ALPA better be ready--they have a golden opportunity the next 2 yrs!

BOOZENEWS

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If there is a chance to save the industry it is in the next 2 yrs.

First off I am a registered independent and vote across party lines regularly. I am not a partisan.

That being said, the Dems will soon control the WH, have a filibuster proof maj in the house and have 57 seats in the senate.

Even in you strongly disagree with the dems when it comes to a lot of issues (I do), you have to admit they ARE more labor friendly than the GOP.

Obama has a VOTING RECORD of being pro-labor. If history is any indication he will appoint friendly members to the NMB.



Now to the point.


ALPA must AGRESSIVELY work with the House, Senate and WH to pass legislation that will DRASTICALLY alter the RLA.

I propose the following:


A 6 month period of dircet negiotations after the amend date of the contract.

If no agreement is reached, then another 6 months of negotiations overseen by the NMB shall take place.

If still nothing, than an automatic 30 day cooling off period shall begin.

If still no agreement is reached, a job action, including a strike may take place.


There is no reason not to think this can't be accomplished with dems controlling the WH, H & S. I don't know if it is better to try to pass this as stand alone legislation or slip it into an unrelated bill. Determining that should be ALPA's job.


Your thoughts and opinions please......
 

Browntothebone

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If there is a chance to save the industry it is in the next 2 yrs.

First off I am a registered independent and vote across party lines regularly. I am not a partisan.

That being said, the Dems will soon control the WH, have a filibuster proof maj in the house and have 57 seats in the senate.

Even in you strongly disagree with the dems when it comes to a lot of issues (I do), you have to admit they ARE more labor friendly than the GOP.

Obama has a VOTING RECORD of being pro-labor. If history is any indication he will appoint friendly members to the NMB.



Now to the point.


ALPA must AGRESSIVELY work with the House, Senate and WH to pass legislation that will DRASTICALLY alter the RLA.

I propose the following:


A 6 month period of dircet negiotations after the amend date of the contract.

If no agreement is reached, then another 6 months of negotiations overseen by the NMB shall take place.

If still nothing, than an automatic 30 day cooling off period shall begin.

If still no agreement is reached, a job action, including a strike may take place.


There is no reason not to think this can't be accomplished with dems controlling the WH, H & S. I don't know if it is better to try to pass this as stand alone legislation or slip it into an unrelated bill. Determining that should be ALPA's job.


Your thoughts and opinions please......

The house doesn't have filibusters.
 

Dude

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This has to be one of the more short-sighted, ignorant, foolish, and selfish threads I have ever seen. You are going to vote based, strictly, upon your profession? Wow! No other issue is important to you and your family?

NEWS FLASH!! NO politician is labor friendly. They all have great talking points and make a lot of general statements, but they have NO intention to save labor. They intend to save VOTES! If you are correct and the next election guarantees you a filibuster-proof legislative branch and unfettered support for the President, then you need to rethink your career and your career expectations. Our career will be no better than a truck driver's once regulation, realignment, and redistribution take over ALL industry. Legislators will say that "X" industry is too big to be permitted to fail and we must give "assurances" to the taxpayer that this critical component of our economy must be preserved. Bull$hit! We don't even have to wait two years, look at the auto industry now. Think about a Congress with no "hall monitor". The auto workers are going to get railed and there is nothing they can do about it. If they cave, they lose pay but keep some of their jobs. If they toe-the-line, then they lose their pay, a lot more jobs, and the pay will NEVER return. In the eye of the taxpayer, they get what's coming to them. It would be better to let a big one fail than bring the rest of them down with them.

Anyone ever heard of US Airways? They should have been gone YEARS ago, but due to government subsidizing their failed business, they remained and the entire industry suffered due to seat saturation and unfair competition due to favorable BK laws. As a result, the healthy businesses had to take in the shorts to weather the storm created by legislators and BAD management at the airlines. This is being played on the auto industry stage right now. Ripping the band-aid off is better than a slow tear.

Do you want to be viewed the same way? If you want this future for airline pilots, then vote the democrats in control and see what taxpayers do with you when they find out that they have to subsidize your 15 days off, hotel stays, and cool job. It doesn't matter that this is a false representation, this is what the public will see when our industry is presented to the taxpayer for rescue. It is far better to leave some balance in the governement than have the school children running the schoolhouse. Our industry is going to be okay, eventually and not without casualties, but only if it is left alone and those that are doomed to fail are permitted to. Democrats are good at making bad decisions worse and then blaming republicans for the mess in the first place.

Good Luck.
 

becket

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ALPA is a worthless organization. The only thing The band of Mustachioed fatheads that run this sham are ready for is Dinner. (paid by the pilots of course)
 

BLUE BAYOU

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You also forgot to mention UAL's three years in bankruptcy and look at their situation today, no better than when they entered bankruptcy years ago... As long as this country remains a capitalistic one-- the weak will fail and the strong will survive... My opinion is the same for Detroit-- we shouldn't be bailing out weak companies who have inferior products because that being said, GM and Toyota sold the same number of vehicles last year 9.2 million- but GM lost Billions and Toyota made several billion. The difference between the two companies? One is union the other is not. One builds products people are willing to purchase, the other one does not. If Detroit is going to survive, there will have to be mergers, maybe even a bankruptcy reorganization to tool their plants and work force for a more competitive environment.

ALPA had it's chance to shine years ago. It failed.
 

denny

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Blue,

You forgot to mention about the foreign car makers in the US their billions in subsidies from state and local governments to build their plants. Add in a relatively young worker population as compared to Detroit who is receiving many of the same benefits but won't have to pay much until the workforce grows older.

It perplexes me that so many people think that the two political parties are either this or that, good or bad. Republicans, in my view, don't trust government and govern that way. Problem is you can't run a country without government. Democrats, in my view, put too much faith in government and lean on it too much.

The taxpayer and citizen want everything they can get from government but don't want to pay anything for it so the average guy at heart is more of a Democrat than a Republican.

For every Republican you need a Democrat and vice versa. Leave either one in control too long and all hell breaks loose. We're now dealing with Republican hell. In 4 or 8 years we'll be dealing with Democrat hell. That's America!
 

Daddy

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The dems will not help labor any more than the republicans took on tort reform...they will cater to the special interests and nothing more. Many things can and should happen under a democratic gov't but will not because our country's politicians are hopelessly corrupt. Many things could and should have happened under the GOP, but did not for the same reason. Tort reform didn't happen because they were too busy pushing defense contracts in each other's districts...budget restraint did not happen either for pretty much the same reason. Denny has it right...dont hold your breath on this one folks
 

PCL_128

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Man, there's a lot of ridiculous crap in this thread. :rolleyes:

To the original poster, there isn't a filibuster proof majority in the Senate, so getting a complete overhaul of the RLA through might not be realistic. I would expect a lot of good changes, though. ALPA is currently working on fixes to the 1113 process, pension reform, flight/duty time regs, etc...
 

Rez O. Lewshun

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Why not start with the basics:

Voting. Only 1/3 of pilots vote.
Attend LEC meetings. Only 5% of pilots attend meeting.
ALPA-PAC. Only 14% of pilots contribute.

So it is fair to say that a majority of union pilots reading this thread don't do any of the three above.....

Want change... here are three easy active items you can do right away. It is actually, quick boring, non gratifying, yet essential...

Don't arm your union with an unloaded weapon and expect results.... The hollow points are participation.... Want change... try something new... vote, give to the PAC, show up at a meeting.
 

pipe

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This has to be one of the more short-sighted, ignorant, foolish, and selfish threads I have ever seen. You are going to vote based, strictly, upon your profession? Wow! No other issue is important to you and your family?

NEWS FLASH!! NO politician is labor friendly. They all have great talking points and make a lot of general statements, but they have NO intention to save labor. They intend to save VOTES! If you are correct and the next election guarantees you a filibuster-proof legislative branch and unfettered support for the President, then you need to rethink your career and your career expectations. Our career will be no better than a truck driver's once regulation, realignment, and redistribution take over ALL industry. Legislators will say that "X" industry is too big to be permitted to fail and we must give "assurances" to the taxpayer that this critical component of our economy must be preserved. Bull$hit! We don't even have to wait two years, look at the auto industry now. Think about a Congress with no "hall monitor". The auto workers are going to get railed and there is nothing they can do about it. If they cave, they lose pay but keep some of their jobs. If they toe-the-line, then they lose their pay, a lot more jobs, and the pay will NEVER return. In the eye of the taxpayer, they get what's coming to them. It would be better to let a big one fail than bring the rest of them down with them.
Apparently you haven't been paying attention. Do you know who least wants GM to fail? Mullally, the CEO of Ford, that's who. Apparently most of the suppliers are common to all of the big three. Losing one kills the suppliers, which kills the other two.

PIPE
 

BOOZENEWS

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I don't even know where to start. I am going to dissect this non-sense bit by bit.

You are going to vote based, strictly, upon your profession? Wow! No other issue is important to you and your family?

No I didn't say that!! Don't know where you got that idea.

NEWS FLASH!! NO politician is labor friendly. They all have great talking points and make a lot of general statements, but they have NO intention to save labor.
Maybe if every pilot contributed to the PAC then they would be FORCED to be labor friendly!! Don't ya think!!

The dems will not help labor any more than the republicans took on tort reform...they will cater to the special interests and nothing more.

Again, maybe if pilots contributed more the the PAC this wouldn't be the case.

To the original poster, there isn't a filibuster proof majority in the Senate, so getting a complete overhaul of the RLA through might not be realistic.
Correct. It takes 60 votes.
 

Rez O. Lewshun

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This has to be one of the more short-sighted, ignorant, foolish, and selfish threads I have ever seen. You are going to vote based, strictly, upon your profession? Wow! No other issue is important to you and your family?.


No. No other issue is more important to me and my family, than the Profession....

Let's use any given issue.

1. Abortion. Stopping girls from having abortions doesn't put food on my table. After I give what money and time my family has to the anti-abortion organizations, I sit there with that stupid grin on face, morals so high, shoulders back, and my wife and kids want to know whats for dinner. And I say "I dunno... go ask the anti-abortion people. They've got all our money." In reality, you can't stop abortion if you can't pay your house note, bills and retirement. If you and your family were on the street would you be addressing abortion?

2. Terrorism/National Security. It already appears that the majority of Americans think "the economy" is most important. The election is over.

In addition, highly trained, well paid, professional US Pilots, flying US registered Jets for US Companies is not only a national security issue, it is an economic issue.

We need professional United States pilots to fly Armed Forces personnel to conflict zones. Would you rather have the French do it?

The economy needs people moving safely on airplanes. If we start crashing jets because the best pilots have rejected the profession then the economy suffers on everyone.


Why should pilots have to choose between "whats best for the country" (whatever that is.... can anyone one tell me?) and a strong, professional, well compensated cadre of United States Air Line Pilots....





Well paid, non fatigued, Professional Air Line Pilots benefit everyone! Not only is it unfortunate that we have to fight others (Corporati's, etc..) but it is a slap in the face that we have to fight our own ranks...


Yes, the Profession is THE issue. For my country, for me and my family, for my industry, for our economy and for my company.
 

BOOZENEWS

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No. No other issue is more important to me and my family, than the Profession....

Let's use any given issue.

1. Abortion. Stopping girls from having abortions doesn't put food on my table. After I give what money and time my family has to the anti-abortion organizations, I sit there with that stupid grin on face, morals so high, shoulders back, and my wife and kids want to know whats for dinner. And I say "I dunno... go ask the anti-abortion people. They've got all our money." In reality, you can't stop abortion if you can't pay your house note, bills and retirement. If you and your family were on the street would you be addressing abortion?

2. Terrorism/National Security. It already appears that the majority of Americans think "the economy" is most important. The election is over.

In addition, highly trained, well paid, professional US Pilots, flying US registered Jets for US Companies is not only a national security issue, it is an economic issue.

We need professional United States pilots to fly Armed Forces personnel to conflict zones. Would you rather have the French do it?

The economy needs people moving safely on airplanes. If we start crashing jets because the best pilots have rejected the profession then the economy suffers on everyone.


Why should pilots have to choose between "whats best for the country" (whatever that is.... can anyone one tell me?) and a strong, professional, well compensated cadre of United States Air Line Pilots....





Well paid, non fatigued, Professional Air Line Pilots benefit everyone! Not only is it unfortunate that we have to fight others (Corporati's, etc..) but it is a slap in the face that we have to fight our own ranks...


Yes, the Profession is THE issue. For my country, for me and my family, for my industry, for our economy and for my company.

Very well put Rez!
 

Twisted Mind

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Blue Bayou,

“One builds products people are willing to purchase, the other one does not.”
Are you saying that 9.2 million people bought cars they were not willing to purchase? Was some one was holding a gun to their head?

J.D. Power Best new cars
1st place: Chevrolet Malibu
2nd place: Mitsubishi Galant
3rd place: Ford Fusion

1st place: Pontiac Grand Prix
2nd place: Mercury Sable
3rd place: Mercury Grand Marquis

1st place: Honda CR-V
2nd place: Chrysler PT Cruiser
3rd place: Ford Escape

1st place: Dodge Durango
2nd place: Hyundai Santa Fe
3rd place: Toyota Highlander

1st place: Toyota Sequoia
2nd place: Chevrolet Tahoe
3rd place: GMC Yukon

1st place: Lincoln Navigator
2nd place: Infiniti QX56
3rd place: Cadillac Escalade

1st place: Chevrolet Silverado
2nd place: Toyota Tundra
3rd place: Chevrolet Avalanche

1st place: Dodge Dakota
2nd place: Ford Ranger
3rd place: Toyota Tacoma
 

Smarta$$

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Every one wants to bash the line worker compensation. I wonder how much more the big 3 executives have made over the last 5 years vs. Japan's executives?

As for the origanal post, I think it will be a great opportunity. I hope it pans out.

As for those that don't think the gop is far more anti-labor than the Dems, you are in DENIAL.
 

Skippy

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1. i wouldnt buy american- sorry i just wont do it- doesnt make me a bad american, sorry but fool me three times--- chrysler lebaron 5 door, ford LTD, and a ford taurus 1996 all had major problems and died before their time ( it traded in and up)

2. some people will pay more for a better and more reliable product, some won't

3. ALPA isnt going to do much - even in this environment-- dont expect much and you wont be disappointed

4. did you know that iron workers, electricians, and plumbers are all 5 year freakign schools/certifications? damn-- thats highly talented and trained!!
 

sleeves

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ALPA must AGRESSIVELY work with the House, Senate and WH to pass legislation that will DRASTICALLY alter the RLA.




Your thoughts and opinions please......
Yes we should try to do this. Given the same opportunity MGT. tried to alter the RLA even further in it's favor.

I will write my reps about this.
 

Tejas-Jet

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I do buy American...I have a GMC pickup...wife doesn't like American cars...she drives an Acura..and I have to say, it is a great car.

But I do ask...Why does GM make a GMC Pickup and a Chevy pickup when they are the exact same vehicle?

Why do they build a GMC Yukon and a Chevy Tahoe when they are the exact same vehicle?

Why does they build a GMC Yukon XL and a Chevy Suburban when they are the exact same vehicle?

Chevrolet, Buick, Saturn, Cadillac, GMC, Oldsmobile, Pontiac...how many different types and brands does GM really need to build?

Note how Acura and Honda only have a few different types that they build.

Seems they need to do lots of streamlining in their operations...or ( dare I say it) "Right" sizing.
 
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Tweaker

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have a filibuster proof maj in the house and have 57 seats in the senate.
Your thoughts and opinions please......
The House does not possess the filibuster tactic. The senate alone does. AND PLEASE JEBUS, MAY THEY REMAIN UNIFIED AND STRONG
 

BOOZENEWS

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The House does not possess the filibuster tactic. The senate alone does. AND PLEASE JEBUS, MAY THEY REMAIN UNIFIED AND STRONG


My bad. I thought they did.



Lets not hijack this thread. ALPA better do something unless they want to see the whole profession be eroded even more than it's already been.


Those of you who think that passing what I proposed is unrealistic need to wake up! I'd be finding any and every way to either sneak this in unrelated legistlation or try to get it in a stand alone bill.

To those who think Obama is anti-labor, you are very mistaken.

According to www.factcheck.org Obama has a 96 percent AFL-CIO voting record, higher that both Hillary Clinton and Chris Dodd.

Also he was a co-sponsor of the Employee Free Choice Act and had a 100% labor record in 2007 and a 98 percent lifetime labor voting record according to http://www.massaflcio.org/be-informed-barack-obama-issues

Lastly according to www.nwlaborpress.org the Illinois AFL-CIO gave Obama a 90 percent rating for his eight years as an Illinois state senator.
 
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