ALPA dues at work....protecting itself!

[get2flyin]

"ALPA dues at work...protecting itself." At YOUR expense, no doubt?

How do you think the West feels about USAPA?

"USAPA dues at work...protecting USAir East", at MY expense.

Betcha didn't see it that way...

 

[LearLove]

You either are or are not receiving a US Airways paycheck on the cutoff date.

You USAPA guys think that the rules are infinitely flexible and that if something doesn't suit your needs/wants/agenda, you can just change things up mid process.

PR - then why since 7/9/07 (my recall date) have I had money put into my US retirement account. what about the US profit share check I got last month. I'd call that pay.

USAPA changing the rules - are you freaking kidding - thats like ALPA's mode of operation to the max.

Like I've said in other posts, I see both side however after this crap USAPA just got my vote.

 

[waveflyer]

Is any of this going to change anyone's mind w/ less than a week to go?

Really- can we get past the emotion?

AAA pilots- you've seen the worst of our seniority system- will you help those of us trying to set up a guild and look at the viability of a NSL? We're going to need help from ALL the unions ALPA/SWAPA/IPA/APA/NPA/TEAMSTERS- we have to start working on a solution so that w/ every merger we're not warring w/ each other so hard that we miss the rare opportunities to increase our contracts.

One thing is for sure-= no matter the outcome of this war- It's not going to be the last- we should all be working on a solution.

 

[SaturnPilot]

I agree with Rez....I too think that USAPA will win this one.

It probably isn't gonna be all that bad. Remember SWAPA once had their day 1...and they just celebrated their 30th anniversary.

And how long has it been since the AA pilots left the "Mother Ship"?

I agree that SWAPA and APA have been successful, but their core goals are not at the expense of almost half of their pilot groups. They have also not had to deal with almost half of their pilot group refusing to pay dues. Lets not forget that USAPA needs a $200 donation from every pilot just to run ONE election. They're going to have a lot of bills come due soon with less than half of the dues revenue they could have with everybody paying.

The communication from USAPA that started this thread is kind of amusing considering they are a "union" that will completely ignore and trample on the entire pilot group from the West.

 

[pilotss]

Newhire here,

I have never heard from ALPA so much before in my last 10 years of commercial aviation then now. I get 1 sometimes 2 mailings a day. I had to turn off their emails because I would see one almost every day.

I have worked at non union carriers that were fair, Teamsters carriers, ALPA carriers that needed a union and carriers transitioning to ALPA desperately needing a union.

I have watched unions allow undercutting union busting carriers screw their fellow Trans States pilots and allow them in their fold.

It is disturbing to me that thousands in union funds are being sent out in mailings. Mailings I cannot turn off. It tells me that ALPA has been neglectful of its fold having to remind them of what it has achieved in the past years. It tells me ALPA is weak in its membership that are not actively participating enough. It shows me ALPA is not united and not effective enough. In the end unions have become a business. And business is about the income statement and your job second or your job first if it positively affects the income statement.

Name the last few ALPA presidents you have cheered? Even before this debacle of seniority I would always hear unsolicited grumblings in the cockpit to the crew room. When was the last time you heard " that ______, what a guy!"

ALPA this and ALPA that. I think any union would have done what ALPA has accomplished and ALPA itself is not entirely special. ALPA is scared now of losing dues at US and other carriers and I think that is good. I hope that USAPA whether voted in or not will make ALPA a stronger, refreshed, new union.

Who really "Flies the line" these days?
Very few.

 

[TWA Dude]

I agree that SWAPA and APA have been successful, ...

Just want to point out there's little that's been "successful" about these unions that hasn't come from the success of their employers. Is there ever a struggling airline where the pilots are happy with their union? Look at how many pilots on message boards think the union should somehow fix the industry.

I'm an APA member in addition to ALPA and I can say there's nothing superior about either organization. The AA pilots still have their A Plan only because they gave sufficient concessions in 2003 to prevent the company from going Chapter 11. There's no real reason to put the independent unions on a pedastal. If Southwest ever starts struggling financially I guarantee SWAPA will have a real hard time adjusting to dealing with a less friendly employer.

 

[TWA Dude]

It is disturbing to me that thousands in union funds are being sent out in mailings.

Funny you should say that. Back in 2001, one of the many complaints the TWA pilots had about ALPA was how little they did to support us when we were fighting against the APA in our merger. At the very least every ALPA pilot should've been well-informed about our struggle.

Now, ALPA is facing a battle against a raider and you are "disturbed" they have the gall to agressively fight it! Pilots like you would probably criticize ALPA no matter what tactic it uses.

 

[regionaltard]

I agree with Rez....I too think that USAPA will win this one.

It probably isn't gonna be all that bad. Remember SWAPA once had their day 1...and they just celebrated their 30th anniversary.

And how long has it been since the AA pilots left the "Mother Ship"?

There is no meaningful basis for comparison between USAPA and either APA or SWAPA.

 

[Crzipilot]

The NMB requires that those who vote are 'regularly working in the craft or class on and after the cutoff date', which was 11/13/07. If you were recalled, but not on property, that doesn't count. Same for anyone hired after 11/13.

Yes, it sucks for the 15 people who accepted recall but were not in class on the 13th. You either are or are not receiving a US Airways paycheck on the cutoff date. Are you going to claim the policy was flawed again after you lose? Maybe try to oust the NMB?

You USAPA guys think that the rules are infinitely flexible and that if something doesn't suit your needs/wants/agenda, you can just change things up mid process.

Actually it looks like it was ALPA that was trying to overstep. NMB just ruled that as long as you are on property by the end of voting you can vote. I believe ALPA wanted the cutoff date of Nov 13. NMB said April 17th. There are some on LOA which the NMB is saying are ineligble, others are eligble. Net Net, from the whole list I believe it is 28 people that have been determined as ineligible. As they are working for Jet Blue or another "carrier", or have retired, or can't get a medical.

So after all the BS bickering back and forth between USAPA/ALPA/USAIRWAYS final ruling is there are 5241 eligible voters. Don't know how it's split east/west though.

 

[PositiveRate]

thanks for the update.

bytheway, your idea on the other thread about ALPA wasn't half bad.