ATA Lowers Bar

[FreightNazi]

I have two friends in management at UPS and their vision of the future included trucks that were double-crewed and ran at all hours of the day and night. The international stuff would be mostly line flown and the rest subbed out to the likes of Gemini and others. Both of these guys don't know each other, yet they both gave me this same opinion. According to them the "airline" (as they call UPS flight ops) is just too expensive.

I'm sure freight nazi will reply with some contract clause about scope but believe me if mgmnt wants that "airline" gone it will go.

If you are right, then I'll just have to content myself flying my A-380 SDF-HKG. Like you said, sucks to be me!

 

[TZFO]

Doesnt this forum have a section called "cargo."
Why is it yall are above posting there?

 

[FreightNazi]

Your problems will not come from a LCC freight carrier. Your problems will come from Memphis. FredEx is rapidly closing the profit-margin gap, and their ground delivery is racking up record profit. The day will come when "remaining profitable" will come out of your salary. And remember, you heard it here first.

Just to set the record straight, the pilots at UPS make up approx, 7/10ths of 1% of the total UPS employess, yet the air group brings in almost 50% of the total revenue. UPS could give each pilot a million dollars a year and they wouldn't even miss it. Since UPS' major future growth is international, the prospects for the airline are bright indeed.

 

[TZFO]

From WesB737fo.
"Basically what you are saying is that the other 80% are stupid for giving ATA and new ideas a chance. So I guess they should have taken the extra 20% pay for a few months, then join the ranks of the unemployed. The other 80% includes alot of people with alot of experience (probably alot of bankruptcies). I don't really believe that you would consider flying turboprops as a permanent career or you wouldn't be here. So give us a break with your " I voted no " and "The others are lowering the bar" garbage, because I just don't care."

1. Are you stupid, no. Gullible, scared and unwilling to make management manage their way out of this problem, yes

2.Vote LOA down, we might get let go. It seems you and our MEC chairman are unwilling to take a stand because you are scared of the ramifications. We arent guaranteed we would loose our job. Send it to the courts.

3. It's not the size of the plane, it's the size of the paycheck. What's wrong with flying props forever. The contract was strong and the pay is now better than B757 pay.

4. You do care or you would not have responded.

All Dennison did was fire a couple of people, shift a couple of current clowns around in Hoosierville, and whammo new management. There is still no plan except the codeshare. That's not a plan, it's a concept.
80% of you got duped. Wait til the next LOA comes in a couple months.

 

[TooBad]

I have two friends in management at UPS and their vision of the future included trucks that were double-crewed and ran at all hours of the day and night. The international stuff would be mostly line flown and the rest subbed out to the likes of Gemini and others. Both of these guys don't know each other, yet they both gave me this same opinion. According to them the "airline" (as they call UPS flight ops) is just too expensive.

I'm sure freight nazi will reply with some contract clause about scope but believe me if mgmnt wants that "airline" gone it will go.

What was UPS 4th Quarter profit last year?

 

[FreightNazi]

What was UPS 4th Quarter profit last year?

866 Million

 

[I.P. Freley]

At least FreightNazi's screen name is accurate.

His kind (formerly known as the Aryan race) are superior to all others (idiots who work for pax carriers) and he wants all the 121 supplementals (Menlo=Poland) to be sent to the gas chamber.

What a tool. Injecting yourself into a thread where ATA guys worry about their company making it into summer, pounding your chest about how great it is to be at UPS, is a major, major d1ck maneuver.

 

[Wesb737fo]

TZ,

You apparently have strong feelings about this and I do respect your opinion, however, you should respect others opinions. You say it's "about the size of the pay check". I say its about the people that I work with. NO amount of money could keep me at a job where I did not like or respect the people I work with.

Your assumption that 80% are "duped" and "scared" is an insult in my opinion. IF YOU REALLY BELIEVE THIS, where were you during the road shows to lead us into the light of your reality. I think you need to respect the opinions of those that voted yes and move on. Have you expressed this opinion to any of your Captains? (or FO's if you are a Captain)

Respectfully in disagreement

Wes

 

[Huck]

There is NO WAY that the hundreds of MBA's in Memphis and Atlanta/Louisville have missed the sea change in airline pilot pay and benefits in this country.

We'll be next in the barrel, my friend. And pensions will be agenda item #1. Those Haahvid types get up EVERY MORNING looking for ways to cut pilot costs. All us rock-ribbed Republicans croon about the Invisible Hand of the Free Market. It will lurch our way someday.

Take a good look at the Bush administration's promises to the EU about their second term and a US/EU bilateral agreement. Those A380's could very well be flown by foreign nationals through a european subsidiary - ask Atlas guys where all their BA flying went....

Pay off your house ... keep your first wife ... our time is coming....

 

[ThisistheDream]

I believe that HUCK statement is true. Whether or not you fly a 767, 757 at UPS or DAL or AA or UAL the view points of all the MGTS, is that your pay should be in comparission to your peers or other labor cost for the same type of work.

 

[FreightNazi]

I believe that HUCK statement is true. Whether or not you fly a 767, 757 at UPS or DAL or AA or UAL the view points of all the MGTS, is that your pay should be in comparission to your peers or other labor cost for the same type of work.

One small detail for UPS. UPS management has continually said that we are NOT an airline. This company makes nearly $4 BILLION in profit a year, why should we compare ourselves to the pax carriers? We are in a totally seperate business, you guys fly planes as your sole service, we fly planes as a relatively small ( although highly profitable ) part of a global transportation/logistice company. It's totally an apples to oranges comparison to think that UPS/FedEx should be compared to the pax carriers in terms of pay and benefits.

 

[atafan]

Man, did this thread get hijacked!

JD, I mean TZFO, all airlines have their 10% and you are a proud member.

If you are so convinced we are duped and screwed and have no faith in ATA or SWA please leave and don't spoil the reputation of the rest of the fine ATA pilots.

 

[Hose A. Jiminez]

Maybe the glory days of the passenger airlines, but definately not the large cargo airlines. FedEx, fat pension plan. UPS modest pension plan, soon to get much fatter!

"Glory" and "cargo airlines" should not be used in the same sentence.

 

[FreightNazi]

"Glory" and "cargo airlines" should not be used in the same sentence.

Maybe not, just replace "glory" with "profitable"!

 

[B73av8r]

FedEx, UPS - Here guys, go chat it up about raising the bar in - Cargo

 

[TZFO]

ATA LOA passes by 80%

Didnt mean to step on so many feet.

 

[atafan]

TZFO,

Reality.

You do not have a touch.
Every company in a the world has some .

 

[MLBWINGBORN]

Nazi..

Its like dating a woman that has cheated on every man shes been with.

You so hope that it wont happen to you..

But history has shown that sooner or later it will happen to you.

And no matter how much you want to believe it wont..

Sooner or later it will.

Its just a matter of time.

 

[FreightNazi]

Nazi..

Its like dating a woman that has cheated on every man shes been with.

You so hope that it wont happen to you..

But history has shown that sooner or later it will happen to you.

And no matter how much you want to believe it wont..

Sooner or later it will.

Its just a matter of time.

I NEVER said the either UPS or FedEx were immune from a downturn at sometime in the future. The point is that both UPS and FedEx are VERY profitable, and there is NOTHING on the horizon that SHOULD keep that from continuing. I don't know about FedEx, but at UPS since 9-11, while the pax carriers have been in the biggest slump in history, UPS has made record profits. UPS and i'm assuming FedEx does too, charges a fuel surcharge. I'd go out on a limb and say that the surcharge more than covers the fuel price increase, so that the higher the fuel price is the MORE money UPS makes.

You can turn your post back on yourself and say when is it SWA's turn? I'm fairly certain that I can say that SWA's turn will come long before UPS' or FedEx's.

 

[L10PILOT]

Listen. I'm not happy about giving 20% either. Nobody is. Remember, it isn't forever. But, if it will show the "new management" that we are in this together, then let's give it a shot. Given the fact that ATA almost closed their doors a few times over the past few months, the codeshare with SWA is a welcomed benefit. THEY know how to run an airline.