Anyone gone mil leave for 5 years?

[Schwanker]

PastV1 said,

"#2 All you get by law is 7 years of mil leave per employer. i.e. you go on mil leave now for 5 years (still not at 20 years) Then you go back to being a traditional reservist. US gets attacked and you get activated for over 2 years. After 7 years total mil leave the company can fire you and you have no recourse."

You are still protected in this scenario. I've read the USERRA Law several times as well as communicated with ALPA Attorney's and MEC Contract Guru's. There are several circumstances which allows you to go beyond 5 years military leave and still be protected by USERRA. I don't currently have the law in front of me, but one of these circumstances is during wartime operations, national emergency... I don't have the exact verbage at the moment but if you do a search for "USERRA" it clearly lays out the 8 or so circumstances that you are authorized more than 5 years military leave. The clock essentially stops if you fall into one of these 8 catagories and they can be quite liberal.

I'm not trying to start an argument, just want to get the info out so they can make the most informed decision.

Also, some companies will make B Fund contributions while on Mil Leave. This also may be required by law (not sure). My understanding is American will average the 5 pilots above/below you on the seniority list and alot you this amount. I do not work there, but been told this first hand by an AMR pilot who had "catch up" contributions to his B-Fund for this very reason.

Best of Luck with whichever route you choose.

 

[LearLove]

This guy never went back.....

A friend up at Willow Grove (103rd FW) was hired at Fedex in the early 90's. Alittle over a year into Fedex on the panel he took a 5 year LOA to be full time at his unit as a scheduler (sp?). When his time was up and he had to return to Fedex he decided to stay in the guard full time and gave up the 121 gig. That was about five years ago and he's still there and has since moved up to other positions.

 

[klhoard]

5 yr mil leave

As long as the guy is senior to me, I think it is an OUTSTANDING idea. In fact, I'll even pass along the phone number from the letter the USAF sent me (and scared the crap out of me in the process).

 

[PastV1]

As far as the 7 years goes this was what one of my guys researched with the JAG. Not sure about the exceptions to the rule. Just wanted to throw out a little info and get guys thinking before they jump. I'm all for the AD retirement stuff, just "Know Before You Go"....It may save some some pains later.
Hopefully all will be back soon anyway.....

Past....

 

[airgator]

So theoretically you can be hired by Fedex to the panel, take 2-3 years of mil leave, and come back holding an FO line? Is this type of thing looked down upon by management or do they not care? As a future reservist I'm just interested in learning how to play this game.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

So theoretically you can be hired by Fedex to the panel, take 2-3 years of mil leave, and come back holding an FO line? Is this type of thing looked down upon by management or do they not care? As a future reservist I'm just interested in learning how to play this game.

Look up some of the pilot contracts available online. They spell it out in black and white. You can usually leave while on probation but its smarter to leave after you are there a year or more.

 

[peepsmover]

USERRA

It is a great deal. I myself took mil leave for 3 years, bonus too, and I came back without any problems, seniority, vacation and contributions, as if I had never left. Naturally, my chief pilot was pissed off, but there was nothing he could do about it, federal law, baby! I was off probation before I left.

I'm too far away from even reaching sanctuary, so being able to retire active duty wise is not in the cards for me. For me, it allowed me to do something new, simplify my work life, be home more, and make a lot more than B scale pay, and when I returned I had my pick of bases and aircraft, plus a serious bump in pay. Still, like anything else there are some fallbacks, however everybody is different and looking for diverse slots, there are even some staff puke jobs that go begging, certainly with enough reason, but I would be willing to do that if it meant securing a bird in hand retirement that is indexed for inflation. Most importantly, I would try for an AGR job and not return to ADuty with the Air Force.

As for the 5 year max, it is true there are exceptions, just make certain yours meets one of them, and don't expect to pencil whip the exception because you may not have a strong case to do so. I think a letter from your commander would be sufficient to do that, but there might be an issue that it is has to be something along the lines of it being required by the SECDEF, and with the war on terrorism seemingly being here for the long run, who knows, at the end of your 5 years you might be able to extend your stay, it certainly cannot hurt to try and at least get to sanctuary, which is like tenure, and weigh your options. Naturally, if you push the limits beyond 5 years your company is going to look closely at your rationale for doing so.

As somebody stated earlier if you were forloughed and thenwent on Active Duty your 5 year clock does not start until they call you back.

As for ALPA I had to give up my membership at the time, but who knows now with a lot more guys on ADuty they might have changed their rules on that, but I would think that if you had loss of licenses or medical insurance, that you would not be covered if you became injured on active duty, there might be a war/military exception to their insurance coverage.

Good luck with your tours!

PS Make certain you have your company 401K set up for max contributions before you jump too. I think that if you do set up an IRA with the govt plan, that when you return to your company, that there might be some limitations on your actual make up contributions wiht your ocmpany.

 

[Andy]

I currently have ~6100 active duty points (I've got another 200 or so participation and IDT points that won't count toward an active duty retirement). I am currently on mobilization orders and will have ~6250 when my mobilization orders end.
Currently, they're talking about extending my mobilization orders for another year, giving me ~6600 points. Before extending my mobilization orders, I will have to sign a sanctuary waiver.
The regs state that you have to sign a sanctuary waiver when you reach 17 yrs 3 mos active duty points.
Let's be clear on a couple of terms. Sanctuary is when you reach 18 years active duty time; the military cannot separate you from active duty once you reach sanctuary. A sanctuary waiver means that you won't invoke your right to sanctuary. A sanctuary waiver does NOT mean that you waive an active duty retirement, if you accumulate 7200 points.
I know a couple of people in my office (I'm doing staff weenie work at headquarters now; it's an unlimited trough of man days) that have to get sanctuary waivers every time that they are on orders. One of them is about to do his last sanctuary waiver; he will reach 7200 points. He can take an active duty retirement after that point and get a retirement check every month. However, he plans on staying in the reserves and getting 179 man days + 14 annual tour days + 48 IDTs per year. He's furloughed from AMR; a TWA staple, so he doesn't ever expect to be recalled (personally, I think that he's too pessimistic; the cycle will turn around within the next 3 years).

As for USERRA, you can serve on active duty for up to 5 years without losing seniority. (UAL allows 5 yrs 9 mos). There are occasions that don't count toward the 5 yrs. A lot of the post-911 mobilization orders don't count toward the 5 yrs.
Make sure to check with your MEC's legal personnel on this one.

As for the rest, I've done some extensive research on hitting 20 active duty years in the reserve, including reading a bunch of regs. I used to be in the Guard, but found that they turned off the man days when you got close. I'm now an IMA at headquarters, and have found the land of unlimited man days. No one here is particularly concerned about reservists getting active duty retirements.

 

[peepsmover]

USERRA

Cool deal on sucking down days at HQ! How long does it take to get the approval to go past, what is it now 139 AD days?

I do want to clarify one thing, to my knowledge, USERRA a federal law would trump any contract, so long as it meets the requirements outlined in the law.

In my case I went on AD way before 911. As a result, there was no war or national emergency during my entire 3 year tour, my unit simply needed me for a new mission transition. During my absence my seniority number kept right on moving as if I had never left. I believe there is a govt attorney that handles this, but under the federal law, a civilian attorney could handle your case and be reimbursed under USERRA, provided you win. Employers can be tough but the law is there to protect an important state interest: keeping reservists focused on the mission, knowing that their job is there when they get back.

 

[Andy]

Depending on where you're at and how many active duty points you have, it can be pretty easy to get a waiver past 139 days. At the MAJCOM HQ that I'm currently at, there was a blanket waiver to 179, then 270 AD days.
As for this fiscal year, I'm expecting the same due to the current ops tempo. The blanket to 179 came out in Jan 03, followed shortly thereafter by a blanket to 270.
Again, I got mobilized for one year, and it's likely I'll be extended to two years. That will keep me employed full time until spring 2005 (assuming 139 AD days). I'd imagine that they'll continue to waive man days to a minimum of 179; hopefully 270.
However, if they don't, I've been tracking down multiple TDYs worldwide that should be fairly easy for me to land.