ASA and glass time?

[Oakum_Boy]

10 Hours In A C172 G1000........ $4000

Intrest Owed After Putting $4000 On Your Credit Card..... $3000

Being Assigned The Atr In Newhire Class After All That..... Priceless!

Complaining to the Director of Operations you are young, hip, and should be flying a jet.....


How much for that?

 

[PositionandHold]

10 Hours In A C172 G1000........ $4000

Intrest Owed After Putting $4000 On Your Credit Card..... $3000

Being Assigned The Atr In Newhire Class After All That..... Priceless!

That is priceless.

I wasn't exactly happy about getting the ATR, but it wasn't because of the airplane--it's one of the more superior turboprops around and actually a joy to fly--it was because of the routes (Macon, GA 5 times a day, anyone?) and the fact that ASA is getting rid of the plane soon, which would force me to go through groundschool all over again just to be an F/O again.

But whatever. 2 years ago, I'd have been lucky to get on anywhere with 1,000 hours.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Complaining to the Director of Operations you are young, hip, and should be flying a jet.....


How much for that?

On top of that, he can't fly and he can't talk on the radio.... I wouldn't solo him in a 152.....

This "entitlement" attitude of people who can't fly has to stop.....

 

[John Pennekamp]

That is priceless.

I wasn't exactly happy about getting the ATR, but it wasn't because of the airplane--it's one of the more superior turboprops around and actually a joy to fly--it was because of the routes (Macon, GA 5 times a day, anyone?) and the fact that ASA is getting rid of the plane soon, which would force me to go through groundschool all over again just to be an F/O again.

But whatever. 2 years ago, I'd have been lucky to get on anywhere with 1,000 hours.

If you need help figuring out how to bid the jet, find me in the crew lounge, and I'll show you. You'll love going to Des Moines, Iowa 5 times a day. Oooh, and that 33 hour Omaha overnight on the weekends. Yee-haw!

Meanwhile, I'm enjoying my overnights in Hilton Head and Myrtle Beach every week. Even if it took me 6 legs and 12 hours to get there. The bars are open late and the beach is open early.

 

[labbats]

If you need help figuring out how to bid the jet, find me in the crew lounge, and I'll show you. You'll love going to Des Moines, Iowa 5 times a day. Oooh, and that 33 hour Omaha overnight on the weekends. Yee-haw!

Meanwhile, I'm enjoying my overnights in Hilton Head and Myrtle Beach every week. Even if it took me 6 legs and 12 hours to get there. The bars are open late and the beach is open early.

Downtown Omaha for 33 hours actually sounds pretty cool. We stay downtown at the Hilton Gardens and can walk anywhere. Where does ASA stay?

 

[CFI2766]

If you need help figuring out how to bid the jet, find me in the crew lounge, and I'll show you. You'll love going to Des Moines, Iowa 5 times a day. Oooh, and that 33 hour Omaha overnight on the weekends. Yee-haw!

Meanwhile, I'm enjoying my overnights in Hilton Head and Myrtle Beach every week. Even if it took me 6 legs and 12 hours to get there. The bars are open late and the beach is open early.

I've found a good bar within walking distance of the Palace Westin. It's about a 10 minute walk south on the beach, but well worth it. Ask me for details, but let's just say the the bartender now LOVES ATR crews.

 

[CFI2766]

I got the call from ASA today and they said I need some glass time. Do you know if a 172 with the G1000 would work as the glass time or does it need to be some jet course? I would'nt mind going out and flying a 172 around, but I am not paying for a jet class!!

Thanks

Yes, the G1000 or the Cirrus Avidyne system would suffice. FWIW, I don't think it's a requirement. However, it does lower your tt minimums that they want to see before they will interview you.

I had 500 hours of the Cirrus version of glass time and nearly 400 hours of G1000 time when I went through the interview process in the summer of '06. I spent maybe 30 seconds on MEI/Multi-Engine stuff and easily 30 minutes on Cirrus stuff during the interview. The interviewers were a LOT more interested in the glass time than the multi time.

 

[John Pennekamp]

I've found a good bar within walking distance of the Palace Westin. It's about a 10 minute walk south on the beach, but well worth it. Ask me for details, but let's just say the the bartender now LOVES ATR crews.

You mean the tiki bar? I went there the first week we went to HHI.

 

[CAVOK69]

You are absolutely right. That's the changing face of aviation now....It's like getting an MPL instead of a traditional pvt, inst, comm. God help these new kids coming into aviation.

At what point do you stop pretending as if his ratings were just handed to him? Does the fact that some of the newer, low time pilots jump from a 172 to an RJ make you angry? If I had the opportunity to go to an RJ at 300 hours I would have jumped on it. Sadly, I did not. I just think a little faith in the future of aviation would be appreciated. It is up to you regional captains to make sure these green FO's become the Aviators they should be. It may not be what you want to do, but when the company puts an FO with less than 1000 hours in the cockpit, there is no way around it.

 

[CFI2766]

You mean the tiki bar? I went there the first week we went to HHI.

No, the tiki bar is closed for the season.

http://www.kingswharf.com/

This is more of an indoor, traditional bar. There is a restaurant attached with much more attractive prices than the Palace Westin. It is part of the same complex, however.

 

[John Pennekamp]

No, the tiki bar is closed for the season.

http://www.kingswharf.com/

This is more of an indoor, traditional bar. There is a restaurant attached with much more attractive prices than the Palace Westin. It is part of the same complex, however.

Sweet. I'll check it out.

 

[JoeMerchant]

At what point do you stop pretending as if his ratings were just handed to him? Does the fact that some of the newer, low time pilots jump from a 172 to an RJ make you angry? If I had the opportunity to go to an RJ at 300 hours I would have jumped on it. Sadly, I did not. I just think a little faith in the future of aviation would be appreciated. It is up to you regional captains to make sure these green FO's become the Aviators they should be. It may not be what you want to do, but when the company puts an FO with less than 1000 hours in the cockpit, there is no way around it.

1. It is clear that some of these ratings were handed out at the puppy farms..... sorry if the truth hurts, but from the left seat I am absolutely amazed at what I am seeing.... It is both a collective bargaining issue and a safety issue.....

2. The HE!! it is my job to teach a 121 FO how to fly an airplane..... It is my job to transport people safely.... mainly me..... and to not get violated.... This is not a flight school.... If you can't fly, then you can talk on the radio and you be written up for not being able to fly... If you can't fly, then you should consider that before you take advantage of the current situation....

 

[John Pennekamp]

1. It is clear that some of these ratings were handed out at the puppy farms..... sorry if the truth hurts, but from the left seat I am absolutely amazed at what I am seeing.... It is both a collective bargaining issue and a safety issue.....

2. The HE!! it is my job to teach a 121 FO how to fly an airplane..... It is my job to transport people safely.... mainly me..... and to not get violated.... This is not a flight school.... If you can't fly, then you can talk on the radio and you be written up for not being able to fly... If you can't fly, then you should consider that before you take advantage of the current situation....

I'm going to have to go ahead and agree with Joe on this one. It's not my job to teach someone how to fly. It is my job to teach someone how to be a good captain at ASA. But they must possess a basic foundation of skills before they arrive. This simply isn't happening.

I've had new hires that CAN NOT fly a visual approach. I had a new hire try to turn the wrong way on the localizer in ATL. I've been 100% single pilot when a newhire froze up on me. This is scary stuff to encounter at a 121 airline.

I don't expect my newhire FO to fly like a veteran, but I do expect him/her to have some basic skills. I'm not seeing it lately, and I blame the industry for allowing the standards to become too low.

 

[CFI2766]

1. It is clear that some of these ratings were handed out at the puppy farms..... sorry if the truth hurts, but from the left seat I am absolutely amazed at what I am seeing.... It is both a collective bargaining issue and a safety issue.....

2. The HE!! it is my job to teach a 121 FO how to fly an airplane..... It is my job to transport people safely.... mainly me..... and to not get violated.... This is not a flight school.... If you can't fly, then you can talk on the radio and you be written up for not being able to fly... If you can't fly, then you should consider that before you take advantage of the current situation....

It is not the job of the regional airline captain to teach the new folks how to fly. Share some things that they've learned along the way, yes. To teach someone who had their ratings pencil-whipped basic VFR and IFR airmanship, however, is not what they are paid to do. The training department folks are paid good money to produce a qualified FO.

I think it should be a requirement that you have your ATP before you get on with a regional. Economically, though, it ain't gonna happen in the current hiring environment.

 

[John Pennekamp]

It is not the job of the regional airline captain to teach the new folks how to fly. Share some things that they've learned along the way, yes. To teach someone who had their ratings pencil-whipped basic VFR and IFR airmanship, however, is not what they are paid to do. The training department folks are paid good money to produce a qualified FO.

They're also paid to weed out those that just don't get it. Too often, they feel pressure to move people along, hoping they'll "learn it on the line". These pilots should not be coming out of the training department.

I think it should be a requirement that you have your ATP before you get on with a regional. Economically, though, it ain't gonna happen in the current hiring environment.

Agreed! Back to the AMA debate. ALPA needs to pressure the F'in-AA to set some minimum entry standards into the industry!

 

[CFI2766]

Didn't mean to single out the training folks. I think that with what they are given, they are doing the best they can. My gut feeling tells me that they have marching orders, expressed or otherwise, to produce warm bodies for the right seat.

(In fact, I know of a couple of instances where the ATR guys went well above and beyond the syllabus to help out a new-hire that had the right attitude.)

I do agree that it is well past the time for the Feds to set some sort of entry requirements. It's gonna take blood to make this happen, however.

 

[Caveman]

Yep, all you guys shot out of the womb doing inverted single engine NDB approaches with the other engine on fire. Gimme a break. If someone has spent the time, money and effort to pass a private pilot checkride, an instrument checkride, a multiengine checkride, a commercial checkride, at least one CFI checkride, and 121 training they can fly. Maybe not to your holier than thou standard, but they can fly. Give them break and start helping them improve instead of pontificating from the Chuck Yeager Throne of Superior Airmanship.

My experience has been that even the greenest FNG will be doing a pretty good job after about a month of regular line flying. Quit yer bitching and look out for the new guys. I'd love to hear some of the comments from your Captains when you were new too. It probably wasn't any better or worse than what you guys are whining about. Jeez, we all had to start somewhere.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Yep, all you guys shot out of the womb doing inverted single engine NDB approaches with the other engine on fire. Gimme a break. If someone has spent the time, money and effort to pass a private pilot checkride, an instrument checkride, a multiengine checkride, a commercial checkride, at least one CFI checkride, and 121 training they can fly. Maybe not to your holier than thou standard, but they can fly. Give them break and start helping them improve instead of pontificating from the Chuck Yeager Throne of Superior Airmanship.

My experience has been that even the greenest FNG will be doing a pretty good job after about a month of regular line flying. Quit yer bitching and look out for the new guys. I'd love to hear some of the comments from your Captains when you were new too. It probably wasn't any better or worse than what you guys are whining about. Jeez, we all had to start somewhere.

1. I'm no Chuck Yeager.

2. I'm not talking about pilots fresh off IOE. I'm talking about pilots with up to 6 months of line flying

3. If you've flown with one you'd understand. Clearly you haven't.

4. Many only have the basics, Comm ME, not CFI or any other advanced certificates.

5. I was way better as a new hire. I had to be. In order to get hired you had to have significant time. I had 1500 hours and 250 ME to get my first airline job. A lot of that came from instruction. Instruction teaches you more about flying than it teaches the student. It's a lost art these days.

 

[CAVOK69]

I never said, teach them to fly an airplane. I said help them become the aviators they should be. Teach them to be a good First Officer, to think like a captain, and conduct themselves as a professional pilot.

If the FOs cannot fly a basic visual approach or speak on the radios, then that is another problem. But I'd be willing to bet that if I put you in an MD-11 or an airbus, your visual approach wouldn't be that pretty either.

I guess Im just not all doom and gloom about the current situation with new pilots. This industry is very cyclical and I'm sure in the future the hiring of <1000 hours will stop.

 

[John Pennekamp]

I'd be willing to bet that if I put you in an MD-11 or an airbus, your visual approach wouldn't be that pretty either.

I disagree. By the completion of IOE you should possess these basic skills.