you served in an elected capacity on your MEC (either as a LEC rep or MEC Officer)?

From my experience, the old saying is true; ALPA is a "toolbox", and a very good one at that. It is up to the individual airline's elected leadership as to whether the "toolbox" is effectively used. It is a "bottom-up" organization, where the individual pilot has a say (by voting on resolutions, etc.)

Contrast the above with IBT, where (as I understand it) the non-elected "Business Agent" makes the decision as to what is good or bad for the group.

In closing, all I can say, is that if ALPA is not "working" the way that your group feels that is should, then your issue ought to be with your MEC's inability to effectively manage all of the resources that are available to them.

Fratenally,

Skipper

 

[fob727]

good post

 

[dojetdriver]

From my experience, the old saying is true; ALPA is a "toolbox", and a very good one at that. It is up to the individual airline's elected leadership as to whether the "toolbox" is effectively used. It is a "bottom-up" organization, where the individual pilot has a say (by voting on resolutions, etc.)

In closing, all I can say, is that if ALPA is not "working" the way that your group feels that is should, then your issue ought to be with your MEC's inability to effectively manage all of the resources that are available to them.

Fratenally,

Skipper

Agreed, ALPA is only as good as your local MEC.

 

[Box-Hauler]

The difference that I have seen is that any new deals need to be ratified (voted) on by the membership with the IBT. I believe this is not the case with ALPA. The way I understand it is that with ALPA the LEC or MEC or whomever is in charge of the local airline can make a deal and that is that, no vote, no voice except when it comes time to elect a new leader.

If this is not correct I apologize and am sure I will get flamed......:smash:

I base my opinion on my personal experience, ALPA at a commuter (did nothing for us) and IBT at FAR121 (do more but still not tough enough)

 

[hvydriver]

The difference that I have seen is that any new deals need to be ratified (voted) on by the membership with the IBT. I believe this is not the case with ALPA. The way I understand it is that with ALPA the LEC or MEC or whomever is in charge of the local airline can make a deal and that is that, no vote, no voice except when it comes time to elect a new leader.

If this is not correct I apologize and am sure I will get flamed......:smash:

I base my opinion on my personal experience, ALPA at a commuter (did nothing for us) and IBT at FAR121 (do more but still not tough enough)

Box,

FWIW, it's up to the local councils. At 017, any changes to work rules, compensation, retirement, etc., requires membership ratification.

 

[Bellerophon]

No brother... They had a letter from our local stating it was OK to fly our cargo. Remember Seth confronted them in Indi.

That left a sour taste in our mouths about Teamsters.

You missed the point. Why did the Challenge Air Cargo pilots go looking for a fax? In our contract we do not cross picket lines. The UPS truckers were not looking for a fax. The Gemini Air Cargo pilots were not looking for a fax. I bet those scab pilots who flew our MD-11 back from Africa had a fax too. Those Challenge Air Cargo pilots are scabs that think they can beat the system by having a fax.

Were you at World during the strike? Might explain your lax attitude about it.

Enjoy the benefits.

Bel

 

[cfire]

Yes ALPA National is a tool box.

It can provide a bulldozer or just give you a hand shovel to do the job of moving a mountain to the MEC or LEC's. They have chosen to provide a dozer for Polar due to ALPA presidential votes and to Atlas only a hand shovel to work with. MEC's and LEC's can only do so much with what they are provided.

On the issue of strikes, Atlas was able to get the Federal courts via the second court order during the Polar strike to uphold our right not to cross a legal picket line. That, however, does not include a parked truck with a "on strike" sign on it somewhere in the vicinity of an airport. The first court order required that we returned to work whether there was a picket line there or not.

BTW Atlas is the only cargo carrier to hold a sympathy strike for another ALPA cargo carrier in ALPA history according to the legal dept.

 

[flyinboxes]

You are right as usual, wait.. wasn't Delta IBT? No, my bad. They were alpa when they crossed Comair's line to fly all those people from Cincinnati and elsewhere. I guess neither group has the high ground in that arena. Just an observation.[/quote


Well that is certainly a new one. You may want to run that by the 7000 DAL pilots and get a second opinion on crossing a line. Also, you can call the Comair MEC and ask them if the DAL guys are scabs and if so could they send you a list. Pathetic.

 

[MD11Drvr]

Teamsters picket? Really? When's the last time you saw a Teamster represented airline do that? Just asking.

World Airways a little over 3 years ago. On strike for 11 days. Mixed feelings on the circumstances for ending the strike but none the less we walked.