American Decapitated.

[usav8or]

I think it's time to dust off a few of those nukes and introduce them to the fires of hell!

 

[Dubya]

huh?

I'm not sure what you mean by that response.

Rush Limbaugh and Al Franken are not the "press".
They are commentators, entertainers...voices for their viewpoints.

By the press I mean the littany of 24 hour news coverage of crap I don't need to know...and quite frankly...don't need to know.

W

 

[rvsm410]

Missed intention, pick the right fights.

Dubya,

you missed the point sir! you write in the literal sense, I did not mean we should wait for the war to come here...it is here.....just in another form....

It is obvious to me that you have not been in the company of this culture, especially in combat....

The war they fight is WAS only against others in the region until we stepped in the middle of it years ago, Isreal, the Saudia oil, all reasons for this counties interest there. Sure we are the worlds super power and we like to make sure the world knows it, but like in any war, battle etc...you have to learn to pick your fights, and fights we can really win....

We need to clean up our own back yard, get rid of the people here that dont belong here, protect the land and people in and around the US thzt share our vision of what life is....

I'll repeat, we think we are in a war...the people of the middle east are living the same normal life they have lived for thousands of years....what makes you or anyone here believe we are going to change this now or in 50 years.......

And as for the Nuke statement.....well if I really have to explain this one then your lost as well....one nuke dropped over there will cause a chain reaction so wide spread that the air we breath here would be horrible, the planet as we know it wil be changed for ever.........

If we continue on this path, this action/war will eventually make Vietnam look like small potatoes in the loss of life....and in the end, they will still think the way they have been taught for generations.....

I fear we have started something we can not get out of now....

 

[HoursHore]

This war has been going on since 1972 when the Islamic fundamentalist took the Israeli Hostages with very little reponse from the west. For years the west has taken these hits with little or no response. Remeber the Achille Lauro? We forced down one plane with the the mastermind Abu Nidal, who was later found in IRAQ. Our Realpolitik strategy of the cold war really sreved us poorly in the long run, for while we won the struggle with the strategy of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend," we empowered all these crazies, and now it is nothing more than stepping on every single cockroach we can find. It will probably take 50 years, but so did the cold war. I have been to the theatre twice now since separating from active duty with the USAFR, and am prepared to go back many more times. It is a culture war, and not one that will be won soon.

However, I consider this struggle on par with WW2 in its scope and a battle that needs to be fought. how long were we going to sit there with Sadamm Hussein thumbing his nose at the west an flipping SAM's at our aircraft? 12 years? Well that was how long we sat there with our thumbs up our butt. And thats how long sSaddam proclaimed to the Islam world that he had defeated our forces in the First Gulf War. 12 years of giving his empowering message to the rest of the crazies. The time has come. Peace only thru Victory.

 

[flyboydk]

I agree with Typhoon, turn the Middle East into a parking lot. Can anyone name anything they (Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc.) have contributed to the world besides oil and terrorism?

 

[Pilot124]

That video was the sickest thing I have ever seen. It made me so mad that I have lost my head. I am so sick of this s hit. What are we wasting our time over there for? F uck'n nuke those f uckers!!!!! I am beggining to think that nothing will change over there. They are happy to die and have no reserves about cutting a head off and filming it. What kind of reaction do they think they are going to get from us here...You bet....F uck them, and lets KILL em all...Sorry That just pissed me off. If you haven't seen it DON'T.

 

[Dubya]

Not so obvious

It just so happens that I work shoulder to shoulder each day with people from this part of the world. I have a very real insight into this culture...not in combat...only in the field of intelligence gathering...but I assure you I am not lost on this subject.

I did not assert that we should drop nukes as others have posted...what I was responding to is your assertion that we should be fighting the war over here...which is absurd.

I was speaking of the possibility of a nuclear attack on our soil from terrorists allowed to operate freely in other parts of the world, able to obtain WMD's and bring them here.

Your statement about one nuclear weapon having such a dramatic global effect is utter nonsense.

If we do not continue to battle this enemy...on our terms....this enemy will come to us..and continue to fight us on their terms. This is unacceptable.

Once again...we have to be there, and we should not stop there.

This will be a long process...but one that must be seen through.

W

 

[jarhead]

Dubya

Of course they are commentators. They comment on what they see and have heard about in the news. Al Franken and Rush Limbaugh never set foot out of their studio other than to appear at a book signing or celebrity roast. Don't take everything so literally.

Now, as to your contention that 24/7 is too much news for YOU to handle, and that YOU don't need it all.....can't argue with that. However, FOX, MSNBC, CNN, etc, all have a wider audience than just YOU. There are the night shift workers just leaving the gas station they work at; the dog watch coming home from the cop house, and the myriad of people who tune in when they have a moment to catch up on the events that form their lives. If YOU don't need the news 24/7, who is forcing you to watch any of it? That's YOUR choice. If you don't watch it all, I promise, I won't tell on you. It's OK

 

[mar]

War *is* Hell.

Well, here're my two cents:

I tried to download the video but it got jammed up with "net congestion" or something, but I did see the takedown and hear the scream.

That was enough. I don't need to see the rest.

Here's my question: What did everyone expect when Bush, et al said, We're invading Iraq.

Shock and awe?

Do you think shock and awe are unilateral?

Don't you think similiar atrocities have occured in every war since Man first picked up a stone and fashioned a weapon?

Why are we so surprised? Is it because we've been fed a sanitized version of Truth for the last 40 years? Is it because we don't have the stomach for the Ugly Truth?

Am I the only person in all of America who can say that when we first deployed to Iraq that things would go to Hell?

Iraq has become Hell. Nobody is going to Hell. They're already there.

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

Honestly, I have given up on a good portion of humanity due to what I have seen online. In a week or so, that website will also put back up it's other stuff. They have the Daniel Pearl snuff video from Pakistan. They have other videos from the USSR, Chechnya, various African national civil wars, and other places. Add in their collection of 9/11 video (the raw footage - little of the 'expert opinions' that came after). Ever seen humanity unedited by civilization?

Most people have no clue how sheltered they are in the US. The violence on TV is NOTHING compared to what goes on in the rest of the planet.

If you think that such items as the 'geneva convention' or 'civilization' will protect you, I can dissuade you from those views. There is a thin line between everyone on this board and chaos, and that line is defended primarly by the US Government.

I can respect those who argue against the Iraqi and/or Afganistan wars on the grounds of method, but I refuse to respect those who argue against the end. I may end up sounding racist but their 'culture' (or whatever the PC term is right now) isn't compatable with mine, and thus one has to go.

 

[Q200_FO]

It's officially a complete mess over there. I don't care to watch the video but reading about it really pissed me off but like Mar said, why are we that surprised? This is what happens in war. As much as some would like to just start firing nukes over there it ain't gonna happen. We're pretty much stuck with seeing this through now like it or not. Civies shouldn't really be over there in the first place IMHO.

 

[atrdriver]

Which would you rather have? This kind of stuff happening over there or on our own shores? If we didn't carry the war over there I guarantee that we would be fighting it over here. I don't need to see the video to know that what we are over there fighting is evil. That's why we went, and we need to rid the world of it. As long as that kind of evil exists, our way of living will be threatened.

atrdriver

 

[JCJ]

I'm in favor of pulling out of Iraq - provided that as our last people are leaving we turn it into a radioactive glass (melted sand) parking lot

and i'm not drunk. just mad.

 

[Crizz]

I dont understand how some here are so affected by this video. This video doesnt surprise me or outrage me anymore than I already am. Not to be misunderstood, let me say that I think this act is utterly disgusting and cowardly, and the people who committed it will someday pay for their crime.

But people, wise the fuk up. How many THOUSANDS of people lost their lives in this same manner when a 767 hit the side of a skyscraper? Do you people not put two and two together when we say the death total for Sept 11th? Do you think those people just assumed room temperature without pain?

NO, those people were burned, maimed, dismembered, decapitated, crushed, and literally destroyed... while still alive. Watch videos of desperate people jumping from 1000 feet in the air. Watch videos of people running for their lives and geting engulfed in speeding debris.

This sort of thing ALREADY happened on our own soil. It makes me sick to see all the quarterbacking going on in the media about senseless ridiculous crap. About some poor iraqis that had to jerk one another off.

One man was senselessly murdered giving service to barbarians, and we are outraged. Thousands of men and women and children were wiped from the face of the earth in the same manner, and we so quickly forget about it.

I want to puke.

God Bless America

 

[pa28cfi]

Just for clarity I want to point out that according to the news reports coming out now the guy was not actually working for any civilian contractors. He had gone to Iraq twice "looking for work" but had not found any, just before he disappeared he had been detained by the U.S. military and his family had to sue to get him released. I feel terrible what happened but I am somewhat annoyed by the "spin" being put on it by the talking heads about how he was there to "rebuild Iraq" etc., I don't think it's entirely clear exactly what this guy was doing in Iraq except getting himself into trouble. That said it's still a tragedy.

Just to add one other observation that may not be obvious to everyone, it seems from his last name that not only was he an American but he was also Jewish, (this obvious fact will never be pointed out on our liberal PC networks.) To most of us here his religion might seem irrelevant but to the terrorist this means everything. If they can execute an American who also happens to be a Jew for them it's a Double Victory (ie. Daniel Perl), now assuming he was indeed an American Jew wandering around unescorted in Iraq trying to set up a business to the Iraqi's this is like a black person walking down the street in rural Alabama in the 1930's holding hands with a white women, he might as well have painted a bullseye on his back. In that same vein I think it's a mistake to imply that all Arabs are inherently evil because of what these barbarians did to that poor kid, if you really feel that way you are no better then our enemy because that's how they feel about us. Would you look at photos of lynching's in the south and say that all people from the south are Evil? It is a mistake to paint any group of people with such a broad brush, yes most of them look the other way on this butchery just like most people in the south looked the other way at the KKK and the lynch mobs and the German's looked the other way at the concentration camps. All human beings are capable of Evil, let's try and remember that.

Okay i stand corrected, it looks like right after I posted this the mainstream media finally picked up on this aspect of the story


http://www.newsday.com/news/nationw...,3549421.story?coll=ny-nationalnews-headlines


WEST CHESTER, Pa. - "I would be glad to label him as my own son," one neighbor said yesterday of Nick Berg, who was beheaded in Iraq by a group affiliated with al-Qaida.

Ever since he graduated from high school, Berg, 26, had lived a life of adventure.

He took college classes at Cornell, Drexel, the University of Pennsylvania and the University of Oklahoma. He helped set up electronics equipment at the Republican National Convention in Philadelphia in 2000. He even made several trips to Third World countries - at one point teaching villagers in Ghana how to make bricks.

His trip to Iraq was his latest adventure.

Berg's father said his son was Jewish and had a fringed religious cloth with him, but he did not think Berg wore the clothing in public. Still, "there's a better chance than not that they knew he was Jewish," Michael Berg said. "If there was any doubt that they were going to kill him, that probably clinched it, I'm guessing."

Friends and family members described Berg as smart, funny and enormously generous.

His father said Berg returned from his trip to Ghana emaciated because he gave away most of his food, and the only possessions he had were the clothes on his back.

"That's the kind of passion we're dealing with here," Michael Berg said.

Berg, who was unmarried, owned a small business that worked with communication equipment such as radio towers, and had traveled to Third World countries to help spread technology, his family said.

He saw his trip to Iraq, his father said, as an adventure, but one that fit into his ideology. He was a war supporter and backed the Bush administration.

Later in the day, the family withdrew into their gray two-story house and a spokesman, Bruce Hauser, a neighbor for 23 years, asked reporters to leave and give the family some privacy.

"He was one of the greatest kids you'd ever want to meet," said Hauser, a retired chemist. "I would be glad to label him as my own son."

Hauser said Berg was "a typical little kid. He loved to play ball, was very inquisitive, always wanted to help and sometimes offered better ways to do things" such as cutting down tree branches.

Reading a statement from the family, Hauser said the Bergs "wish to extend their sympathies to the other families who have also suffered. They are asking the Army to expedite the release of Nick's body so that the family can make arrangements and put this behind them."

Several neighbors on the heavily wooded block have dropped off items in the Bergs' mailbox and flowers by the garage. In early evening, a member of the local police force dropped off flowers that people had left at the station house for the family.

Later in the evening, neighbors gathered in a front yard across the street and a few doors down for a 20-minute candlelight vigil. At least 75 people recited the Lord's Prayer and sang "God Bless America."

Susan Mattern, 32, who grew up in the neighborhood and still lives there, said the vigil "shows we are going to support the Berg family. They need the support of their entire community, of the entire nation."

She said the neighbors telephoned one another. They weren't sure a candlelight vigil last night was appropriate, she said, but they felt they needed to do something.

His friends at the local YMCA said Berg worked out and swam several times a week, that he was interested in power lifting and that he was always quick with a joke.

"I would say he was a free spirit, very intelligent," said Nick Fillioe, a sports director at the West Chester Area YMCA, where Berg worked out. "He was a real smart guy. He knew a little bit about everything."

This story was supplemented with news service reports.

 

[atrdriver]

And this morning the top Yahoo story is "senators to watch more Iraqui abuse." What it should be is "lawmakers consider reprisal for murdered american." Regardless of what this guy was over there doing, or his religious background, the simple fact is that he was murdered in cold blood because he was an american. After the "prisoner abuse" story came out all the folks over there demanded apoligies from us, and we fell all over ourselves passing them out. What I want to know is where they are lining up to apologize to us?

atrdriver

 

[pa28cfi]

I agree, and I wasn't in any way trying to apologize for the terrorist I want to be very clear about that. I just think when people get carried away in the heat of the moment they need to be checked. We will not win the "hearts and minds" of the people in that video with any proganda, it will be done by the sword as it always is. Hitler was not stopped by winning the "hearts and minds" of the Nazi's, the Iraqi's are held captive just like the German people were held captive in WWII. It will take a long time, maybe a century, to bring the Arab world into the 21st century. It took a hundred years after the civil war to integrate the south, and that was not done by winning "hearts and minds" of the south but by the business end of a National Guard rifle. So I agree with you, but I think nuking Iraq as some are suggesting is not a resposible solution. When people say all Arabs need to be exterminated it's like the Arabs saying we're all Crusaders out to subjugate the Arab world. Extremism doesn't help anybody.

 

[jetexas]

atrdriver
Don't expect the liberal media to concentrate too much on things that might make the average American angry and pro-Iraq war/pro Bush.
If you will notice, along with the "more abuse photos" headlines, they are running clips that "Mr.Berg was advised to leave".
Well, Saddam was advised to cohere to UN mandates for 12 years, postured as if he had nukes, ran terrorist training camps and subjigated his own people beyond belief. We had a pretty good reason to go in there. Now WE are the evil ones and no one remembers the 300,000+ Iraqis, countless Iranians and Kuwaitis killed and the 5000 gassed kurds dead at the hands of a madman loose in a terrorist era. Desert Storm, the pictures of Saddam holding tritium triggers for nukes. His $25,000 a head for homicide bombers in Isreal and on and on and on.
Lets just forget about all that and 9/11 and concentrate on pictures of naked Iraqis (note, not beheaded Iraqis) who were under interrogation to try get info where Saddam was.

 

[redd]

Death and destruction follow war.

When I heard of this reprisal, I was saddened for the family of the man, this man's life was used as a pawn to further political causes, very unfortunate. I would assume that Bush's apology was taken as weakness by Middle Easterners .

There will never be peace in the Middle East, to strive with one another is part of their nature.

How long have Palistine and Israel been fighting?

What happened today reminded me of the Hatfields and Mcoys, a hate fued, back and forth with no resulution, with the hate just gaining mass like a big snowball rolling down a snowpacked hill.

 

[fulcrum]

Dont forget the 800 Kids that have died

Dont forget the 800 Kids that have died already ........................
poor kids father , man !! just makes me sick in the stomach looking at the old man.

 

[hagen]

I wished I had never downloaded it...

 

[Timebuilder]

It's an image I don't need in my head. I'll never get the WTC out of my mind, and I don't need this stored next to it.

This guy was from a town just a few miles south from me. We perhaps have three degrees of separation. Maybe only one, I'm not sure. While I was in NYC last night, they held a candlelight vigil for him in his hometown. Sometimes, when you are doing a good work, you will be vilified. That's the nature of fighting against evil: we as humans can only do so much. Even so, we must continue the struggle.

As much as I would like to drop a nuke on the whole place, it would be a poor example to the people there of the veracity of our beliefs and of our approach to freedom. Tempting and somewhat satisfying, but counter productive.

Erosion of freedom

WWII had been over for several years when I was born, so I have no direct knowledge of what it was like in those days, but my parents remember. My mother built airplanes in a defense plant, so it was no surprise that she married an RACF navigator. They have told me a lot.

During that time, people placed "restrictions" on their own "freedoms" and they did so willingly. Gas rationing, rubber and metal drives, and not speaking about things they knew. "Loose lips sink ships." The order of the day, Colonel Bill and my Jarhead friend, and I say that with affection, was to stand together, shoulder to shoulder, with victory in mind. We stood as one nation, and quite simply, served to save the world.

As we have seen, some have sought to politicize this conflict. While we have no modern Jane Fonda, we have those who cry loud and long about this war, as if it would somehow be more correct to fight it in New Jersey than in Iraq. Some say we should have waited until countries who are America's competitors in business and culture were all in agreement on Iraq. Some say we should not be there at all, despite the aspects of this brutal regime that both parties agreed were the case before going in. One guy claims he could have brokered a larger coalition. Baloney. Do you think the enemy is gladdened and emboldened when they hear a Kerry or Kennedy speech regarding Iraq? Do you think they become more fearful as the American left speaks, or do you think they believe we will send them to their fate?

For this enemy, this is a war, a jihad, against Christians, Jews, and moderate Muslims. They enjoyed killing Nick Berg because he was a Jew and an American. They feel that they have support here in our ranks. They follow an evil doctrine, one that we could no longer ignore after 9-11. We have been tasked, and we must answer.

There is no comparison between some naked prisoners displayed to women and this act against a civilian, the murder of thousands under Sadaam, and 9-11. We have to keep our priorities and our wits about us, and stay the course.

When you decide your heart leads you to dissent, ask yourself: "what would Osama do?" Then, remember that freedom is a delicious luxury that was given to you by the sacrifice of others, and that other people deserve that same chance to taste it.

 

[Pilot124]

Top story on MSN

Senators to view more photos
Senators are getting a look at more photos of American soldiers brutalizing Iraqi prisoners but won’t have the authority to release the pictures that the Pentagon warns could deepen international fury over the abuses.

That folks, is the top headline grabber. Days after the video was released. And the media doesn't try to control what we think??????

 

[jarhead]

Umm, I think that's our senators trying to control what we get to see, not the media trying to control what we see.

 

[Rabid Washcloth]

I saw the video yesterday and I was extremely nervous as the Windows Media player popped up on my screen. I've seen all kinds of gruesome clips on the internet, but this was by far the worst. Not as far as gore and violence, but the fact that the kid was helpless and had no idea it was coming. I watched it towards the end of my day and I was honestly too shaken to concentrate on work after viewing it.
Being a father to a 6 month old son, who all he does is grin at you when you look at him, I could not fathom anything like this ever happening to him. They did their job. They made me scared for my family's lives. To tell the truth, I was very close to tears yesterday.

 

[Dizel8]

"This is the price they have to pay for what they have done," said 33-year-old Omar Khateb, a labourer.

It was done according to Islamic Sharia, and the Americans should know that there is a price they will pay for the atrocities they commit."

About says it all, we continue to be viewed not as liberators, but as occupiers and infidels, whose lives are worthless.

 

[Pilot124]

Umm, I think that's our senators trying to control what we get to see, not the media trying to control what we see.

My point is that it is not even the top story. I just copied and pasted that, I didn't write it jar head.

 

[Big Duke Six]

Good, hooray for the Senators. At least someone has finally gotten the clue that the American media is irresponsible. I don't know when it all started, but somewhere along the line the majority of the public here has come to believe that the words "Interrogation", "beheading" and "Muslim fanatics" were just black words on white paper. Well, now we see it all and apparently we can't handle the reality of what those words really mean. Our "outrage" over this is laughable.

And we're in it up to our butts folks, so we'd better wise up, thicken up our collective skins and quit whining about what we may or may not have done to these freakin' prisoners. We need to see this for what is is, beat these guys and get on with our lives. I'm not willing to give up my future as a free American citizen just to conform to what Kennedy and the rest feel is the right way to handle prisoners in custody. They are so far out of touch with what really happens in the world it is just sick, and embarrassing. There is no disputing that this whole thing blew up because of the bogus outrage of a few liberals in government and the media.

One female "news"person on CBS this morning tried to get a US Army Sgt to say that he thought Rumsfeld should take the hit for what happened in Abu Ghraib. She was leading him as if he had a leash on. I was proud of him as he said that it was up to each indivdual soldier to interpret his orders, and not carry them out if they feel they are unlawful. For her part, it was a sick perverted example of how these do-good liberal media types are trying to shape our foreign and military policy, and I'M SICK OF IT!!!!!!!

 

[Timebuilder]

"This is the price they have to pay for what they have done," said 33-year-old Omar Khateb, a labourer.

It was done according to Islamic Sharia, and the Americans should know that there is a price they will pay for the atrocities they commit."

About says it all, we continue to be viewed not as liberators, but as occupiers and infidels, whose lives are worthless.

Here's what it says to me.

It says we may indeed need to wipe out as many as these evil followers as we can.

It says that these are not typical views of the average Iraqi. It is the view of someone who is undeserving of sympathy, respect, or mercy.

It says that this is a war we must win, here and wherever it is presented.

 

[Bandit60]

Is everyone still outraged at the U.S. treatment of Iraq prisoners?