Anyone Aug 17 JetBlue class?

[BLUE BAYOU]

So, if there was a new class of pilots at say, NWA, what is probationary pay? I would bet it would equal to E190 first-year pay. Additionally, Jetblue supplies the uniforms, a rollerboard, and hotel for training.

 

[stillflyn]

So, if there was a new class of pilots at say, NWA, what is probationary pay? I would bet it would equal to E190 first-year pay. Additionally, Jetblue supplies the uniforms, a rollerboard, and hotel for training.

We don't have a "probationary period" at JetBlue, so maybe we shouldn't have "probationary pay". Just a thought.

Stillflyn

 

[shadesofBS]

We're ALL on indefinate probabtion at the Blue.
Go back and read your contract carefully.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

We're ALL on indefinite probabtion at the Blue.
Go back and read your contract carefully.

I knew it. I JUST KNEW IT!!!!

One slip up and they take away your pubs while kicking you off the property.

Just as I suspected.

 

[Eagleflip]

So, FBJ, do you have proof of any...ANY...case where that has happened?

I think not!
You're simply spouting pure rhetoric.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Sorry my humor didn't make it thru. I don't think that will happen to any JetBlue pilot under the management currently in place.

I don't think Jetblue pilots are under any worse scrutiny during the first year of their 5 year contract than a union pilot.

But it makes you think doesn't it?

 

[Eagleflip]

Sorry...I misunderstood your point! No foul, and my bitch is officially retracted.

 

[FNG320]

On the initial assesment the E190 pay rates are lower, especially if you look at them at face value. Please, before making a comment like "your friends actually chose the E190," consider the upgrade time and the actual pay scale at JetBlue. I appreciate your positive comments stating the airplane is going to be a winner, I tend to agree with you. Having been on the aircraft, I think the real winners will be our customers when they learn how comfortable it is. From a pilot's perspective, it looks like a really cool airplane to fly; lot's of need gadgets up front.

First, JetBlue planning a maximum upgrade rate of 10 months. Leadership did some serious math because of concers raised by our pilot population regarding the "unborn" JetBlue pilot when the rates were initially released. The math drove the maximum 10 month upgrade rate with the intent of keeping total compensation between an A320 and E190 new hire nearly equal at the expiration of their equipment lock, 2 years. Actually, the E190 new hire earns more at approximately the 11 month point based on accelerated upgrade rates. Remember, this also dramatically impacts total compensation in the form of 401(k) and profit sharing contributions.

Second, pay rates listed on airlinepilotpay.com are not necessarily indicative of the amounts earned by JetBlue pilots. JetBlue actually budgets on the "blended rate," which is a combination of base and premium pay. It is very difficult to publish a pay table based on the "blended rate" since this depends on how many hours a pilot CHOSES to fly. For budgetary purposes, JetBlue assumes 83 hours per month and the blended rate is higher than the base salary. As an example, the base A320 first year pay is $50.96 per hour, but the blended rate at 83 hours per month equals, $54.95 per hour.

The pay rates are low (required public disclaimer on this message board), but we need to prove this aircraft is going to generate more revenue then its costs. I personally believe there will be an upward adjustment to the rates once the public proves JetBlue's E190 plan is a money maker. Regardless, an E190 new hire makes more money over the course of 2 years than an A320 new hire assuming they have the same DOH.

jaxgus

Jax,
You may need to update the estimates that you give here. You have some great info and important facts and info, but remember the projections the company used to sell us on the pay rates were based on the following:

83 hours blended rate for all

Upgrade times between 6-10 months

Upgrading only 60-80 initially in summer 04, later updated to 100-120 in January 05 for current A320 FOs to Capt

Two year comparison of total compensation.

However......
With the bid increased to 143 pilots, and upgrades going at 10 per month (current plan), it will take the first "new hire" E190 FO to upgrade to CAPT 14+ months. Thus the pay chart/comparison is invalid. The main factor was a quick upgrade to E190 captain. However it will now take over 13-15 months for the upgrade vs the 6-12 months (plus they don't do upgrades over xmas).

Thus the data we were sold is now invalid, and most likely the E190 new hire won't make more than an A320 new hire until the 2.5-3 year point. This should be considered when someone wants to consider which type to pick for training.

Otherwise, great info,


Just my opinion.....

FNG

 

[A350]

All:

There is a fundamental problem with what JB management is trying to do. Kudos to them for trying to do it, but there just isn't any way to make human nature and the "future" to blend into a white paper that some potential pilot can read and make a career decision over.

In any case, bidding the E190 makes sense. Yes, the pay the first 15 months is not generally livable for someone with a couple kids and a mortgage. But you will be very senior as an FO and will be very senior in a short time as a Captain. Even when the fence comes down in 2-3 years, you aren't likely to get more junior.

Boomer

 

[skirt]

FYI-

E190 upgrades are not 10 per month. Current plan is 15 in Aug (includes check airman), 14 in Sept and 12-14 per month thereafter.

Skirt

 

[miles otoole]

All:

Yes, the pay the first 15 months is not generally livable for someone with a couple kids and a mortgage.
Boomer

Is this really true? Does Neeleman know this and if so, how can he be considered a leader?
"Sorry honey, for the next 15 months, we are not going to be able to generally live." Doesn't this piss off the senior pilots?
Not trying to be flame. I just find this a little strange.

 

[DIAMONDDD]

Is this really true? Does Neeleman know this and if so, how can he be considered a leader?
"Sorry honey, for the next 15 months, we are not going to be able to generally live." Doesn't this piss off the senior pilots?
Not trying to be flame. I just find this a little strange.

Hey Miles, check out the first year hourly pay at these airlines:

UAL.....30.00
AMR....35.00
CAL.....30.00
NWA....39.00
US.......25.00
B6 190 FO...37.00
For the first year at any of the above, you could say "sorry honey, we are not going to be able to generally live"

BTW, B6 year one FO is 51.00 for the airbus After that, most of the others listed pass the pay rates at B6.

 

[FNG320]

FYI-

E190 upgrades are not 10 per month. Current plan is 15 in Aug (includes check airman), 14 in Sept and 12-14 per month thereafter.

Skirt

If they do this, then they might make the 12 month to Capt in the 190 for new 190 FOs (but the 6 months numbers are just smoke). Where did you hear this? I don't doubt you, I just want to know the source. Otherwise everything I have says 10 per month. Thanks in advance.


FNG