Another MU2 down...

[Flyin Tony]

On the other hand RIP guys. It sucks to have another down

 

[Ailerongirl]

Its not the plane. Cessna 172 crash all the time. When will they take that out of the sky?

Oh really? So why aren't they called the 'Widow Maker' then? Sheesh Tony.....

 

[Flyin Tony]

[/QUOTE]Oh really? So why aren't they called the 'Widow Maker' then? Sheesh Tony.....

Ouch!!!! Like I said before I know a guy that has a ton of hours in the MU2 and has not had a problem. But then again he is at flightsafety all the time. Its kind of like the bonanza you had low time pilots with alot of money buying a fast plane and not getting the training that is needed to fly that plane. Now im not saying that this pilot didnt have alot of time or the right training, but things happen

 

[seethru]

I'm not sure, but I don't think the C172 is a fair "apples to apples" comparison to the MU-2. Sure, there are probably more deaths in C172s (maybe on the order of a magnitude of 10 or more). However, there are far more 172s out there, flown by mostly non-professional crews who've never been close to Flight Safety.

It would be like saying Chevy's are more dangerous than Bentlys, since obviously more people are dying in them.

 

[Ailerongirl]

Ouch!!!! Like I said before I know a guy that has a ton of hours in the MU2 and has not had a problem. But then again he is at flightsafety all the time. Its kind of like the bonanza you had low time pilots with alot of money buying a fast plane and not getting the training that is needed to fly that plane. Now im not saying that this pilot didnt have alot of time or the right training, but things happen

You're right, things happen....and they could happen to anyone, no matter how many hours they have, or how much time they spend at FlightSafety.

Your initial post just seemed very cavalier about the fact that another life has just been lost, and that another family has just lost a brother, a son, a nephew.
To be fair, I did see the post you made after it, but we posted at the same time, but it stil seemed that your concern was more of an afterthought.

 

[TIGV]

Folks it's easy to localize one's grief on the most apparent source of pain, fact is the Merlin has about twice the statistical accident numbers as the MU-2.
135 aviation folks, single pilot, on the backside of the clock, sh!tty weather, max duty and flight time, inadequate rest, in a very high workload aircraft is inherently dangerous, couple that with inadequate training, maintenance etc etc the standard for most 135 operators and as an aviator you better always ALWAYS leave yourself a backdoor and even then the odds are stacked against you.

Today was bloody horrible, I was sad, sick and angry as he!!, same as I was in December and I feel equal blame should be placed on the Federal Agency responsible for the oversite of 135 operators that allow the above to take place and put all of us in compromising positions in regards to maintaining our employment, professionalism and personal safety...........All, I might add, for minimum pay, no benefits and horrible tragedies like today.

Blue Skies Sam, I'll be seeing you soon.

 

[Flydaplane]

Am Check lost another plane back in 99 or 00

I think the guy was headed to Lewiston, ID, if I remember correctly he was a retired Delta Capt. flying single pilot in the MU-2, went down in some freezing rain or something like that.

 

[FN FAL]

Oh really? So why aren't they called the 'Widow Maker' then? Sheesh Tony.....

Thank goodness the Caravan is called the "fresh maker"...no, that's a mentos sales thing. Never mind.

 

[WNRHD17]

Today was bloody horrible, I was sad, sick and angry as he!!, same as I was in December and I feel equal blame should be placed on the Federal Agency responsible for the oversite of 135 operators that allow the above to take place and put all of us in compromising positions in regards to maintaining our employment, professionalism and personal safety...........All, I might add, for minimum pay, no benefits and horrible tragedies like today.

I agree....like Dad said, it reopened wounds....my thoughts are with the family and friends of today's accident....

Hi Phil...meant to PM you a couple days ago, but I've been busy...

 

[WNRHD17]

Its not the plane. Cessna 172 crash all the time. When will they take that out of the sky?

If you do a search for the Cessna the majority of accidents are non-fatal...when you search for MU-2 accidents, just about every other one is a fatal.

 

[avbug]

Tragic though losses may be, that one should condemn the airplane as a result makes nearly as much sense as attempting to dehorn all the cows when the chicken coop burns down. It won't save the coop, and holds no logic.

I flew for the company that lost the coke execs, and can only say that those who know it all about that event probably don't, and shouldn't comment on it without ground upon which to stand.

I was also hired by the company in question to fly the subject airplane at one time, but will refrain from speculation or comment on this loss, presently. It's sad, it's unfortunate, and that's about all that should be said on the matter until real information is forthcoming.

As far as the airplane, and those that condemn it, a poor carpenter blames his tools. It's not the airplane. The airplane is what it is, and it's a known quantity. Those who elect to fly this airplane do so willingly, and knowingly, and trust in their ability to do so enough that they are willing to bet their life on the fact, just as we all do, every hour, every day.

A bet need not be a gamble; a prudent man bets only on a sure thing. Those who are not sure, then, gamble, and for this, there is loss. For the loss, we can only offer condolence, but in no wise should one condemn the airplane, for it's not the airplane. It's the pilot.

Always the pilot.

Any one who doesn't believe that in his heart has no place calling himself a pilot or taking the responsibility as pilot in command. Responsibility always rests with the pilot, and it's the pilot who pays for this responsibility, often with his certificate, often with his wallet, and forever with his life.

Today is no different.

 

[350DRIVER]

avbug hit the nail on the head on this one. The airplane does indeed have a pretty questionable safety record with regards to accidents/incidents. The airplane will bite you (most know this), proper training by seasoned MU-2 folks can go a long way. No airplane is a mind reader, this one is no exception. Two fatal crashes coming from the same company in such a short period of time does raise a red flag and I would only hope their mx issues/policies will now be in the spotlight and if they have been found to cut corners, knowingly compromised safety, put crews at risk(s), to keep costs low then this company should be no longer and shut down.

Its not the plane. Cessna 172 crash all the time. When will they take that out of the sky?

You likely won't be seeing the MU-2s' going away anytime soon. Good mx + good training is key. The majority of negative comments I have heard over the years were from folks who have never even stepped foot in any MU2 let alone having ever flown one.

May God bless the family and help them get through these hard times.

 

[ACT700]

Before you people run your mouthes about accidents and/or companies, make sure you have the facts. Both ACT accidents are still under investigation.
(and no, I'm not management!, just another poor bastard trying to make a living)

avbug and 350Driver are right in their comments: most people who condemn this a/c have only seen it in pictures and in writing;
and most people who fly it are aware of the risks involved. At least I am. Last I heard, this was still a free country--so if you don't like flying the MU2, or don't want your husband, bf, brother, sister-you get the idea-flying it, then DON'T!

If you want to make it a safer airplane, proper training and mx are key, as stated before. Also, instructors and check airmen MUST weed out weak pilots, as this is not an a/c to learn to fly (IFR) in.

Neither is the Metro.

 

[semperfido]

they should weld a pipe on the bottom of them and make a wind tees out of them- a white elephant if there ever was one.

 

[skygirl1968]

White elephant indeed!!! That plane has inherent design flaws that make it nearly impossible to fly under less than perfect conditions. And I HAVE talked with pilots that have over 10k in that plane. They all say that the plane is great until you run into trouble. A quote from a pilot that flew the plane for quite a number of years..."Like your son I started out in the Mu-2 with about 2800tt and when all said and done I gathered some 6500 hours in the type flying all the models currently in the U.S… During that time in the plane I suffered three engine failures, one crew hatch window failure, and a dual inverter failure during IMC conditions and the list continues...I just happened to be quick to get the plane under control and get it back on the ground. The final straw that got me out of the plane was when I lost an engine with ¾’s of a load of canceled check and simply couldn’t maintain altitude until the plane descended to thicker air and I was able to get it to an airport … I did pee my pants."

"Last I heard, this was still a free country--so if you don't like flying the MU2, or don't want your husband, bf, brother, sister-you get the idea-flying it, then DON'T!" You ever try to talk someone that you love out of doing thier dream job of flying? You can't, its impossible. Paul was totally aware of the fact that I hated that plane, but I couldn't stop him from flying. He would have died inside. So are you saying that I deserve to be a widow since I couldn't talk him out of it????

"If you want to make it a safer airplane, proper training and mx are key, as stated before. Also, instructors and check airmen MUST weed out weak pilots, as this is not an a/c to learn to fly (IFR) in" For the record...my husband was a properly trained pilot and had flown countless times in IFR conditions. He had also walked away from emergency landings and engine failures in other types of a/c...he knew what he was up against. Like I said, the plane is a beast under less than ideal conditions. Send along a HIGH time MU2 pilot, that's been thru engine failures and landed safely, that STILL loves this plane and sings it praises. I'd really like to talk to him.