Anal retentive a-hole Captains

[IAHERJ]

True statement Falcon Captain. That's why the pilots of Mesaba, ASA, and COEX are out there as we speak negotiating the contracts of the futures for "regional" carriers. These airlines along with Mesa and a few more currently negotiating will be trying to dictate wages and work rules that will make all of our careers (long or short) at "regionals" more rewarding.

 

[Timebuilder]

While I don't do my "Amazing Kreskin" impression anymore, I think you're right.

The regional airlines will indeed be the destination for most 121 pilots during the forseeable future. I'll change my mind when three major carriers put 3,000 pilots back to work, for starters.

This will certainly cause a change in the pay and benefit status of the regionals.

 

[Blubaron]

Hey cornbread I know exactly who "H" is and "Cheers" sounds familiar too..

 

[bobbysamd]

"Lifers"

I appreciated the comment(s) that maybe the Captain asked the FO to actually look at the checklist instead of doing it the easy (you know where) way. I also liked the comment how the Captain might have gotten there via you-know-what. Timebuilder's "direct track to internship" comment carries a good amount of truth.

Just a brief comment, though, about "lifers." Being anal and being a lifer are mutually exclusive. Of course, there is a difference between doing what you're supposed to do and being anal. However, you're supposed to do what you're supposed to do and a captain is not wrong to expect it.

Quite a few people who are just happy to be flying are probably "lifers." And, at their regionals, they are probably revered and are institutions. If my career would have gone my way, I would have been a "lifer." I would have been thrilled to death about it, too. I had a friend who enjoyed very much what he was doing as a commuter captain. He flew plenty but had plenty of time off. He lived in our home town and didn't have to relocate. He earned a fair wage.

Don't be so quick to generalize. There is a danger in dealing with absolutes.

Just my .02.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Flight-crew: five years makes you a lifer? You must be new to the airline business. Take my advice and adjust your view of what a "long time" is. If you think five years is too long to spend between career steps, you're setting yourself up for real disappointment.

And forgive me for being blunt, but it sounds to me like you were the bitter one in that cockpit. By coincidence, MetroSheriff and I were recently discussing captains who have reputations for being flaming a__holes. We'd hear horror stories about these guys, and then when we flew with them ourselves, we had no trouble with them. Why? Because we know our job, do it well, and play well with others.

It's the guys with lousy attitudes who usually have trouble with the anal-retentive a__hole captains. Does "anal-retentive" by any chance mean he actually expected you to do your job the way the company and the feds want you to?

 

[MetroSheriff]

Doggone it Typhoon, mind your own business!!!!

ROFLMAO.

I think were gonna need our snow boots this weekend. It looks like JFK is fixin' to get hammered. Maybe it'll cancel.

 

[Timebuilder]

I've got my boots out for tomorrow. I won't be at JFK, though. TEB, maybe.

 

[bestpilotever]

Mysimple solutionto dealing with anal retentive captains....Just tell the airline you wont come work there unless you can go right to the left seat. that is my plan! I dont want deal with some of these people telling me how to fly.

 

[MetroSheriff]

I've got my boots out for tomorrow. I won't be at JFK, though. TEB, maybe.

If'n the weather man is to be trusted, TEBs not going to be a picnic tomorrow.

 

[bulldog]

I recall one particular Captain who was a jekyl/ hyde type. At the time I had all of 250 hours in the AC and in the 121 environment. So, I did what was appropriate, I kept my mouth shut and complied with whatever he wanted and however he wanted it. By the second leg of the day this anal retentive Captain started teaching me about the AC. I'll de darned if he didn't teach me more in the 6 legs we flew that day than the previous couple months combined. Lesson learned!! If we can leave our own attitudes on the ground we might just learn something.

Bulldog

 

[Timebuilder]

You make an excellent point.

Two of the three people who have taught me the most about the airplane are the same two guys who seem to have sipped the bubbling liquid when the get in the airplane!

 

[dispatchguy]

A few weeks ago I jumpseated with a mixed crew - a very senior captain and a female F/O I had seen on the crew bus a few times.

When I get abord and ask for the ride, the Cap makes the joke "Did you know that God never intended women to fly?"

"Uhhhhhh, no I answered" very uncomfortably.

"if he did, he would've made the sky pink." then he lets a huge belly laugh. He looks over his shoulder at me with a look on his face as if "who's side are you on - her's or mine?". I just kinda blew it off, but the F/O didnt. As I was securing my roll-aboard in the second observer seat the F/O shot the captain a look that would've killed.

I had just come off a midnite shift and all I wanted to do was fly home. The flight was full and I had to ride up front, which as a dispatcher I usually enjoy - however, not on this trip. It was the beginning of a 4-day together for these two. During the entire flight to ORD they didnt say word one to each other - and spoke to me only once. The tension in the flight deck was soooo present you could've cut it with a knife, to which I attributed to the cap's very off-color remark, especially to a female F/O he had never flown with.

When we got to ORD, there was a "heated discussion" we'll call it over a taxi clearance - the F/O and I heard the clearance clearly, but the captain didnt and started following his own clearance. When we got to the gate (finally!), I thanked the captain for the ride (as I always do), and told the F/O "Have a fun trip!" The look in her eyes was 'yeah right'. Two days later at work they call me over the radio to pass a word to the crew desk that she's going enroute sick after arrival - I'm sure she was fed up with the way he ran a flight deck.

 

[Brother Francis]

It is a matter of perception whether your captain is one of those. Do you really have the experience to make that judgement?

As an FO, I have flown with ARAC's. They are certainly out there. As a captain, I have flown with FO's who's inexperience leads them to believe they know more than they do and who's youth and exuberance leads them to the conclusion that their lifer captain is an ARAC. Those are out there as well.

Last month, a young new hire FO was slightly, but not excessively high at about 300 AGL on final. Throttles came back to near idle.

"More power" No response

"It's gonna drop out from under you" No response. Speed falling off, nose starting down

"You need to get that power in now" No response

I can count on one hand the times I have found it necessary to touch the controls when I was NFP. This was one of them. I reached under and pushed the throttles up.

Lousy landing short of the 1000' markers. Boy was he ticked.

I apologized and politely asserted the necessity of my action in the context of an explanation of the perils of gliding a slow, dirty jet with swept and highly loaded wings. He was not receptive and it began to annoy me. He argued that he was pitching for the speed and that if I had not interfered he would not have landed badly. After hearing that, I was no longer annoyed. I let it ride for now

He, on the other hand, stayed ticked through the turn and the flight back to base. My leg.

At 10 miles and 3000' I dirtied up to the landing configuration. Now he really thought I was an idiot. I set the power for a 700 fpm descent and gave him the controls.

"Your power was at 37% when I pushed your throttles up on that last landing. Pull it back to that and hold your speed with pitch." He did.

3-5 seconds later- "SINK RATE! SINK RATE!"

"See what I mean?"

"Yeah, I do. Thanks for showing me that."

Moral: The captain isn't the idiot the FO thinks he is. Nor is the FO the cocky young buck the captain thinks he is. Unless one chooses not to respect the other.

 

[bobbysamd]

The ARAC as instructor

It is a matter of perception whether your captain is one of those. Do you really have the experience to make that judgement . . . . . Last month, a young new hire FO was slightly, but not excessively high at about 300 AGL on final. Throttles came back to near idle. . . . . I can count on one hand the times I have found it necessary to touch the controls when I was NFP. This was one of them. I reached under and pushed the throttles up . . . . .He argued that he was pitching for the speed and that if I had not interfered he would not have landed badly . . . Moral: The captain isn't the idiot the FO thinks he is. Nor is the FO the cocky young buck the captain thinks he is. Unless one chooses not to respect the other.

Very good post, which I really enjoyed reading. You must have been a flight instructor at one time.

Point made about the captain expecting you to do what you're supposed to do. FO is very much a training position - for Captain, one day, if you're lucky. Notwithstanding the fact that you control speed with power levers (throttle) and altitude with pitch, per the FAA.

 

[cornbread]

As an FO, I have flown with ARAC's. They are certainly out there. As a captain, I have flown with FO's who's inexperience leads them to believe they know more than they do and who's youth and exuberance leads them to the conclusion that their lifer captain is an ARAC. Those are out there as well.

So true.

The bottom line for some reading this thread is that you won't understand some of this until you upgrade. Not because you are unable now, or that they give you a decoder ring as Capt., just a matter of perspective. I think most will agree that before upgrading they heard somewhere "you will understand when you upgrade" but may have dismissed it until they saw for themselves. Enjoy the journey.

As one poster said, leave attitudes on the ground.

This is most definately a career that will be safer due to humility and altruism.