ASA "town hall" prediction

[Tailwind]

johnpeace, I don't know if you're currently on reserve, but in my experience NOBODY will back us up. Not the CPs, not the union(their motto is "fly it now, grieve it later.") You're basically telling us to just quit, and I have too many responsibilities right now, so that's not an option.

 

[johnpeace]

I would actually dare them to discipline me for refusing to work for no compensation. It wouldn't take more than 2 or 3 of us doing that for them to find a resolution.

 

[Tailwind]

Their reply is "it's not NO compensation, just not min day credit. And if you want min day credit then we will go back to not being able to split parings." At that point all of the senior line holders come out against the reserves, telling us to just man-up and take it.

I'll ask again, who is in our (the reserves) corner? The CPs? Alpa? Senior pilots? Junior pilots?
--crickets....crickets...---

 

[Freebrd]

And if you want min day credit then we will go back to not being able to split parings."

can't happen, it's in the LOA, sorry charley, contract is a contract, well, until it gets abused a little by asa, ok, a lot by asa

 

[ASACRJFlyer]

What would pay protection for reserves include?

As a reserve pilot, I'm presently pay protected by:
- MMG
- min day credit
- min-day credit for unused reserve days if I go over 75 hrs

What are you thinking?

And yeah, my biggest issues for the next contract are that we make it too expensive for crew utilization to be stupid, lazy and inefficient. I want to force them to either do their jobs half competently or pay through the nose for it.

I thought the same thing about this little gem in our contract. I thought I qualified for this one month only to find out that in reality, it works like this... Let's say you're credited at 95 hours for the month and blocked at 80. You also have two "unused reserve days" on your schedule for the month. I'm sure you're thinking, "In this case I would get min day times two added to the 95 hours of credit, resulting in a new credit for the month of ~102.7, right?"

WRONG!!! If your read the contract closely, the way it works is you take the two unused reserve days credit and add it to BLOCK (in our case, 80, resulting in a new total of ~87.7. Because 87.7 is less than your CREDIT of 95, those two unused reserve days earned you a grand total of... (wait for it...) ZERO, ZILCH, NADA, NOTHING!

Because of all of the soft credits we earn throught deadheads, min day, ect., this provision in the contract is practically worthless, as you will rarely, if ever, have enough unused reserve days to get the total of block plus this credit to take you over the credit you already have for the month.

Surely, this provision was intended as a deterrent to prevent scheduling from flying reserves over guarantee without consequence (and don't call me Shirley!) Instead, it became just another example of how switching one word in the language (block vs credit) renders the entire provision worthless and proof positive why we need concrete language in our next contract that actually delivers on what was intended in the first place.

 

[Medeco]

I would actually dare them to discipline me for refusing to work for no compensation. It wouldn't take more than 2 or 3 of us doing that for them to find a resolution.

How about you lead by example.

Easy to say on here...

 

[DHPFLYN]

Sad to see how management has you scared. Now I see why you agreed to such a $hitty contract.

 

[sunlitpath]

Sad to see how management has you scared. Now I see why you agreed to such a $hitty contract.

Yes, we are so scared; and you are so brave. Please show us the way, Obe-Wan Kenobi.

 

[johnpeace]

How about you lead by example.

Easy to say on here...

Deal. As soon as they give me the chance.

 

[Plainsman]

With Delter about to hire, there are alot of heads in the sand here.

 

[Medeco]

When you do, make sure you post the outcome on the ALPA board, so we all know how that worked out for you...

Insubordinate is a good way to get fired. When the CP tells you to accept the assignment and grieve it and you refuse, you can plan on some unpaid leave at the very least.

If that doesnt matter to you, by all means go for it.

Until "Delter" is hiring, its all talk. The world is a bit of a mess right now if you have not bothered to pay attention to current events.

 

[johnpeace]

Insubordinate is a good way to get fired. When the CP tells you to accept the assignment and grieve it and you refuse, you can plan on some unpaid leave at the very least.

If that doesnt matter to you, by all means go for it.

Why should I be bothered at the prospect of being disciplined by a job that doesn't even care to follow it's contract with me? If they're that blatant about this, do I still want to work here or has the line been crossed?

I'm chewing on that one...interested to see how this plays out.

(3) Minimum Day Credit Section 3 – Compensation
1 A reserve pilot will be paid and credited the greater of paragraphs (3)(a)
2 or (3)(b) below.
3 (a) Three (3) hours and forty-five (45) minutes of credit for each
4 calendar day of duty and/or calendar day away from domicile. This
5 provision will not apply to time spent in training (not including OE)
6 and CDOs; or
7 (b) Four (4) hours of credit for each ready reserve assignment.

This is fairly clear.

Is there a provision somewhere else that explicitly grants the company the discretion to remove min day credit from a pairing? Or did they just make that up out of thin air (like they did red-arrow days)?

Doesn't anyone have the sack to refuse to be bound by non-contractual language that was just invented out of thin air?

What if they told you they're just not going to pay you for a week? Would you show up and fly and 'grieve it'?

Geez...I guess I think too much of most of you.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Johnpeace you are wrong yet again...Please follow thru on your threat...

 

[johnpeace]

Johnpeace you are wrong yet again...Please follow thru on your threat...

Can you elaborate? Please explain how...

I'm not an attorney, I'm doing the best I can to get the meaning from the contract.

If I'm wrong, so be it...that's great. In that case I guess I'll suck it up. Can you show me how I'm wrong?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Can you elaborate? Please explain how...

I'm not an attorney, I'm doing the best I can to get the meaning from the contract.

If I'm wrong, so be it...that's great. In that case I guess I'll suck it up. Can you show me how I'm wrong?

With your attitude I'd rather just watch you jump off the cliff...

 

[johnpeace]

With your attitude I'd rather just watch you jump off the cliff...

Awesome leadership, captain. Your reputation befits you I see.

My attitude is wanting to hold a line instead of living in a constant state of retreat like some coward.

 

[Redan]

With your attitude I'd rather just watch you jump off the cliff...

Thank you for the typical comment! For those viewers at home who have forgotten about our beloved Jumpin' Joey, here's your convenient reminder. And we expect his boy 777forever (Little Joe) to weigh in at any moment. So don't touch that dial and stay tuned for more entertainment to come!

 

[JoeMerchant]

Awesome leadership, captain. Your reputation befits you I see.

My attitude is wanting to hold a line instead of living in a constant state of retreat like some coward.

You seem to know everything about everything and you have it all figured it out....Show me the leadership oh wise one and lead your charge up that hill....Maybe you can teach me something....

 

[Medeco]

I'll help.

The ONLY assignment you can refuse is one that is FAA illegal. If it is contractual, you must follow the process in place.

From a legal standpoint, the company has a right to conduct business.

You also have a right to say no, but then the company has every right to discipline you how they see fit.

END.

 

[johnpeace]

I'll help.

The ONLY assignment you can refuse is one that is FAA illegal. If it is contractual, you must follow the process in place.

From a legal standpoint, the company has a right to conduct business.

You also have a right to say no, but then the company has every right to discipline you how they see fit.

END.

I don't get it...what's the point of a labor contract if one party can arbitrarily violate it at will?