ASA, DAL almost collide in ATL

[Speedtape]

Not sure, but turning on the taxi and/or landing lights while in position aren't going to do much to stop a plane approaching you from behind.

You are correct. However, at LA, somehow the metro that was holding in position was forgotten by ATC. In the aftermath, it was decided, in the future, that an a/c that was in position and hold should turn on all his lights so that it would be more visible from the Tower. It had nothing to do with the approaching a/c on final.

I have not been in the LA tower, but I can imagine that at night, that without high visibility, small aircraft could easily fade into all the other lights at that airport. This issue brought about that change. In addition, it seems that ATC subsequently was mandated to issue information to a/c on approach in the landing clearance, "Anyplane123 cleared to land R/W 27R, a B787 is holding in position for T/0 prior to your arrival."

It's my recollection that this accident happened late at night and in a low activity time period. LA, not unlike most large airports, works with reduced staffs because of reduced demand during these time periods. In addition, many times available runways are reduced to accomodate the lower activity and staffing. Many times this is when R/W inspections may occur. It poses it's own set of concerns and procedures.

 

[Speedtape]

Atl pilot,

It appears that you may be with ATC. If so, thanks for joining in and adding meaningful dialogue and insight. Since 9/11, it is nearly impossible to visit Tracon or the Tower. Those visits were always meaninful visits for me and to clear up misconceptions when I did not have the "Big Picture." It is quite helpful to know what Tracon knows and expects in the approach and departure process. It could make all our jobs (pilots and ATC) easier and more efficient.

Perhaps, other methods of interaction with ATC should be explored in addition to this forum to provide education, build trust, and cooperation between our work groups. Most pilots do not have a clue as to what you and your fellow workers do everyday with limited resources and technology that is just about as old as the electrical outlet.

Thank you for participating,

Everypilot

 

[John Pennekamp]

John,
When we first started doing this monitor stuff, I too, was really skeptical. However, for the most part - it works well. You'd be surprised. The frequency congestion (espicially on 119.3/Rwy 27L.9R), when we have monitored approaches (meaning there is a final monitor and a Tower controller sharing the same frequency), plus having you PROFESSIONAL PILOTS (b/c you are professionals we can almost consistantly know that you're gonna be where you need to be when instructed to do so) check in, didn't really work. There was simply not enough time and space for everyone to get what they needed to say in without continuly stepping on one another. The monitor instruction has proven to work far better than I imagined or argued when it was first attempted. In an effort to try and somehat standardize the procedure, its just been extended to the whole process, rather than one position. Once we got the locals trained, it really has become an efficient operation - and btw, I NEVER thought that I would say that in the beginning. I was very much an advocate of the everybody checks in policy. But I was wrong. On the large scale there are really very few folks who are not on the right freq awaiting their next clearanace...some, but not many. Hope that answers your question!

Thanks for the info and the very insightful discussion. It's good to hear the perspective of the other side.