ALPA on Emirates and Etihad

[fareview]

Emirates is doing lots for American jobs by ordering 100+ 777s. FlyDubai 50 738s

Look for a whopping record order for the 777X at the DXB air show fall '13...all bringing billions of dollars to an American co. and thus Unle Sam. Take the blinkers off.

fv

 

[Flopgut]

It seems like the guys in the US who have decent jobs at major airlines can see the light and can remember what this job used to be like. For everyone else it's sour grapes and their rooting for the other team.

Yep...

Emirates is doing lots for American jobs by ordering 100+ 777s. FlyDubai 50 738s

Stop the BS abuse and US airlines might be just as successful as US airplane builders. US leads in all things aerospace, except airlines.

 

[dicko]

Cut them some slack. They get a free limo to/from the compound. And their FA's are hot. So it's all good.

Hey Goggles. You know they don't have compounds right ? They live in Villas of apartments just like normal people. But you're right, they do get rides to and from work and the FAs are smokin..

Yes, I'd rather work for Delta but the xenophobic misconceptions about Emirates are odd. Eitihad or Qatar on the other hand ......

 

[GogglesPisano]

Sorry. Just repeating what I read on FI as the best selling points of working there.

 

[Jetjockey]

Yah...the flight attendants are smoking hot..........

That's what I'm looking for in a career.

 

[Green]

Yah...the flight attendants are smoking hot..........

That's what I'm looking for in a career.

First year total compensation is about $150,000USD. 42 days of vacation per year. Virtually tax free. Layovers anywhere you want to go. Driven to and from work (actually makes a difference after a long day). Upgrade has been running around 3.5 years on the 777. 130 or so nationalities working in the flight deck.

Not all the FA's are smoking hot but out of a crew of 15+ there are always some hotties. It's not so bad having a Rio layover with 15 girls in their 20's from every corner of the globe. As for the moral laws, Dubai can be as wild as it gets. Just no PDA in public. Nightclubs everywhere and it's definitely a playground for the wealthy. If you prefer the quiet family life that is available as well.

Emirates will fire you if you screw up. They don't tolerate deviating from the company rules. They are very punitive. But the overall experience is as good as any US airline in my opinion. I have to say it's a bit embarrassing traveling on some of the US carriers nowadays. I fly with pilots from everywhere and they all want to know how the US airlines got to be so f@ked up.

If EK ever gets a foothold in the US it's going to be hard on the local carriers. They absolutely cannot compete with the Emirates product. The US needs to step up it's game.

 

[Furloughed80]

They absolutely cannot compete with the Emirates product. The US needs to step up it's game.

It's not a matter of stepping up our game. EK has advantages in terms of tax policy, labor costs/rules, and financing that western airlines will never be able to duplicate. Why do you refuse to acknowledge this?

 

[flyboyike]

I enjoyed this part of ALPAs blurb -

"Furthermore, the U.A.E. airlines do not need to adhere to labor relations rules comparable to those that govern our domestic carriers"

I'd rather work for Emirates than any of the sweatshop regional carriers, and some of the big carriers that ALPA represents.

Amen.

 

[Jetjockey]

If EK ever gets a foothold in the US it's going to be hard on the local carriers. They absolutely cannot compete with the Emirates product. The US needs to step up it's game.

If US airlines were "state sponsored", and didn't have to deal with pesky labor laws, have unions outlawed, could fire anyone they didn't like, got fuel at government subsidized rate, low landing fees at the home hub,..............I'm sure the US airlines could "step up its game".

The fact is, at the end of the day you work for a quasi government entity in a foreign land where they hate US citizens.

For me, I'm a proud American who believes in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. I'll keep my family right here in the best country in the world.

 

[jonjuan]

Don't forget to wipe after that burrito dump in sand land.

 

[Jetjockey]

State Department website http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1050.html

My favorite excerpts:
U.S. citizens in the United Arab Emirates should exercise a high level of security awareness. The Department of State remains concerned about the global threat of terrorism, including the possibility of terrorist attacks against U.S. citizens and interests in the Persian Gulf and Arabian Peninsula. Both historical and current information suggest that al-Qaida and affiliated organizations continue to plan attacks against Western targets; these attacks may employ a wide variety of tactics including suicide operations, assassination, kidnapping, hijacking, and bombing. U.S. citizens should maintain a low profile, vary routes and times for all required travel, and treat mail and packages from unfamiliar sources with caution.

Incidents of verbal and physical harassment as well as isolated cases involving assault of expatriate women have occurred, including some incidents of harassment by taxi drivers. On more than one occasion, expatriate females have been sexually assaulted while walking alone through underground pedestrian walkways near the Abu Dhabi Corniche. Female travelers should keep in mind the cultural differences among the many people who coexist in the UAE and should be cognizant that unwitting actions may invite unwanted attention. Taxi passengers should avoid sitting in the front seat of a taxicab and should be sensitive that "small talk" can be misinterpreted as over-friendliness or even a form of propositioning by some taxi drivers
As each Emirate has its own independent judicial system, legal procedures and penalties vary throughout the country. Penalties for breaking the law can be more severe than in the United States for similar offenses. Persons violating Emirati laws, even unknowingly, may be expelled, arrested, imprisoned, or prevented from traveling and their passport held by local authorities for extended periods of time. U.S. citizens have been arrested in the past for obscene hand gestures, using inappropriate (foul) language with a police official, and for public displays of affection, such as kissing.

Consuming or possessing alcohol without a Ministry of Interior liquor permit is illegal and could result in arrest and/or fines and imprisonment.

U.S. citizens have at times become involved in disputes of a commercial nature that have prompted local firms or courts to take possession of the U.S. citizen's passport, effectively preventing the individual from leaving the UAE until the dispute is resolved. In addition, local firms have been known to leverage the UAE criminal justice system in an attempt to coerce and/or strengthen their negotiation stance during commercial disputes by filing criminal complaints, which may lead not only to travel restrictions but possible criminal penalties, including jail time. A list of local attorneys capable of representing U.S. citizens in such matters is available from the Consular and Commercial sections of the U.S. Embassy in Abu Dhabi and the U.S. Consulate General in Dubai.

Traffic accidents are a leading cause of death in the UAE. According to the World Health Organization, the UAE has the highest rate of road fatalities in the Middle East and one of the highest rates in the world. Drivers often drive at high speeds. Unsafe driving practices are common, especially on inter-city highways. On highways, unmarked speed bumps and drifting sand create additional hazards. Pedestrians should also use great care on the roads of the UAE –over 25 percent of road fatalities are pedestrians.

 

[Varmint]

If US airlines were "state sponsored", and didn't have to deal with pesky labor laws, have unions outlawed, could fire anyone they didn't like, got fuel at government subsidized rate, low landing fees at the home hub,..............I'm sure the US airlines could "step up its game".

The fact is, at the end of the day you work for a quasi government entity in a foreign land where they hate US citizens.

For me, I'm a proud American who believes in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. I'll keep my family right here in the best country in the world.

Keep chest thumping. The US government and the unions are ruining aviation in the US, not any foreign carrier. Until blame is accepted where it is due instead of being passed off to anything but the real reason, nothing will change.

 

[Jetjockey]

Some don't mind being a subject of His Highness Sheikh Ahmed Bin Saeed Al Maktoum, and the rest of the Royal family who control the country.

ex·pa·tri·ate (

k-sp

tr

-

t

)v. ex·pa·tri·at·ed, ex·pa·tri·at·ing, ex·pa·tri·ates
v.tr.1. To send into exile. See Synonyms at banish.
2. To remove (oneself) from residence in one's native land.

v.intr.1. To give up residence in one's homeland.
2. To renounce allegiance to one's homeland.

n. (-

t, -

t

)1. One who has taken up residence in a foreign country.
2. One who has renounced one's native land.

 

[fletch717]

I have a few friends in the UAE. They are just regular guys with a pretty good flying job. They don't feel like they are subjects to anyone anymore than you working for "The Man"

 

[Flopgut]

If US airlines were "state sponsored", and didn't have to deal with pesky labor laws, have unions outlawed, could fire anyone they didn't like, got fuel at government subsidized rate, low landing fees at the home hub,..............I'm sure the US airlines could "step up its game".

The fact is, at the end of the day you work for a quasi government entity in a foreign land where they hate US citizens.

For me, I'm a proud American who believes in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. I'll keep my family right here in the best country in the world.

Looking at the big picture, I think we get a worse deal out of the Railway Labor Act in this Country than what the EK pilots get out of the seemingly harsher labor laws over there. I'd drop my union if we could also drop the RLA.

I fly with pilots from everywhere and they all want to know how the US airlines got to be so f@ked up.

I'm surprised there would be any confusion. The Emir funds and nurtures his worldwide airline, Uncle Sam is disgusted with and steals from US airlines. The situations could not possibly be more opposite.

 

[overseas boy]

big·ot(b

g

t)
n. One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ

 

[fareview]

Presumably all you righteous labor enthusiasts don't drive any GM, Ford vehicles made in Mexico & Canada...(I assume you all drive American cars - after all the alternative just wouldn't be patriotic now would it?)

....as to your iPads (An Ameriacm co. With over $100bn in cash that refuses to open a factory in the US)...keep buying them because at EK we shift them by the plane load out of China & Vietnam.

As to the great American corporations call centers...cue Manila & Bangalore.

If your airline bought Hyundai maintenance vehicles to save on the bottom line, used foreign call centers to save on the bottom line, bought their 1st class silverware from China to save on the bottom line...you guys have no issues.

But it's this righteous revolution you all go on about when you perceive it to affect you the line jockey that's laughable.

For goodness sake tell your mgt not to fly to these countries with dictators if you feel so strongly about it....oh wait a minute, "morals to the wall - that will affect MY pay"

Talk about the pot calling the....oh never mind.

fv

 

[Green]

Yeah it's classic reading the complaints talking about the lack of labor rights etc when half the posters are probably using apple products built by virtual slaves in China. Wonder how many suicides at Foxcon lately?

There are no unions but as a first year FO you will have more vacation and make more money than the vast majority of FO's in the US. I'm surprised the Foreign carriers aren't complaining about the US ability to cancel pensions, unload billions in debt via Ch11, use cheap pilot labor (starting wages 40k!?), and impose massive pay cuts on the entire work force (excl. mgt of course). How is Ch 11 much different from state subsidies? And just to set the record straight EK pays the same for fuel as every other airline landing in Dubai. The government doesn't tax them to death as is the case with most US and European airlines.

Not trying to defend EK but it's not as cut and dry as you might think. Trying to paint the US Airlines as good, stand up corporations that are trying to compete in an unfair world is laughable. That said I would much rather live in the US. It's too bad that corporate america has been so successful at destroying the middle class.

Flopgut,

I was talking about European, South American, African, Asian pilots wondering how the US got so bad compared to the rest of the world. Not just pilots from the state sponsored carriers. The US product seems to be the worst out there from a customer service/cabin crew friendliness perspective. Hopefully it is getting better.

 

[johnsonrod]

I only see Emirates/Qatar/Etihad having influence over US carriers on flights to the Middle East and India/Pakistan. True that both areas are huge markets, but these ME airlines can't have big impacts on the traditional US trade markets like Europe, South America or even East Asia (i.e., Japan, Korea or Hong Kong).

Again, IMO Turkish Airlines remains the stealth carrier to watch for given their growth ambitions. The European carriers have the most to lose because the Euro domestic market is super-competitive with Ryanair, Easyjet and Vueling and their once-profitable long-haul flying is losing ground to Turkish and the ME carriers.

 

[8sugarsugar]

I only see Emirates/Qatar/Etihad having influence over US carriers on flights to the Middle East and India/Pakistan. True that both areas are huge markets, but these ME airlines can't have big impacts on the traditional US trade markets like Europe, South America or even East Asia (i.e., Japan, Korea or Hong Kong).

Again, IMO Turkish Airlines remains the stealth carrier to watch for given their growth ambitions. The European carriers have the most to lose because the Euro domestic market is super-competitive with Ryanair, Easyjet and Vueling and their once-profitable long-haul flying is losing ground to Turkish and the ME carriers.

Didn't anyone read the big thread about 5th freedom rights and Emirates' application to fly Milan-JFK? Like, passengers buying tickets on Emirates on the JFK-Milan sector and not going through Dubai?