Arrivals into Mem

[quartermile]

well, just a few. you know who.

Do you really want to work with "Its weefr so I dont care if you go to Denwer". I know I would just for the entertainment value.

 

[ss9e]

Do you really want to work with "Its weefr so I dont care if you go to Denwer". I know I would just for the entertainment value.

hell yeah i want to work with "today's code word is Wenus. Wictor echo noWember uniform sierra." we could jumpseat to las Wegas or maybe the Wirgin islands.

 

[homerjdispatch]

Sorry but Artic flier is right...

no, i won't ease up a bit. my flight explorer updates about every 15 seconds. so i would say that it's pretty much real time. i happen to dispatch for fedex and i know how much the crews rely on us to get them through weather domestically. i pretty much stay in constant contact with my flights updating them. also, dispatchers have long range radar capabilities. what's the range of the radar onboard the a/c? as previously stated, we are a team. pilots CAN'T do their jobs without dispatchers and atc.

Your flight explorer and assosiated wx may update every 15 seconds, but its not real time. Time to chill. i am sure AF appreciates what dispatch does for him, but stitting up front, he has a better view of real time cells developing right in front of the aircraft.

For long range flight planning, yeah you are right. We are a team, but every team has a captain right?

 

[ArcticFlier]

what's the range of the radar onboard the a/c?

From 5 to 320 miles.................works pretty well too. Pretty far, wouldn't you agree?



AF

 

[propsarebest]

Flight Explorer updates the WX and traffic evrey 15 seconds, but the info from the FAA and NOAA are BOTH 12-25 minutes old. Period.

At Fedex, you see the SAME info that us piddly little regionals see.

 

[CRJDispatchKid]

From 5 to 320 miles.................works pretty well too. Pretty far, wouldn't you agree?



AF

The radar range for your aircraft may be 320NM, but I would bet the quality of radar imagery anywhere past 50NM is poor, at best. The attenuation on an x-band, flat-plate (phased array) weather radar would be horrific if you had any precip directly in front of the radar. Even in light precipitation, serious degradation of the penetrating power of the radar occurs when the radome gets wet.

National weather service Doppler Radars (WSR-88D's / NEXRADS...whatever you want to call em) only have a short-range base reflectivity range of about 80NM in light precipitation and 124NM in the heaviest precipitations. Long-range reflectivity can reach up to 240NM. This all coming from a radar dish with a 28 foot diameter! No nosecone on an aircraft is that big.

Certainly, I wouldn't put a whole lot of faith on my airborne weather radar much past 50NM or so. Stay in contact with your dispatcher and/or ATC.

 

[flyjumpseat]

no, i won't ease up a bit. my flight explorer updates about every 15 seconds. so i would say that it's pretty much real time. i happen to dispatch for fedex and i know how much the crews rely on us to get them through weather domestically. i pretty much stay in constant contact with my flights updating them. also, dispatchers have long range radar capabilities. what's the range of the radar onboard the a/c? as previously stated, we are a team. pilots CAN'T do their jobs without dispatchers and atc.

My screen refreshes at 60 hz (or 60 times per second) but that doesn't mean the information is more accurate than the 15 minute update weather fed to Flight Explorer. It's just updating the old weather. 15 minute old weather is close enough for a 100 sm maybe even 50sm look ahead - but any closer than that it'd be just a good estimation. Aircraft radar is real time.

If your Flight Explorer is providing you with real time weather, I'd like to know who your weather provider is so we can change ours.

 

[ArcticFlier]

The radar range for your aircraft may be 320NM, but I would bet the quality of radar imagery anywhere past 50NM is poor, at best. The attenuation on an x-band, flat-plate (phased array) weather radar would be horrific if you had any precip directly in front of the radar. Even in light precipitation, serious degradation of the penetrating power of the radar occurs when the radome gets wet.

National weather service Doppler Radars (WSR-88D's / NEXRADS...whatever you want to call em) only have a short-range base reflectivity range of about 80NM in light precipitation and 124NM in the heaviest precipitations. Long-range reflectivity can reach up to 240NM. This all coming from a radar dish with a 28 foot diameter! No nosecone on an aircraft is that big.

Certainly, I wouldn't put a whole lot of faith on my airborne weather radar much past 50NM or so. Stay in contact with your dispatcher and/or ATC.

He asked what the range was. I gave it to him. He didn't ask about quality, but I will say this: I've been doing this for over 15 years, and I have yet to even so much as scare myself with a thunderstorm. Not once did I get direction from dispatch. ATC yes, my cohort in the cockpit, yes, my own experience, yes.

I know this is a team effort, but geez.


AF

 

[CRJDispatchKid]

I wasn't bashing your onboard weather radar at all; as airborne radar is an important piece of equipment (so important, it can't be deferred for 121 operations when conditions are expected). I'm pointing out that it alone can't always be relied on, just like a dispatchers ASD can't always be relied on alone. When resources are pooled together, a safer operation takes place.

 

[405]

Not once did I get direction from dispatch.

You have never gotten an advisory from a dispatcher for TS enroute?

Maybe I'm doing too much advising crews of weather when I'm at work. I'll be sure to stop that when I go back. That'll lighten the load a bit.

 

[flyjumpseat]

Yeah AF,
I'm disappointed you'd say that.

Okay, maybe I watch the forecasts and route AROUND the TS areas rather than flight planning through 'em.

Safety first. Stay out of TS. TS not good.

 

[ss9e]

Flight Explorer updates the WX and traffic evrey 15 seconds, but the info from the FAA and NOAA are BOTH 12-25 minutes old. Period.

At Fedex, you see the SAME info that us piddly little regionals see.

i wanted to get my facts straight before i responded. the a/c positions that are fed into our flight explorer are less than 1 minute old. the weather fed into the flight explorer is 5-15 minutes old. however, the local noaa radar sites publish new images every 4-8 minutes. so the information that dispatchers have is near real time. i understand that we can't give the pilots a 100% accurate picture of what's going on. but, we are pretty close. we certainly can give a better picture of what's going on long range versus the onboard radar. the dispatchers and atc are the pilots best external resource.

 

[ss9e]

Not once did I get direction from dispatch. ATC yes, my cohort in the cockpit, yes, my own experience, yes.

so i guess it's release 'em and forget 'em where you fly.

 

[homerjdispatch]

so i guess it's release 'em and forget 'em where you fly.

No, its not. I'm not sure why AF would say that. Maybe he doesn't fly in the DEN or ORD systems, where our dispatchers are constantly rerouting flights, updating crews via acars of weather ahead of them, and trying to brief as much as possible before departures. Or, maybe, AF has had dispatchers, who for the most part, have done a good bit of pre-flight planning and tried to keep him out of those areas. Or, maybe, AF meant that his enroute deviations, are due to what he sees out the window.

AF, If you have never had a dispatcher give you any direction on enroute WX, I can only say I'm sorry. Thats not the norm in here. (I'm sure you know that.) Please PM me if you want to discuss it further.


homer

 

[ArcticFlier]

You have never gotten an advisory from a dispatcher for TS enroute?

No.......but then I avoid the ORD system. DEN is a different story.

so i guess it's release 'em and forget 'em where you fly.

Wrong and you know that, but I'll let our dispatchers answer that one, as they have more credibility than I would on that one.

Seems to me (or this is the way I interpreted this thread) that this was about reroutes after the flight has dispatched. I may be wrong but that was my understanding. Have I gotten a filed (and cleared) route that was different than the norm? You bet, and I thank our dispatchers wholeheartedly for that, but that's not how this thread started (to be redundant). The tone of this thread turned to 'it was dispatch and ATC that got those guys through to MEM. Not the pilots.' I have to disagree wholeheartedly, based on 15+ years of personal experience.

This is the quote that set me off:

you arrogant @$$hole. do you really think pilots navigated their way through those storms? it's a team effort. contrary to popular pilot belief, you need dispatchers. we are your best external resource for weather information. besides i think that most of the credit for this goes to atc. or can you go without them too?

BTW, I don't agree with the notion that we don't need dispatch. Now that we are flying much longer stage lengths, dispatch is more of a necessity than it ever was. Do we need ATC? Jesus, do I even have to answer that? What a bunch of crap.

This one sort of intimates that we are going to trust what you guys say without checking it out for ourselves. "Let's go willy-nilly through the crap without checking it (real time) for ourselves":

xjcaptain, you peed in my cherrios. SS9E is correct about why I posted it. If you fly through a cell thats level 5 and the dispatcher said its a 1 or 2 you should let that dispatcher know right away. Radar images are not perfect by any means. That dispatcher would be able to inform the flights that are behind you.

Okay, maybe I watch the forecasts and route AROUND the TS areas rather than flight planning through 'em.

Safety first. Stay out of TS. TS not good.

Exactly.

No, its not. I'm not sure why AF would say that.

I didn't. ss9e did.

...........AF has had dispatchers, who for the most part, have done a good bit of pre-flight planning and tried to keep him out of those areas. Or, maybe, AF meant that his enroute deviations, are due to what he sees out the window.

Bet you're right...............



I'm not going to bother with the rest of it, I'm on vacation. If I pissed in anyone's cereal bowl............oh well. That wasn't my intention, nor am I going to apologize for my position on this thread vis a vis reroutes after the fact. Reread this thing for God Sakes............

Good God.................


AF