FEDUPPILOT
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APA proposes pay scale for AE
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This is want APA wants in Section 6 talks:
***CLICK HERE***
They are willing to STRIKE over the RJ issue!!! It is their biggest tenstion with AMR at this point, and AMR wants relief from the ASM cap.
***CLICK HERE***
They are willing to STRIKE over the RJ issue!!! It is their biggest tenstion with AMR at this point, and AMR wants relief from the ASM cap.
Steve McCroskey
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Anaconda,
The way I understand it is that the AA/TWA furloughs would be recalled and the AE pilots would be merged onto the APA seniority list (probably stapled on the bottom). Seniority would then determine the aircraft flown. So to answer your question, with my limited and possibly incorrect knowledge, is both. The question that needs to be answered is, in the unlikely event managment agrees to this, would more AE pilots be furloughed? Or will the company resume turbo-prop routes that were cancelled as a result of the ASM cap enacted by the AA/TWA furloughs?
The way I understand it is that the AA/TWA furloughs would be recalled and the AE pilots would be merged onto the APA seniority list (probably stapled on the bottom). Seniority would then determine the aircraft flown. So to answer your question, with my limited and possibly incorrect knowledge, is both. The question that needs to be answered is, in the unlikely event managment agrees to this, would more AE pilots be furloughed? Or will the company resume turbo-prop routes that were cancelled as a result of the ASM cap enacted by the AA/TWA furloughs?
The way I read the agenda, was that pay rates for Eagle aircraft was one of the things to be negotiated. No one knows how seriously this will or won't be taken by the APA pilots and AMR management.
The APA leadership would like to get Eagle pilots over to the APA list by a means to be determined. Management will oppose this with everything the have. It would cost too many of the managers their jobs for them to want to do this no matter how much sense it makes.
Is the RJ issue something APA would strike over? Most certainly I would think. Is moving Eagle over to the APA list something they would strike over? Probably not, but who knows.
Just one poor Eagle pilots opinions though.
EagleATR
The APA leadership would like to get Eagle pilots over to the APA list by a means to be determined. Management will oppose this with everything the have. It would cost too many of the managers their jobs for them to want to do this no matter how much sense it makes.
Is the RJ issue something APA would strike over? Most certainly I would think. Is moving Eagle over to the APA list something they would strike over? Probably not, but who knows.
Just one poor Eagle pilots opinions though.
EagleATR
Draginass said:
You're right. (See I don't always disagree with you)
Actually my message has nothing to do with this. I notice that since ALPA couldn't get enough cards, they have now switched to the merger plan to get you on board. Looks like you may be joining the country club after all, eh?
I also agree with Draginass. While the proposal makes some sense, AMR managers undergo a lobotomy when they get hired and they have a surgically inserted knee-jerk NO! reaction to every employee suggestion. USAir managment sees something there to this idea - that's why they want to start RJ flying with USAir pilots. AMR won't agree because the big airline managers all (Delta, NW, USAir, United) think they need to whipsaw the regionals with alter-ego competitors in order to be profitable and underwrite the high salaries wide body pilots are making. Also, APA hurts their credibility by asking for the moon in their recent contract proposal.
ALPA, APA MECS at all the big airlines should embrace this idea before Southwest, Frontier and JetBlue type operations get any larger.
ALPA, APA MECS at all the big airlines should embrace this idea before Southwest, Frontier and JetBlue type operations get any larger.
Macdaddy -
First of all, AMR managers don't undergo lobotomies. They are schooled in business, finance, and labor relations . . . and are good at it - much better than you or I are. In the end, it all comes down to money, however. While some young/inexperienced pilots still hold an illusion that the aviation profession is "special," you should know that managements consider you cost units, period dot. Might as well be bus drivers, and I don't care if it's SWA, JB, or UAL. BTW, in my personal opinion, Seigle's plan is to turn U into a regional airline with much lower employee compensation. He's trying to lower the bar on the professional compensation, as are all the airlines, by using 9/11, at least while they can.
Secondly, you are either seriously delusional or a company shill if you think that if we acquiesed lower wide-body pay, the company would raise AE pay or integrate a AE into AAL. They have 12 more years of being able to whip AE pilots with no interference, and the AE pilots themselves gave AMR the whip.
Thirdly, if you think asking for the "moon" in opening negotiations hurts the APAs credibility, you obviously don't understand the negotiating process. What do you think company openers look like?
"ALPA, APA MECS at all the big airlines should embrace this idea before Southwest, Frontier and JetBlue type operations get any larger."
I don't understand what your point is with that statement. You're going to need to be less cryptic. I'm just a ignorant "overpaid" widebody pilot - something I'm sure you're trying to professionally avoid.
Surplus:
"I notice that since ALPA couldn't get enough cards, they have now switched to the merger plan to get you on board. Looks like you may be joining the country club after all, eh?"
By "merger" do you mean the APA's proposal for AE integration? If so, I don't think there's any corolation there.
As far as ALPA goes, there is significant support among some APA members to explore reaffliliating with ALPA, but most feel the timing is not right . . . right now. In a few years, I think it could be a real possibility. Personally, I'm not in favor of it, but I wouldn't fight it if a majority of my union brothers wanted it.
First of all, AMR managers don't undergo lobotomies. They are schooled in business, finance, and labor relations . . . and are good at it - much better than you or I are. In the end, it all comes down to money, however. While some young/inexperienced pilots still hold an illusion that the aviation profession is "special," you should know that managements consider you cost units, period dot. Might as well be bus drivers, and I don't care if it's SWA, JB, or UAL. BTW, in my personal opinion, Seigle's plan is to turn U into a regional airline with much lower employee compensation. He's trying to lower the bar on the professional compensation, as are all the airlines, by using 9/11, at least while they can.
Secondly, you are either seriously delusional or a company shill if you think that if we acquiesed lower wide-body pay, the company would raise AE pay or integrate a AE into AAL. They have 12 more years of being able to whip AE pilots with no interference, and the AE pilots themselves gave AMR the whip.
Thirdly, if you think asking for the "moon" in opening negotiations hurts the APAs credibility, you obviously don't understand the negotiating process. What do you think company openers look like?
"ALPA, APA MECS at all the big airlines should embrace this idea before Southwest, Frontier and JetBlue type operations get any larger."
I don't understand what your point is with that statement. You're going to need to be less cryptic. I'm just a ignorant "overpaid" widebody pilot - something I'm sure you're trying to professionally avoid.
Surplus:
"I notice that since ALPA couldn't get enough cards, they have now switched to the merger plan to get you on board. Looks like you may be joining the country club after all, eh?"
By "merger" do you mean the APA's proposal for AE integration? If so, I don't think there's any corolation there.
As far as ALPA goes, there is significant support among some APA members to explore reaffliliating with ALPA, but most feel the timing is not right . . . right now. In a few years, I think it could be a real possibility. Personally, I'm not in favor of it, but I wouldn't fight it if a majority of my union brothers wanted it.
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