Allegiant Travel Company Reports First Quarter 2007 Financial Results

[Pyle It]

Hey GarretandPratt. if you dont like it here LEAVE!:smash:

Pyle IT

 

[GarretandPratt]

keep drinking the kool-aid pyl o it. Let me know how it works out for you. If you can't take strong opinions get out off the board!!!! You are a genius dude.

 

[Ameriagle]

(Quote): "That is really the main problem, with the exception of the TWA/AMR guys at our company nobody really understands what good pay and benefits are."

I have not yet met a pilot at AAY that is satisfied with the status quo. I have met quite a few however that are putting a lot of time and effort into making this a better place to work and doing a pretty decent job at it! I do not think its a matter of "not understanding what good pay and benefits are," its a matter of having a realistic expectation of the process.

If you had an expectation of faster growth for AAY I am curious as to what exactly you where expecting and who provided you with the information! Our growth has been for the most part consistent with what I was told to expect.

Good luck with the job search, I hope everything works out for you!

 

[Desert1]

I expected a little more "growth" than I have seen. I also expected to be paid a little better, according to our in house -whatever they are -psuedo union? I guess we were going to get this great pay increase last fall. That did not happen and I am not fallling for it again. Fool me once -etc. WE STILL HAVE NO PROTECTION IF WE GET SOLD,MERGED ETC!!!! The pilots in LAS who are home every night and don't care are going to be crying bloody murder when we get sold, merged or whatever,and the other company's managment says "thanks but no thanks" to our rank and file pilot group. I came here thinking like many people did that we were growing. We are not, and very little has changed. It's disappointing to say the least. I am not one to complain and do nothing though. I am looking and applying elsewhere. The only safe places right now are cargo and swa. You have to hand it to those guys ,they all have there act together even when it comes to pay and benefits for their pilots. That is really the main problem, with the exception of the TWA/AMR guys at our company nobody really understands what good pay and benefits are. What we should be getting, we are MD-80 professional pilots. We should get paid and treated like them. That is what I expect, we have 175M in the bank and we are profitable. Please tell me why we shouldn't enjoy competive pay and benefits or why we are not expanding?

CD

Wow...lot of anger dude. Seriously, you should chill out before you rupture something... Getting your facts in order might serve to alleviate this frustration you so aptly convey in your posts. Although I certainly hope you find what you're looking for, something tells me you won't. Just a hunch.

Your posts reveal a lack of experience and knowledge of this industry. First off, I find it quite interesting that you list the TWA guys as knowing what good benefits are...while, in the same breath, spouting off about merger protection. While I would certainly concur about your assessment of of our good TWA folks, they would be the first to tell you about merger protection and what a BINDING contract did for them. It just so happens to be why they are presently working for AAY... Do some research. A cursory glance at the history of mergers in this industry will tell you that there have been very few 'successful' mergers when viewed from a pilot's perspective. And that was WITH a CBA and full union protection. Nonetheless, for what it's worth, our team of negotiators (the ones you appear so quick to scoff at) are diligently working towards merger protection, among many other items. As hard as it is, with the amount of time (and risk) they devote, I certainly hope they don't read this type of drivel from likes of you--the very AAY pilot whose QOL they've worked so hard to improve.

"I'm not one to complain and do nothing, I'm looking and applying elsewhere" Good for you.... Just curious, elections were recently held, am I safe in assuming your name was not on the ballot for any of the AAPAG negotiation positions? It's easy to b1tch isn't it?--did you ever think about actually doing something about it, instead of sitting around whining about those who do? My guess is no,...

For what it's worth, few airlines ever start out of the shoot with the type of work rules, pay and benefits you appear to be looking for. Makes me wonder what you were looking for when you came here. When you sign on to a new company, the rewards of seniority and early transition are balanced with the risk of failure and innefficiency. However, that being said, our 'pseudo-union' as you put it, have managed to negotiate over 20% increases in pay in 2 years. In addition, they have managed a slew of work rule improvements (you should have seen this place 5 years ago...).

"I guess we were going to get this great pay increase last fall. That did not happen and I'm not going to fall for it again. Fool me once, etc." This is truly disgraceful. Your arrogance appears to be among the few things that actually exceed your anger. You say this as if those hard working people owe you something. What have you done, other than snivel and complain? They did this for you... Check your figures: you stand to make between $4K-5K this year because of them...and this is how you thank them? As oppossed to what you are doing, this progress came through a great deal of hard work and dedication. Unlike the union shops you aspire to work at, this was at zero cost to you. Shame on you.

As to the rest of your information, it's anyone's guess where you got it. You may be surprised to note that AAY has announced the acquisition of 7 aircraft and 50 pilots by the END OF THIS YEAR...yes, Dec 07. Again, not to let the facts get in the way of your rant, but growth has been borderline unsustainable, with back-to-back classes churning out as many as 25 pilots a whack, for years. So...just what growth figures are you referring to??

I for one, like most, realize we aren't perfect and we have work to do. I also realize there are a lot of damn good people trying to make things happen at Allegiant. So you'll forgive me if I'm not too receptive to your views and opinions. And don't get me wrong, I'm not looking to try to keep you from leaving. I think it would certainly be in Allegiant's best interest if we did 'share your talents' with other airlines. I will say that I pity the airline you actually end up working for. I'm sure you'll fool them in the interview, having them actually believe you're going to be a positive asset and a good fit. Just like you did here... I have little doubt you'll find plenty of things to b1tch about there too.

Again, based on the delusions you've put out thus far, I'd be willing to bet you're not going to be happy...wherever you end up.

But I sincerely hope you do...for everyone's sake.

D1

 

[SaabStory]

Wow...lot of anger dude. Seriously, you should chill out before you rupture something... Getting your facts in order might serve to alleviate this frustration you so aptly convey in your posts. Although I certainly hope you find what you're looking for, something tells me you won't. Just a hunch.

Your posts reveal a lack of experience and knowledge of this industry. First off, I find it quite interesting that you list the TWA guys as knowing what good benefits are...while, in the same breath, spouting off about merger protection. While I would certainly concur about your assessment of of our good TWA folks, they would be the first to tell you about merger protection and what a BINDING contract did for them. It just so happens to be why they are presently working for AAY... Do some research. A cursory glance at the history of mergers in this industry will tell you that there have been very few 'successful' mergers when viewed from a pilot's perspective. And that was WITH a CBA and full union protection. Nonetheless, for what it's worth, our team of negotiators (the ones you appear so quick to scoff at) are diligently working towards merger protection, among many other items. As hard as it is, with the amount of time (and risk) they devote, I certainly hope they don't read this type of drivel from likes of you--the very AAY pilot whose QOL they've worked so hard to improve.

"I'm not one to complain and do nothing, I'm looking and applying elsewhere" Good for you.... Just curious, elections were recently held, am I safe in assuming your name was not on the ballot for any of the AAPAG negotiation positions? It's easy to b1tch isn't it?--did you ever think about actually doing something about it, instead of sitting around whining about those who do? My guess is no,...

For what it's worth, few airlines ever start out of the shoot with the type of work rules, pay and benefits you appear to be looking for. Makes me wonder what you were looking for when you came here. When you sign on to a new company, the rewards of seniority and early transition are balanced with the risk of failure and innefficiency. However, that being said, our 'pseudo-union' as you put it, have managed to negotiate over 20% increases in pay in 2 years. In addition, they have managed a slew of work rule improvements (you should have seen this place 5 years ago...).

"I guess we were going to get this great pay increase last fall. That did not happen and I'm not going to fall for it again. Fool me once, etc." This is truly disgraceful. Your arrogance appears to be among the few things that actually exceed your anger. You say this as if those hard working people owe you something. What have you done, other than snivel and complain? They did this for you... Check your figures: you stand to make between $4K-5K this year because of them...and this is how you thank them? As oppossed to what you are doing, this progress came through a great deal of hard work and dedication. Unlike the union shops you aspire to work at, this was at zero cost to you. Shame on you.

As to the rest of your information, it's anyone's guess where you got it. You may be surprised to note that AAY has announced the acquisition of 7 aircraft and 50 pilots by the END OF THIS YEAR...yes, Dec 07. Again, not to let the facts get in the way of your rant, but growth has been borderline unsustainable, with back-to-back classes churning out as many as 25 pilots a whack, for years. So...just what growth figures are you referring to??

I for one, like most, realize we aren't perfect and we have work to do. I also realize there are a lot of damn good people trying to make things happen at Allegiant. So you'll forgive me if I'm not too receptive to your views and opinions. And don't get me wrong, I'm not looking to try to keep you from leaving. I think it would certainly be in Allegiant's best interest if we did 'share your talents' with other airlines. I will say that I pity the airline you actually end up working for. I'm sure you'll fool them in the interview, having them actually believe you're going to be a positive asset and a good fit. Just like you did here... I have little doubt you'll find plenty of things to b1tch about there too.

Again, based on the delusions you've put out thus far, I'd be willing to bet you're not going to be happy...wherever you end up.

But I sincerely hope you do...for everyone's sake.

D1

Great post!! I'd say D1 is spot-on regarding the situation at Allegiant.

 

[chperplt]

CD,

I can't say anything that D1 hasn't already said. He said it quite well and with a solid understand of where we are, where we've been, and where we're going.

Please do yourself and the rest of us who enjoy working for Allegiant a big favor and leave. We're not going to advance in our pay and QOL issues with attitudes like yours. Please help us out and either change your attitude or find employment elsewhere.

 

[anewunion]

AAY is, what it is. An airline that will continue to make money for a very long time, and is a great place to work if you don't commute.


Also, if you didn't like your raise last year after giving absolutely nothing up, PM me and I'll explain how you can send it back. Because, I'm the one that came up with the letter idea.

 

[GarretandPratt]

I got my point across

I will ignore the fact that people can't seem to keep from attacking me personally when I only talked about AAY. Your defensiveness Desert speaks volumes about you.(BTW I got my growth figures from MSNBC you got yours from the AAPAG website, I also did not get a 20% raise it works out to about 8%, I am to smart to trust slick accounting!) This forum needs to know that we all don't buy into the "new and different" way of thinking that management here started. This "new and different" thinking still allows no protection for us when we are sold or merged into another company. This is why so many people are leaving or trying to leave AAY!!

AAPAG needs to think of everyone at this company not just the senior LAS pilots who live in base. You are elected reps and if you can't take listening to another point of view or take criticism you need to grow thicker skin. I will not argue anymore and you can say what you want. You know the saying about arguing on the internet. I have said my piece.


CD

 

[chperplt]

I will ignore the fact that people can't seem to keep from attacking me personally when I only talked about AAY. Your defensiveness Desert speaks volumes about you.(BTW I got my growth figures from MSNBC you got yours from the AAPAG website, I also did not get a 20% raise it works out to about 8%, I am to smart to trust slick accounting!) This forum needs to know that we all don't buy into the "new and different" way of thinking that management here started. This "new and different" thinking still allows no protection for us when we are sold or merged into another company. This is why so many people are leaving or trying to leave AAY!!

AAPAG needs to think of everyone at this company not just the senior LAS pilots who live in base. You are elected reps and if you can't take listening to another point of view or take criticism you need to grow thicker skin. I will not argue anymore and you can say what you want. You know the saying about arguing on the internet. I have said my piece.


CD

I don't think anyone is attacking you personally.

You are correct in that last years raise was only 8%. The 20% figure comes from the past 2 yearly raises.

I don't think there is anyone at AAY that is happy with our current pay and work rules. That being said, there are many of us that 1) knew what we were getting in to when we came here 2) understand that we're not going to get to industry average overnight 3) realize AAPAG has done great things so far 4)understand that an established union may be the only way to get to industry average at some point 5)realize that we're not at that point yet.

The fact remains that if you can either stop attacking the company and the elected reps; help those elected reps by giving your time and energy to help make change; or STFU and go elsewhere.

The biggest problem we have here at AAY is too many of our pilots bitch on these message boards but refuse to help out to actually see change made.

 

[Desert1]

I will ignore the fact that people can't seem to keep from attacking me personally when I only talked about AAY. Your defensiveness Desert speaks volumes about you.(BTW I got my growth figures from MSNBC you got yours from the AAPAG website, I also did not get a 20% raise it works out to about 8%, I am to smart to trust slick accounting!) This forum needs to know that we all don't buy into the "new and different" way of thinking that management here started. This "new and different" thinking still allows no protection for us when we are sold or merged into another company. This is why so many people are leaving or trying to leave AAY!!

AAPAG needs to think of everyone at this company not just the senior LAS pilots who live in base. You are elected reps and if you can't take listening to another point of view or take criticism you need to grow thicker skin. I will not argue anymore and you can say what you want. You know the saying about arguing on the internet. I have said my piece.


CD

"Attacking you personally"? Who's being defensive now CD? Again, as expected, a myopic and ill-informed, childish response. Please re-read the post. For the sake of the coherent readers of this board, I'll refresh your memory. 8% was negotiated last year along with 130% of everything over 81 hrs. When combined with roughly 10% the year prior (which AAPAG also negotiated) it amounts to roughly 20%.

You trust MSNBC?!?? Laughable as that is, it certainly explains a lot. The growth figures are direct quotes from the senior VP of operations to a recurrent class.

To be honest, as much as this has been mildly amusing, I'm pleased you will not argue anymore. At best, it's a complete waste of people's time even reading your posts. At worst, it could serve to discourage many who might otherwise be a good fit at Allegiant. We're going to need people for future growth, so your (incoherant, illogical, completely off course, poorly researched and thought-out) posts are potentially harmful to those of us wanting to make a go of this place. Other than that, they're ok...

Why not be a sport and quit publicly bashing the very company that feeds you on this forum. Try being a bit more loyal to the group that hired you and trained you. If you can't effect change within your company by taking a positive leadership role, or at least supportive of those who are (AAPAG), it's best to remain silent while looking at other opportunities. In contrast, like a spoiled child, you feel free to publicly slam not only your present company, but those within who are trying to make this a better place for you. This would be laughable if it weren't so tragic.

Again, you appear to be new to this industry so I'll clue you in: it's called bad karma. Have you ever heard of the term 'Brand X'? It's a term used by pilots to refer to their previous employer. Ever wonder why they don't use the actual name? Think about it. You're stepping on a lot of toes CD. As you say about arguing on the internet, nothing is classified. It's a small industry...ya never know who's listening. As ill-advised as burning bridges may be, it's even worse when when you're burning the bridge while you're still standing on it.

Your sense of entitlement for a new guy is truly astounding. You probably haven't even sat reserve, are making industry standard FO first year pay, and you're home every night. You've seen 20% increases in the last 2 years and stand to see at least another 10-20% this year. Tough sledding huh?

Face it, people like you are impossible to please, you'll never be happy. AAPAG (or ALPA) could give you 350 days off a year and you'd complain because you had to work on a Sunday. They (AAPAG) have to remain focused on the needs and desires of the '90 percentile'. The remaining 10% that reside on the extremes will never be happy. That seems to be the case no matter where you go.

As to the criticism, put your money where your mouth is, step up and take your licks. It might be a growth opportunity and give you a chance to walk in AAPAG's shoes. Go volunteer YOUR precious time and energy gathering inputs, massaging egos and battling with management. All to be 'criticized' by the likes of you. Seriosly, next time, use internal means. While you're at it, how 'bout you provide some suggestions for actually solving the problems. Otherwise you just come off as a whiner.

Before I move on to more productive activities, I'll leave you with this question: Do you really believe the carriers you quoted (SWA, FEX, UPS) as having their act together actually started out that way with people behaving like you?...or more like the leaders who try so hard to effect positiive change. You want to hitch your wagon to the tail-end of a carrier that has already been built by great leaders, fine, knock yourself out. But please, stop denigrating the efforts of those who are trying to do the same here...and just move along.

...now go back to your room and color.

D1