ASA pilot surplus...

[Goose Egg]

I think it's funny how some of these same guys talked about pilot unity during the ALPA drive here but now they're quick to toss aside their fellow pilots when it effects their pockets. But this is everywhere; in every airline you'll have pilots like this, union or non-union. Everyone talks tough but in the end it's about ourselves, right?

Ain't that the truth! Is there any room left under the bus? And the same ones that rail the hardest for "unity" are usually the worst bus-throwers out there. I see how they are: Unity when it benefits them. I wake up in cold sweats during the night worried about turning into one of these types!

-Goose

 

[JumpersAway]

Wow, a furlough is less painful than sitting around a crash pad making min guarantee. At least you can work at Mcdonalds and make more out in the real world.

Correct me if I'm wrong- but could you not just arrange your own furlough through a COLA bid over the next few months. They're practically begging people to take them. Why not do it and then snag another job for a few months at Best Buy?

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Has there been any word of guys asking for a COMA line and being turned down?

 

[Texx]

I hate to say it but I heard a few senior captains make the same statement the other day while I was sitting RR at ASA.

And just the other day I heard some FOs talking about how the senior pilots need to retire so they can upgrade.

It works both ways. It's become the "all about me" culture.

 

[blesko]

...to get an upgrade and go where? Some fail to realize that they have yet to pay their dues, and their life is a fast track to the left seat; and now it comes time to pay them. If you're junior, you run that risk, the industry has been like this for decades. Those that haven't studied this industy and career profession, try reading a book called "Hard Landing."

Luckily, I've never been through a furlough, but I believe (no kool aid here) that BH has this companys' best interests in mind (relatively speaking). Not expecting anything good or bad......yet.

If you're in the bottom 10% of any list, start looking, Get a CFI if you dont have one - if you choose to fly. Learn something. Work on another degree. Unity works well during a contract, for the mere fact that each member MAY receive something in it for them. Unity when it comes time to furlough, doesn't exist.

 

[Papa Woody]

Unity doesn't exist, period.

It's the appearance of unity that drives altruistic behavior, but when your ass is on the line, it's every man for himself.

 

[SSDD]

Ain't that the truth! Is there any room left under the bus? And the same ones that rail the hardest for "unity" are usually the worst bus-throwers out there. I see how they are: Unity when it benefits them. I wake up in cold sweats during the night worried about turning into one of these types!

-Goose

Although I agree with the company's policy of avoiding a furlough, there is a lesson to be learned. Unity is about helping each other, you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours.

A few months ago a lot of the junior guys thought their generation was God's gift to world. A jet job, quick upgrade, and then on to a major. Who wants to hang out with these senior losers? Who needs a union? Then, reality hits! Now they want help from those same losers, and the senior guys are thinking; if they would have helped during the union drive, we may be a little more inclined to help during these time, but as it is...

Not saying its right, but I understand how they feel.

 

[Goose Egg]

Although I agree with the company's policy of avoiding a furlough, there is a lesson to be learned. Unity is about helping each other, you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours.

A few months ago a lot of the junior guys thought their generation was God's gift to world. A jet job, quick upgrade, and then on to a major. Who wants to hang out with these senior losers? Who needs a union? Then, reality hits! Now they want help from those same losers, and the senior guys are thinking; if they would have helped during the union drive, we may be a little more inclined to help during these time, but as it is...

Not saying its right, but I understand how they feel.

Good point.

It seemed like in my class, everyone was pretty down-to-earth. It might have been due to the fact that we didn't yet have "jet jobs." ( My bid is in though. ) We just missed the cut-off to vote last year also. (I'd personally like to see a 'real' union on the property... just not ALPA... But I digress.) And if I had been expecting a quick upgrade, I'm certainly no longer doing so!

But the point is well taken. It should be a "I'll scratch your back if you scratch mine." I can understand where those senior guys are coming from--not saying that I agree with them, or even that their logic is valid (because some of them seem to assume that the decision to furlough or not is their decision, and that's simply not the case), but gosh, wouldn't be nice if there actually was some real unity in the world? I mean, I think our company gets a bad rap because we voted down the union, but looking around at other regional carriers, I don't really see any appreciable difference in what I would consider "real unity."

Anyway, /rant.

-Goose

 

[JoeMerchant]

Anyone who thinks there is TRUE "brotherhood" in this business.....isn't paying attention.....

USAPA/AWA/AAA, DAL/NWA, AA/TWA, Regional vs. Mainline, Age 60 pro/con, saving retirement vs. furlough, senior vs. junior, and the General vs everyone.......

 

[jegermeister]

Is there a "NO FURLOUGH" Clause in the ASA contract???

Yes there is a no furlough clause. But it only protects the people that signed the contract last year. Any new hire since then isn't covered.

If I remember correctly, there are about 150 f/o's unprotected. There are also contingencies the company can use to furlough those on the protected list.

I would think that the company is waiting for the holidays to pass before they cut anyone loose.

 

[SSDD]

Brad came over to ASA with the Skywest philosophy. I don't believe he'll furlough anybody unless there is no other option.

 

[USCtrojan]

Brad came over to ASA with the Skywest philosophy. I don't believe he'll furlough anybody unless there is no other option.

Especially since there is still attrition to SWA and some International Carriers. + Coma lines as well.

Trojan

 

[Erlanger]

Anyone who thinks there is TRUE "brotherhood" in this business.....isn't paying attention.....

USAPA/AWA/AAA, DAL/NWA, AA/TWA, Regional vs. Mainline, Age 60 pro/con, saving retirement vs. furlough, senior vs. junior, and the General vs everyone.......

LOL! I thought that was funny. Hopefully the General has a sense of humor too.

 

[McNugent]

APC says SKYW is to receive 9 more 900's starting Oct. 25th. If they want to keep the ASA people happy and moral where it is, they should just let us have those planes in ATL. We have the pilots, and the program is all but certified. Pilots could be in the planes within 2 weeks. It would definitely help with the "surplus".

I'm sure the responses to this could get interesting...

 

[Goose Egg]

APC says SKYW is to receive 9 more 900's starting Oct. 25th. If they want to keep the ASA people happy and moral where it is, they should just let us have those planes in ATL. We have the pilots, and the program is all but certified. Pilots could be in the planes within 2 weeks. It would definitely help with the "surplus".

I'm sure the responses to this could get interesting...

Well, nothing 'interesting' here, but I think it was anounced over a year ago that those 900's are E120 replacements. You know, fwiw.

I mean, don't get me wrong here--SKW isn't running any jet classes right now, so it's effectively a transfer of flying away from EMB crews. So at least in the very short term, I'd be just as happy to see those 900s go to ASA.

(But in the long term, I'm a lot smarter than that.)

-Goose

 

[Erlanger]

Well, nothing 'interesting' here, but I think it was anounced over a year ago that those 900's are E120 replacements. You know, fwiw.

I mean, don't get me wrong here--SKW isn't running any jet classes right now, so it's effectively a transfer of flying away from EMB crews. So at least in the very short term, I'd be just as happy to see those 900s go to ASA.

(But in the long term, I'm a lot smarter than that.)

-Goose

Skywest recently had all the pilots and flight attendants complete overwater training and what 900s we have, are now all outfitted with Caribbean flying performance and info cards in the airplanes but nothing officially announced by the company.

 

[McNugent]

Well, nothing 'interesting' here, but I think it was anounced over a year ago that those 900's are E120 replacements. You know, fwiw.

I mean, don't get me wrong here--SKW isn't running any jet classes right now, so it's effectively a transfer of flying away from EMB crews. So at least in the very short term, I'd be just as happy to see those 900s go to ASA.

(But in the long term, I'm a lot smarter than that.)

-Goose

So what if they are replacing the Brazilias, that doesn't mean a whole lot. How fast are the Brazilias leaving your fleet? ASA was supposed to get rid of the ATR's like 5 years ago, every year mgmt. swore they'd be gone by years end. They are finally being drawn down to be gone by Dec. AND we have nothing to replace our ATR fleet.

Also, Skyw. had no problem taking ASA 700's a couple years ago. Maybe there could be a shift of flying comming our way. Sure would be a nice change. If we really are 300 pilots fat, thats a lot of paychecks going out that don't need to be.

I'm guessing those guys are being kept for a reason, and it's not out of the goodness of Brads' heart.

 

[McNugent]

Skywest recently had all the pilots and flight attendants complete overwater training and what 900s we have, are now all outfitted with Caribbean flying performance and info cards in the airplanes but nothing officially announced by the company.

ASA's been doing that on our 700's for years now. I wouldn't read too much into that...

 

[Erlanger]

ASA's been doing that on our 700's for years now. I wouldn't read too much into that...

Doesn't ASA already fly to the Caribbean and points in Central America? Skywest doesn't fly to any of these places. Why would Skywest complete overwater certification and training unless it planned on new flying to these places. That's my point. Maybe they intend to, with the new 900s to arrive. Skywest doesn't do things just for the heck of it and to have this stuff in the cockpit unless it was planning on something.

 

[blesko]

naw, DL gave all that stuff to shuttle america

 

[erikgigem]

naw, DL gave all that stuff to shuttle america

Then DL gave all shuttle america stuff to Pinnacle. Round and round it goes. who flys what this month - nobody knows!!

 

[JumpersAway]

All I know is that morale at ASA is pretty good, although some fear the future. But all in all, I'd say most everyone is on board with the company's direcetion and incentives. However, watch the wheels fall off if SkyWest drops some more 900's into the Atlanta system to do Carib flying that is done by ASA 200's and 700's.

What is the deal with SkyWest and the 20 CRJ's that MidEx are dumping? Are they going back to the United and Delta feeder system?

 

[ePilot22]

What is the deal with SkyWest and the 20 CRJ's that MidEx are dumping? Are they going back to the United and Delta feeder system?

11 of them are back in generic SkyWest colors to be used a spares for either carrier.


9 are still flying for MidWest.





eP.

 

[McNugent]

All I know is that morale at ASA is pretty good, although some fear the future. But all in all, I'd say most everyone is on board with the company's direcetion and incentives. However, watch the wheels fall off if SkyWest drops some more 900's into the Atlanta system to do Carib flying that is done by ASA 200's and 700's.

That's what I'm getting at. Right now things are pretty good. But Brad's weekly "RA RA you guys are great" messages will only last so long. So far he's walked the walk. But like you said, if we see more OO influence in ATL while we sit on the sidelines and shrink, morale is going to tank. It's bad enough watching 9E get bigger in our back yard.

It's just my opinion but if SKYW management wants to see how far ASA can go, then keep us motivated by rewarding our efforts.

Let ASA do the 900 flying in ATL, and SKYW do it out west. With those 9 900's comming this month, I think it would be a pretty smart move on their part.

 

[WalterSobchak]

11 of them are back in generic SkyWest colors to be used a spares for either carrier.

I <3 Generic Spares.

 

[SSDD]

How do you see more SKW influence in ATL? At one point we had 12 900's based there, for the last year or so its been down to just 5.

BTW I'm just repeating what I've heard, but unless there's a MAJOR award in 900 flying, ASA is not in the game. These 900s have already been allocated.

I wish some of this flying was coming to ASA/SKW, but with the merger, our stock has fallen in DL's eyes.

 

[JettBoii]

We are all Delta's Bioooccchhhhh.

 

[Tarzan]

Hold on tight guys. There WAS a reason for ASA to hold on to those folks. It does not exist any more. But DL could change their minds....... Again.

 

[av8rbama]

Has there been any word of guys asking for a COMA line and being turned down?

Yes. I bid on it for Sept, Oct, and Nov and only awarded in Oct.

I am post-contract.

 

[WalterSobchak]

Well, nothing 'interesting' here, but I think it was anounced over a year ago that those 900's are E120 replacements. You know, fwiw.

The 700's are kinda-sorta E120 replacements on the UAX side. IIRC, the 900's are part of CRJ2 replacements.

With DL, everything changes by the week...so, who knows.