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ALPA to DL: No givebacks for now

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I have to say that I am encouraged to hear so much support from pilots of other airlines. Too many times on this board the Delta pilots have been criticized for our fight to keep our salaries at the levels appropriate to this profession.

Thanks for the support. Thanks to my MEC. GREAT JOB!

I know that we will probably still end up giving some concessions, and perhaps some are needed. But we will not just roll over to whatever mgt demands. Our futures are tied to this airline, unlike any of theirs.
 
Gen Lee,

Just a few questions for you...this is not flamebait by any means. Do you know if this situation of not accepting the 22% cut is a situation where A) DALPA doesn't want any cuts period so find another way to cut costs, or B) DALPA would take a cut, but just not 22%...ie, "the Delta solution to a Delta problem."

There was a good article in the Chicago Tribune recently about the pay disparity between the various majors. Sorry, I deleted the link I had to it, but it printed firm numbers to the differences between mainline and AA/UA/others. (I'm guessing that Virginia Ave does have a subscription to the Tribune and probably walked into negotiations with copies in hand.) However, I do agree that it is -somewhat- inaccurate to compare the Big Three pilot contracts for various reasons....namely financial stability (everyone's losing cash, but DL is just losing less and is for once making a profit thanks to the Gov't) and the fact that the numbers printed for UA and AA are current and do not reflect what they were before wage concessions.

I think it is realistic to expect that some concessions will occur, although I absolutely agree with the stance that it should not only come from the pilots. However, now bear with me here, you have to at least be able to see mgmt's stance that you are Priority #1 for -some form- of wage concessions...you are by far the largest expenditure on the company payroll, and even with some wage cuts you could still be at the top. And they have the advantage of being able to put your furloughs back to work if A) the company returns to making a profit, B)has the ability to grow Mainline (NOT at the expense of DCI), and C) the flying public continues to fill seats.
This is just my 0.02, but I think that mgmt is dealing with your concessions completely independent of the other occupational workgroups in the company because they don't want to incite problems within the FA's/TechOps/Ramp Workers/etc and drive them to bring the IAM/Teamsters/etc onto the property. Mgmt has to be pretty happy that the only union in the company is DALPA, and the rank-and-file certainly must enjoy not having to pay union dues.

Obviously, the DALPA response will be that they will only accept concessions if they are evenly applied throughout the company, including upper mgmt and their golden parachutes/pension. Again, I agree with this stance, as long as it does not turn into another case of "Full Pay to the Last Day."
...Heck, what do I know, I'm just a pilot that wants to find the balance between having a job but not being paid $19.02 an hour in 2035 when I'm left seat in N880DA to RJAA. Good luck guys.

Regards,

ProLine4

PS- Speaking of RJAA (Tokyo-Narita), mainline's now down to 4 M11s? I think that's ahead of the schedule I read a while back. 801, 802, and 804 are supposed to stick around until January, by then they should have 3 of the 772ER's equipped with the OCRF.
 
I know there's been a lot of CMR/DAL animosity on these boards, but I'm sure I speak for many when I say that I'm behind you 100%. Labor is an easy target...it's awesome that you are holding your ground. I don't expect or want to see anyone up at big D give a dime.

A first year MD with a specialty can easily make 200k+ right out of residency. No one bats an eye. You tell someone you're an airline pilot and they assume/expect that you make good money as well. What's wrong with demanding it as an educated and highly trained professional?! Screw this race to the bottom.

my 2 cents.
 
Way to go big D!

Way to take a stand guys!

I hope everyone in negotiations (or about to be) in the Delta family and elsewhere have the brass ones the Delta MEC does.

You guy's response to management's shameless robber baron plundering was accurate, professional and right on.

This is one Comair pilot who is very proud of the way y'all are handling this, and I know I'm not alone.
 
Proline4,

I was impressed by your response and you questions. You seem to be very well versed on this subject. I'll try to answer some of your questions---with my opinions of course.

1. Pay disparity between majors. Yes, we have a large pay disparity between AA and UA. Our 12 year 767-400 FO's make $30 more an hour than AA or UA 777 Capts. Some could say, "God Bless America" and be done with it. Delta never bought a carrier like TWA that helped drain AA, and fortunately we did not lose a plane on 9-11. We do not have the same problems as those two airlines, and we have had better liquidity than all of the majors. But, we do share a common problem---some major debt---that we will have to help fix, and that is why I still believe we will eventually give back some pay--in the range of 10-15%. But, as I have already stated, the union stated clearly that we are only a part of the solution, and huge Exec bonuses etc. will not happen when we take cuts.

2. Largest expenditure--pilots. That probably is true. We also are the only group with a union, and that means we pay monthly dues to protect ourselves. The other groups choose not to do this, and are open to pay attacks. We know that we are expensive as a group, and we were willing to give some back--but for a price. Hopefully this is all a big cycle, and things will rebound like they always do---but when that happens --can't we have back what we earned through contract negotiations? No says management---even though they continue to get huge bonuses and lots of options that make them very rich. We know this is a rough part in our industry, but what about when better times return? To say that the economy will never return or that business travellers will always buy cheap tickets is wrong. Nobody knows if that will be true---and if better times return we would like to have back what we negotiated.

3. The company has the advantage of putting furloughs back to work. Well, not really. We are trying to force them to put some back to work with grievances. We have a nO Furlough Clause that states pretty plainly that regardless of the state of the economy of profitability or UNPROFITABILITY of the airline, no furloughs. They have successfully used the war emergency clause to furlough a further 250, but since the war is over (according to Bush after he "landed" on the carrier) and the loads have returned, those 250 should return soon after we get that grievance trial going. The other 1060 will supposedly start to return when we reach pre-9-11 RPM levels. That is something that Delta has control over---but to base your business plan and return to profitability on the return of 1060 pilots is not very logical. Those 1060 pilots would not return all at once---instead in trickle form--maybe 60 a month etc. We also have been retiring quite a few lately due to the low GATT rate, which will eventually help.

4. I agree with your stance that Delta does not want any more unions, and that is the main reason they are not targeting the other employee groups. That is another reason why our airline is more efficient than other airlines---Delta can impose things on their employees that the other majors cannot due to contracts.

5. Full pay to the last day. I don't think our pilots generally think this way. We know that we are very well paid and have great jobs. We were willing to give some pay back, but with a snapback or contract extension. What is wrong with that? We didn't have to enter negotiations, but we did. We just added some reasonable limits---like an extension, not being the only ones to give, and not comparing us to the other majors that had more problems than we have. Management didn't like the "everyone should give including themselves" and said no way. Aren't we all in this together? They don't think so I guess.

6. Tokyo NRT. I thought we only had 3 MD-11s left, but it may be 4. I know that Dalpa is NOT giving in to management their request to delay the install of the 2 additional "Condos" into 2 more 777's for eventual ATL-NRT service. Those should be installed as the MD-11s are parked. I have ridden in the "upper deck" Condo in the sole 777 to Rome and I thought it was great. There are 2 first class seats with personal TVs and two bunks behind them, and this is all above the first class section of seats.

Well, I hope this helped and it will be interesting to watch where all of this goes. I want Delta to succeed and thrive, but just not off our backs exclusively.

Bye Bye--General Lee:cool: :rolleyes: ;)
 
Wow, glad to see a few people don't think Delta pilots = Diabolical fiends from the heart of Hades.

Great job DALPA on not just throwing money into the Executive bonus and retirement accounts. Perhaps DAL management could lead by example in making sacrifices for the good of the company.
 
ya nailed it General Lee

It seems like most of your posts on other threads are negative, but this one you just did is probably your best. I'd like to copy and paste it to every contract negotioation on every other airline thread.

Airlines should not cut labor's costs without management taking the same percentage out of their own compensation. Any costs cut should snapback in profitable industry upturns.

Way to go Delta!
 
Cadillac,

I don't try to be negative on the other threads---I want everyone to do well. The only thing I dislike is the senority resignation issue for Delta furloughs at Comair. Besides that, I don't complain much. But, you're right about what I said---If we need to take cuts, then everyone should share in the giving.

Bye Bye--General Lee:cool: :rolleyes: ;)
 
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