Another MU2 down...

[TIGV]

tigv now that your let everyone on this board know what kind of fool you are didnt you even read my post it had nothing to do about your friend(who obviously didnt know how to fly the plane properly) You probably have never flown the plane yourself so why dont you shut your mouth .

I called you and idiot for a reason, I also responded to your rude and ill informed PM mainly because I like to keep turd slinging off the public forums and wanted to save you a little embarassment.

Unfortunatly in addition to you being an idiot you also had the bad grace to slander me publicly so I will respond publicly.

I have over 8000 hours total, a couple of type ratings and more turbine PIC than you have total time, I have flown over 2500 hours in the MU-2 under 135.

Once again, you are not just an idiot but you crossed the moron boundary at warp 8 and gave me a good laugh, thanks man.

 

[Squanto]

MU-2 was tougher than T-38

I've got 1000 hours or so in the MU-2....and it took more concentration to fly than the T-38. You need expert (Reese Howell in MQY) training in order to be safe. Most of the time people are coming from piston twins into the MU and not getting enough real training at the onset.

I once flew into FSM and talked with a guy that flew Cobra Gunships in Vietnam, he said he was more spooked in the MU-2 than he was flying combat. That will open your eyes.

 

[FN FAL]

You guys got me thinking of the Wrightstown annual fireman's picnick...where it's not a party untill there's two more squad cars dispatched than the previous year.

Summer is not over, lets all get together and reserve a city park somewhere on the outskirts of some rural metropolis. We can grill out, drink some beers, dance, listen to some music...then after all the homer simpsons go home, we can flip picnick tables over and beat each other over the head with beer bottles.

To simply things, we'll all sign waivers not to sue each other before we can get to the tap beer?

Who's in?

 

[WNRHD17]

Wrightstown picnic? As in Wrightstown take the Hwy U exit off 41? We live about 5 miles from there

 

[avbug]

AVBug; I haven't operated under Part 91 for 33 years. Is it the same as 121? Hugs, Dad

91 is not the same as 121, though operations under 121 are still beholden to most of Part 91, as you should well know, if indeed you fly Part 121. What is the point of that question, other than to assert our experience on the one hand, and then withdraw it by asking such a ridiculous question?

You are not my dad, and I'm not a huggy touchy feely sort of person. Perhaps you folks might manage logging on independently in order that one might have some idea of whom might be speaking.

 

[FN FAL]

Wrightstown picnic? As in Wrightstown take the Hwy U exit off 41? We live about 5 miles from there

Then you know what I'm talkin bout! Hahaha...howdy neighbor!

They may have toned down the firemans picniks...but I remember not too long ago that those things turned into riots.

 

[WNRHD17]

we always clarify who is speaking if, inadvertently, happened to be logged on using someone else's name....is it really that difficult to understand? I thought we were all adults? this is simple grade school knowledge...read and comprehend.

I don't have to worry about being professional in my statements, as pilot is not my chosen career....thank goodness my career allows me to not be a, well, I think I've made enough comments for tonight....tomorrow will be another lovely Wisconsin day

howdy to you too, neighbor...we may be moving to wrightstown or somewhere nearby next spring due to my husband's employment requirements.

Reading and writing some of these posts just cracks me up sometimes. After searching for some of skyking1976's earlier posts (pre-Dad), some of the comments he'd make would purely be to get a rise out of people, which it usually did. I can understand why he did so....it's pretty humorous watching everyone get so worked up.

 

[WNRHD17]

You are not my dad, and I'm not a huggy touchy feely sort of person.

I think you're more touchy feely than you think if you felt that "Hugs, Dad" through the computer...My Dad is "THE DAD"...the universal Dad, if you will...but that's ok, I don't want to share him with you anyway. Wouldn't want to waste any of his "Dadness."

 

[ackattacker]

Personally, I have nothing but sick contempt for those who live to find blame...but if you want to lay blame in an airplane, lay it at the feet of the pilot in command.

Any pilot who doesn't accept it is a spinless fool. Dead or alive, we all know the score before we introduce fuel or spark, before we ever cross the dark tarmac and open a door, before we ever get out of bed. We know.

Knowing, and failing to accept full responsibility for loose foam, bad safety wire, thunderstorms, or two passengers far in the back who get into a fight...is cowardice and failure to uphold ones duty as PIC. In that aircraft, no authority short of God is greater than that of the PIC, and no soul can or should attempt to take away that responsibility. It's supreme, it's heavy, and it belongs on the shoulders of the PIC, pure and simple.

Avbug, I think I understand the point you are trying to make here... but you take it too far. In flight, the PIC has ultimate responsibility to ensure the safe outcome of the flight to the best of his/her ability. ALL crewmembers have responsibility to be mentally and physically prepared for mechanical failures, unforecast weather, etc. And mentally it is probably a good idea to be ready to accept responsibility even for things which are truly outside of our control. But ensuring safe outcome of the flight takes many forms. For example, what if the PIC has a medical situation and becomes confused and nonresponsive? In a crew environment, he can continue to do his job by having created an environment where the SIC feels empowered to take control. But perhaps this is a digression.

"those who live to find blame".... I also have contempt for those who live to point fingers at people other than themselves, or profit from misfortune. But it is very important to identify the factors that lead to accidents so that safety can be improved in the future. I have a lot of respect for NTSB investigators. They have a tough and thankless job, and frankly all of us probably OWE OUR LIVES to the lessons learned from past accident investigations. Much of the training we receive and regulations we follow are written in blood. You have a lot of experience, but you weren't born with aviation knowledge. Nor did you teach yourself. If you did, you wouldn't still be here. If the training you received was shoddy then you would be dead. If the airplanes you flew were designed so that the wings fell off in flight then you would be dead. If the mechanics who serviced your planes were incompetent or used shoddy parts then you would be dead. The PIC authority is not so "god-like" that a proper mental attitude can unexplode an exploded fuel tank or magically add 500 fpm to a single-engine climb rate.

In an accident, to simply say "it was pilot error" and leave it at that is a cop-out. It's the easy way out. Lay the blame at the feet of the pilot, who's already dead... so problem solved, right? No need to do any further work to ensure it doesn't happen again. If he had had the "right stuff" then everything would have been OK. This is an old-school attitude that might have been mentally necessary to strap yourself into an F104 the day after you buddy augered in, but I think we have a responsibility to do better. One of the ways we can do better is to say "if a large majority of the pilots out there can't seem to fly a F104 safely, maybe we should start looking at other factors. It's irresonsible to continue with the status quo."

Substitute MU2 for F104.

Also on the subject of PIC reponsiblity - "no authority short of God is greater than that of the PIC, and no soul can or should attempt to take away that responsibility. It's supreme, it's heavy, and it belongs on the shoulders of the PIC, pure and simple."

Well in 121 I share many responsibilities. The dispatcher has a joint responsibility that is clearly codified in regulation. And the safety of the flight relies on the professionalism and compentence of a great many people. A short list:

Aircraft designers
Aircraft builders
Mechanics
Fuelers
TSA
Dispatchers
Weather forecasters
ATC
Flight Attendants
Baggage handlers
SIC

and lets not forget the training department. Experience has shown that in an emergency the pilot will perform within the confines of his/her training. I don't care how "god-like" you are.

 

[350DRIVER]

to start- this is BS;
"Any professional pilot who blames the airplane overhimself is no professional, but a kid with a lot of growing up to do. "

Accidents and incidents happens for many reasons and some of them are through no fault or deficiency in the pro pilot. Avbug is full of bravado, hence the BS meter is pegged. Do I really need to pick through his verbose essay line by line?

fido

Again, you have failed to point out what was asked, nice out though. Pegged on what?. It is much wiser to keep emotion out when trying or in your case "attempting" to prove a point. Avbug is full of experience whether you like him or not, somewhat of a known fact, do you know him?. I kind of thought so. I can understand the emotion from the loss of human life that these families are experiencing present day but to jump on a bandwagon to condemn one specific aircraft?. A 152 can kill someone just as easily as the deuce. The MU-2 is not going away anytime soon, whether you like it or not.