ALPA Unit 2

[Tejas-Jet]

ATC does it all the time ... and they aint in d'back.

Really??? That doesn't happen to me. Where do you fly?

Tejas

 

[YourPilotFriend]

Unit 2 reached a TA today. They will be back to work tomorrow.

Now we can get the updated news articles on the website. That's about the only thing i noticed when they were on strike.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Simply put a lot of the administration of the organization could be moved to a cheaper location. Real estate isn't the only consideration (That building is worth several million dollars by the way). Salaries, costs of living, costs of business and many other factors come into play.

The best way to address this is through a "Rez O. Lewshun" ( Resolution) at your next LEC meeting.

Let us know how the vote goes. After all, it is a membership driven organization...if only the nmembership would get involved.

Tejas

 

[Flyerjosh]

The best way to address this is through a "Rez O. Lewshun" ( Resolution) at your next LEC meeting.

Let us know how the vote goes. After all, it is a membership driven organization...if only the nmembership would get involved.

Tejas

Tejas,

I'd be all for it, but as it stands my MEC/LEC was dissolved in January when my former employer (IDE) tanked. I'm no longer an active member in ALPA, which is fine by me. I'd much rather have my salary and benefits based on my own personal performance and negotiate for my high standards, rather than those of the lowest common demoninator.

9 months on the job so far, 2 pay increases, and no headbutting with upper level managment. I'll take it.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Tejas,

I'd be all for it, but as it stands my MEC/LEC was dissolved in January when my former employer (IDE) tanked. I'm no longer an active member in ALPA, which is fine by me. .

But yet you have no problem starting a thread that advocates people move to Bismark, ND. Basically be concessionary....

If you are no longer involved and have a stake in ALPA...why do you care?

I'd much rather have my salary and benefits based on my own personal performance and negotiate for my high standards, rather than those of the lowest common demoninator..

What does this have to do with anything? As a pilot, what performance? You shoot ILS's better than the other guy? I don't get it?

9 months on the job so far, 2 pay increases, and no headbutting with upper level managment. I'll take it.

Easy come....easy go.....

I'm all for competitive wages and fair salaries, but there also has to be some fiscal responsibility

And you will also take your unilateral paycuts and termination whenever managmeent decides.... if this is really not an issue at your company.. then none of this thread is an issue as well....

Why do you have to push some other group down all while saying "I got mine"???

 

[Flyerjosh]

But yet you have no problem starting a thread that advocates people move to Bismark, ND. Basically be concessionary....

If you are no longer involved and have a stake in ALPA...why do you care?

What does this have to do with anything? As a pilot, what performance? You shoot ILS's better than the other guy? I don't get it?

Easy come....easy go.....

And you will also take your unilateral paycuts and termination whenever managmeent decides.... if this is really not an issue at your company.. then none of this thread is an issue as well....

Why do you have to push some other group down all while saying "I got mine"???

Res,

You're undying commitment to ALPA is quite impressive. I only wish that so many people were willing to step up and be as active as you are (I am assuming at least that somehow you're involved in the union based on previous posts and knowledge).

In response to your last post:

You're correct. I am no longer an active participant in ALPA. Less by choice than by necessity. You see, the state of the industry is such that me as a furloughee had two choices:

Start over at another regional airline at $18-20K and wait an additional 3 years to upgrade again (since I didn't have the magic 1000 turbine PIC), or find something that actually compensated me fairly for my experience. You tell me what you would have chosen.

Second, I may no longer be a dues paying member, but I am still a member of ALPA in GOOD STANDING (at least that's what the website says when I log on). As such, I think that I am entitled to my opinion (whether you like it or not).

I'm happy for the unit 2 employees that have apparently been able to reach a tentative agreement. All power to them for their ability to negotiate.

However I am concerned that ALPA no longer operates as an organization that keeps it's best interests in mind with regards to the finances of the operation. Like it or not, ALPA is a BUSINESS. It's a business that generates political capital as well as financial capital. It might look like a non-profit, but the truth is the intent of ALPA is to increase it's own revenues through political action and skillful bargining that results in higher pay for pilots, thus increasing the unions coffers.

I've seen incredibly wasteful spending at many levels of the union. I'm not saying that anybody is crooked, but it does upset me to see local reps using union dues for golf and filet mignon while attending the national convention.

But back to why do I care... like it or not, even though I'm away from the airlines, what happens in one corner of this industry impacts the other corners as well. When pay goes down at one carrier, it affects pay EVERYWHERE including corporate operations. Airlines don't just affect pay either- their ups and downs can directly affect the costs of my operations (take for instance the ongoing user fee debate.)

I certainly think there's a place in the industry for the union. However I also think that right now, in its current state, ALPA IS BROKEN. There are too many different needs, too many drivers, and too many unanswered questions.

Oh and one other thing... what's wrong with Bismarck, ND? I lived there for 18 months and thought it was great! Good people with great work ethic, a nice city, affordable living and good schools. Even the weather becomes bearable once you figure it out. There's a bunch of reasons that a good number of major corporations have ADMINISTRATIVE SUPPORT OFFICES in Bismarck.

 

[Flyerjosh]

Oh one other thing...

Your signature: "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors. - Plato"

Kind of funny since I'm trying to participate, but keep getting shot down by you. Does the fact that I can't vote mean that I'm no longer eligible to participate at least thru discussion? Or is it just because I don't see things exactly as you do about ALPA?

 

[Atlanta Vicks]

If you want to play ball with the players you have to go to the field. The field doesn't come to you. (unless you are Chuck Norris)

Chuck Norris can speak Braille!

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I'm happy for the unit 2 employees that have apparently been able to reach a tentative agreement. All power to them for their ability to negotiate. .

Would've been nice if you had simply said that instead of deporting them to God Forsaken places like Bismark, ND

I've seen incredibly wasteful spending at many levels of the union. I'm not saying that anybody is crooked, but it does upset me to see local reps using union dues for golf and filet mignon while attending the national convention. .

A big misconception and deep insult. Don't talk about what you don't know.

The filet mignon is a scooby snack compared to the value and work that local reps do for thier pilots. If ALPA reps were able to bill the membership for the hourly work they did, you'd glady trade it all for a steak and a round of golf.

Some ALPA reps put 15 hours of work in a week. Let's say the average pay at your previous regional was $60/hr. That is $900 a week of value that the membership is getting from that volunteer. Now.... you want to insult ALPA volunteers by calling them out on a $25 steak during a working dinner!

Incredulous!!!

But back to why do I care... like it or not, even though I'm away from the airlines, what happens in one corner of this industry impacts the other corners as well. When pay goes down at one carrier, it affects pay EVERYWHERE including corporate operations. Airlines don't just affect pay either- their ups and downs can directly affect the costs of my operations (take for instance the ongoing user fee debate.).

Then care. Don't complain. Understand, don't insult.

I certainly think there's a place in the industry for the union. However I also think that right now, in its current state, ALPA IS BROKEN. There are too many different needs, too many drivers, and too many unanswered questions..

ALPA isn't broken. It just isn't living up to expectations. Expectations that aren't necessarily valid. You can't get blood from a stone.

ATTENTION ALPA MEMBERS! The industry is in total ruins! there is no money to negoatiate from the poorly run companies! Until management either gets into an up cylce or they stop being incompetant, ALPA cannot create an oasis in the desert! If they can please tell us HOW!!

Let's put it this way... why the cylce returns and so does growth, and pilots are getting pay raises and disposable income... all of you reactive ALPA members will forget these bad times and go back to your hobbies. Rather, you should be learning from your mistakes so when the next down turn occurs we will be ready...... but we won't. Let me guess it is not your responsibility.

Oh and one other thing... what's wrong with Bismarck, ND? I lived there for 18 months and thought it was great! Good people with great work ethic, a nice city, affordable living and good schools. Even the weather becomes bearable once you figure it out. There's a bunch of reasons that a good number of major corporations have ADMINISTRATIVE SUPPORT OFFICES in Bismarck.

Start your own union then. Make it better than ALPA, convert the membership and hire Bismarkian secretaries!

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Oh one other thing...

Your signature: "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors. - Plato"

Kind of funny since I'm trying to participate, but keep getting shot down by you. Does the fact that I can't vote mean that I'm no longer eligible to participate at least thru discussion? Or is it just because I don't see things exactly as you do about ALPA?

Don't make it sound like you brought positive discussion to the table and you got shut out.

Discuss all you want, but bring something positive to the table.

All you did was whine about it and now you are trying to throw out a guilt trip....

I am not "All things ALPA".

ALPA has big problems.... BIG!

But if anything is to change... if we are to shift the paradigm, re-boot the system or shake up the organization....

Then membership has to do it! And the memebership must be informed and educated.

You guys have got to do better than this.... otherwise the power players are going to keep the power...