Allegiant seeks B757s, may create alter-ego airline

Chronic Jetlag

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Allegiant is currently seeking to add B-757s to their fleet of 41 MD-80s. As with an introduction of a second aircraft type a new pay scale is currently being sought by their pilot group. The rest of the industry and its pilots have started to pay close attention and scrutinize what is about to take place between Allegiant management and AAPAG (Allegiant Air Pilot Advisory Group). The future pay scale for this second aircraft type will have far reaching consequences because there is a symbiotic relationship regarding pilot pay amongst all the airlines that operate the same or similar size aircrafts. Dissension and strife within AAPAG regarding this issue have already allowed their management to methodically dissect the unity of AAPAG by trying to impose and maintain the same pay rates which is far below industry average of comparable equipment. While no official numbers have been introduced those close to the source have indicated that a single pay rate may be in effect for both the MD-80 and B-757 which is considered by most of the AAPAG pilots to be grossly inadequate and unacceptable.

AAPAG faces the unique challenge of not only trying to request for a new pay rate without the true power of negotiation under the proper legal forum enjoyed by other union carriers but is also trying to unite all of its pilots to show resolve and fight for a common cause built on mutual interests. AAPAG’s diverse pilot group consists of but not limited to legacy furloughees, corporate, regional, and cargo pilots to pilots that have crossed picket lines during a strike. Some of its pilots fundamentally believe that the success and growth of Allegiant is reflected and dependent upon low labor cost and its very survival is inextricably tied to their below industry average pay; but this notion is not held by most others whom contend that Allegiant’s very own business model and financial statements prove otherwise and it is paying substandard pilot wages simply because it can.

In a recent meeting between Allegiant’s top executive officers and AAPAG, CEO Maurice Gallagher Jr. announced that Allegiant is currently actively seeking to acquire another carrier’s certificate and its intentions to operate it independently from Allegiant Air. Mr. Gallagher told AAPAG that he expects the pilots to fly the new aircraft type at current MD-80 rates with new work rules to be negotiated. He also discussed business plans with an actual LOI to purchase B757s which may be added to Allegiant’s certificate. Much to the disappointment of AAPAG Mr. Gallagher made it clear that he invited AAPAG to the meeting only as a courtesy and ultimately "the company will do whatever they want to do.” Mr. Gallagher repeatedly and bluntly suggested that AAPAG was being greedy in believing it should be better compensated and ultimately said “ the only people that matter to us are the shareholders” (The three largest share holders are Gallagher, Harris and Levy). http://www.allegiantair.com/aaExecutiveBios.php

History has proven the creation and existence of an alter-ego airline is an egregious airline business strategy that destroys a pilot’s career and its only true purpose is to serve itself by enhancing executive compensation (Mesa/Freedom). AAPAG is being tested and its resolve will greatly determine their pilot’s future.

As a publically traded non union leisure travel air carrier, Allegiant’s current market cap of $ 685 million is larger than United’s $456 million and U.S. Air’s $245 million. With its unique business model of serving small cities to large destinations with bundled all inclusive vacation packages and virtually no competition Allegiant enjoys operating margins of well over 20%, that’s both unrivaled and unheard of in the airline industry. When a barrel of oil peaked at $147 Allegiant was still able to sustain profitability without fuel hedges.


A concerned 121 Pilot
 

johnsonrod

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Allegiant is currently seeking to add B-757s to their fleet of 41 MD-80s. As with an introduction of a second aircraft type a new pay scale is currently being sought by their pilot group. The rest of the industry and its pilots have started to pay close attention and scrutinize what is about to take place between Allegiant management and AAPAG (Allegiant Air Pilot Advisory Group). The future pay scale for this second aircraft type will have far reaching consequences because there is a symbiotic relationship regarding pilot pay amongst all the airlines that operate the same or similar size aircrafts. Dissension and strife within AAPAG regarding this issue have already allowed their management to methodically dissect the unity of AAPAG by trying to impose and maintain the same pay rates which is far below industry average of comparable equipment. While no official numbers have been introduced those close to the source have indicated that a single pay rate may be in effect for both the MD-80 and B-757 which is considered by most of the AAPAG pilots to be grossly inadequate and unacceptable.

AAPAG faces the unique challenge of not only trying to request for a new pay rate without the true power of negotiation under the proper legal forum enjoyed by other union carriers but is also trying to unite all of its pilots to show resolve and fight for a common cause built on mutual interests. AAPAG’s diverse pilot group consists of but not limited to legacy furloughees, corporate, regional, and cargo pilots to pilots that have crossed picket lines during a strike. Some of its pilots fundamentally believe that the success and growth of Allegiant is reflected and dependent upon low labor cost and its very survival is inextricably tied to their below industry average pay; but this notion is not held by most others whom contend that Allegiant’s very own business model and financial statements prove otherwise and it is paying substandard pilot wages simply because it can.

In a recent meeting between Allegiant’s top executive officers and AAPAG, CEO Maurice Gallagher Jr. announced that Allegiant is currently actively seeking to acquire another carrier’s certificate and its intentions to operate it independently from Allegiant Air. Mr. Gallagher told AAPAG that he expects the pilots to fly the new aircraft type at current MD-80 rates with new work rules to be negotiated. He also discussed business plans with an actual LOI to purchase B757s which may be added to Allegiant’s certificate. Much to the disappointment of AAPAG Mr. Gallagher made it clear that he invited AAPAG to the meeting only as a courtesy and ultimately "the company will do whatever they want to do.” Mr. Gallagher repeatedly and bluntly suggested that AAPAG was being greedy in believing it should be better compensated and ultimately said “ the only people that matter to us are the shareholders” (The three largest share holders are Gallagher, Harris and Levy). http://www.allegiantair.com/aaExecutiveBios.php

History has proven the creation and existence of an alter-ego airline is an egregious airline business strategy that destroys a pilot’s career and its only true purpose is to serve itself by enhancing executive compensation (Mesa/Freedom). AAPAG is being tested and its resolve will greatly determine their pilot’s future.

As a publically traded non union leisure travel air carrier, Allegiant’s current market cap of $ 685 million is larger than United’s $456 million and U.S. Air’s $245 million. With its unique business model of serving small cities to large destinations with bundled all inclusive vacation packages and virtually no competition Allegiant enjoys operating margins of well over 20%, that’s both unrivaled and unheard of in the airline industry. When a barrel of oil peaked at $147 Allegiant was still able to sustain profitability without fuel hedges.


A concerned 121 Pilot
No disrespect, but I would expect Omni Air, North American or ATA level pay for the 757 at Allegiant. It would be in keeping with their low-cost model and there are 757 operators out there who pay cheaper than others. Allegiant is a fantastic and stable airline that has really proven itself - it just ain't a trend setter with regard to pay... I hope I am wrong. That's my read.
 

ualdriver

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Allegiant is currently seeking to add B-757s to their fleet of 41 MD-80s. As with an introduction of a second aircraft type a new pay scale is currently being sought by their pilot group. The rest of the industry and its pilots have started to pay close attention and scrutinize what is about to take place between Allegiant management and AAPAG (Allegiant Air Pilot Advisory Group). The future pay scale for this second aircraft type will have far reaching consequences because there is a symbiotic relationship regarding pilot pay amongst all the airlines that operate the same or similar size aircrafts. Dissension and strife within AAPAG regarding this issue have already allowed their management to methodically dissect the unity of AAPAG by trying to impose and maintain the same pay rates which is far below industry average of comparable equipment. While no official numbers have been introduced those close to the source have indicated that a single pay rate may be in effect for both the MD-80 and B-757 which is considered by most of the AAPAG pilots to be grossly inadequate and unacceptable.

My understanding from the debates I've had with previous Allegiant pilots is that they're pretty happy with their low wages because they have an excellent relationship with management and they're home every night and they're just starting out so low pay isn't much of a concern and they don't fly where everyone else flies so no one else in the industry should worry about it either. If they're happy flying MD88's for a fraction of the going rate, why should the 757's be any different?

Or maybe, just maybe, the concerns that I've posted about Allegiant wages in the past were valid? Nah....

Regardless, I think the Allegiant pilots are about to get screwing #2 with screwing #1 of course being their most recently negotiated pay scale. Gallagher can do whatever he wants and will. If you're lucky he'll throw you the MD88 rates + $10/hr. and then the AAPAG can claim a victory.

A few of you Allegiant guys should drop a smart guy like PCL_128 a PM and see how to get a union on the property......and fast to unf*** what you're about to be given. I've read on various forums that some pilot groups have a few different ways of expressing their displeasure, as well.
 

ualdriver

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A cursory glance at the scab list shows twice as many "line crossers" at SWA than AAY.
Wherever they are, I hope they are treated with the "respect" they deserve outside of the cockpit.
 

Blue Dude

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A cursory glance at the scab list shows twice as many "line crossers" at SWA than AAY.
Cursory math would indicate that SWA is something like 10 times the size of AAY.
 

mt2

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No disrespect, but I would expect Omni Air, North American or ATA level pay for the 757 at Allegiant. It would be in keeping with their low-cost model and there are 757 operators out there who pay cheaper than others. Allegiant is a fantastic and stable airline that has really proven itself - it just ain't a trend setter with regard to pay... I hope I am wrong. That's my read.
Good idea. Go with the ATA rates which would range from 119.90 in yr 2 to 147.27 in yr 12 as a Capt and 58.15 to 92.79 for FO's.
 

ualdriver

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Good idea. Go with the ATA rates which would range from 119.90 in yr 2 to 147.27 in yr 12 as a Capt and 58.15 to 92.79 for FO's.
They will be VERY lucky if they get anything even resembling those rates.
 

front9

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A few of you Allegiant guys should drop a smart guy like PCL_128
Wow, with each post you continue to destroy your credibility here UALiar. Now you are calling PFT_128 a smart guy...really? You’re asking guys to PM a punk who PAID to gain hours in a 1900 while your “brothers & sisters” were out there building hours the hard way. What a joke! PFT_128 is a union poster boy now, but in the past he would’ve cut YOUR throat to get YOUR job. You are the epitome of all hypocrites, I will say good day to you sir.
 

ualdriver

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Wow, with each post you continue to destroy your credibility here UALiar. Now you are calling PFT_128 a smart guy...really? You’re asking guys to PM a punk who PAID to gain hours in a 1900 while your “brothers & sisters” were out there building hours the hard way. What a joke! PFT_128 is a union poster boy now, but in the past he would’ve cut YOUR throat to get YOUR job. You are the epitome of all hypocrites, I will say good day to you sir.
I'm not sure what's better......ALPO or UALiar.....I'll get back to you that one. But for now, make sure you use both so that hilarity will ensue no matter which you use.

Anyway, I think he has some experience getting guys unionized, and it sounds like the Allegiant guys are going to need it soon. But hey, they're also free to completely ignore my advice and the Allegiant guys can continue down the "primrose path" paved by their CEO. Hopefully they will enjoy those $70 hour 757 Captain rates...
 

Dix-Bag

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Yes
ALPA at AAY

fingers crossed our pilots make the right decision for once
 

Ameriagle

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I'm not sure what's better......ALPO or UALiar.....I'll get back to you that one. But for now, make sure you use both so that hilarity will ensue no matter which you use.

Anyway, I think he has some experience getting guys unionized, and it sounds like the Allegiant guys are going to need it soon. But hey, they're also free to completely ignore my advice and the Allegiant guys can continue down the "primrose path" paved by their CEO. Hopefully they will enjoy those $70 hour 757 Captain rates...
Save your breath, whatever AAY does will have nothing to do with any advice you are providing.
 

Dix-Bag

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My understanding from the debates I've had with previous Allegiant pilots is that they're pretty happy with their low wages because they have an excellent relationship with management and they're home every night and they're just starting out so low pay isn't much of a concern and they don't fly where everyone else flies so no one else in the industry should worry about it either. If they're happy flying MD88's for a fraction of the going rate, why should the 757's be any different?

Or maybe, just maybe, the concerns that I've posted about Allegiant wages in the past were valid? Nah....

Regardless, I think the Allegiant pilots are about to get screwing #2 with screwing #1 of course being their most recently negotiated pay scale. Gallagher can do whatever he wants and will. If you're lucky he'll throw you the MD88 rates + $10/hr. and then the AAPAG can claim a victory.

A few of you Allegiant guys should drop a smart guy like PCL_128 a PM and see how to get a union on the property......and fast to unf*** what you're about to be given. I've read on various forums that some pilot groups have a few different ways of expressing their displeasure, as well.
Gallagher = Scumbag

Maybe you've been right all along ual

foot in mouth... publicly

Time to step up fellow aay slaves
 

jacko123

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Just to be clear, there are 2 scabs at AAY and they were hired years ago.
 

Mr Wu

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Anyway, I think he (PCL_128) has some experience getting guys unionized,

:rolleyes: The most idiotic post in this thread. PCL_128 was responsible for the first failure of the ALPA vote at Colgan due to the crap he was spouting on this board pushing away the fence-sitters. One of the main reasons that the vote succeeded the second time round was that he and his cronies were asked to keep their posts on the Colgan threads to a minimum.
 

fly4surf

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It really seems the time has come...
good luck.
We are all counting on ya!
 

CopilotDoug

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Done!
Mr. Gallagher repeatedly and bluntly suggested that AAPAG was being greedy in believing it should be better compensated
If this statement is true...sounds like Gallagher is cut from the same cloth as Orenstein. As Orenstein has shown, one can only float the company on the backs of the employees for so long before the lack of Management Skills come to the surface.

Good luck to the AAY pilots.
 

Grey Ghost

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Gallagher = Scumbag

Maybe you've been right all along ual

foot in mouth... publicly

Time to step up fellow aay slaves


Careful what you say I heard "that SCAB" will send it to the company!:smash:
 
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