Allegiant Post 3Q Profit!!!

[Daytonaflyer]

We'll lets see. Let's say your company decides to expand rapidly and compete with ups/fdx directly (the freight world is much different, so it's hard to compare). They would probably do well because their costs are lower because you accept low, below standard pay and benefits. As your company continues to expand and do well on the backs of it's underpaid employees, it hurts ups/fdx. Eventually ups/fdx have to lower costs to compete with your company. This would include pilots taking paycuts. This is how the industry is brought down by pilots working for substandard wages. Get it now.

Yes, I think we all understand that argument, it is a typical argument, and it's incredibly simplistic thinking which only applies if all variables are the same between two airlines. They are not.
There ARE other scheduled cargo companies that compete directly with FedEx and UPS. Almost all of them pay significantly lower wages than the big two, yet many of them have struggled and/or failed while FedEx and UPS continue to thrive. Many of these smaller cargo companies pay wages less than half that of the big two, yet remain unsucessful. Why? Answer that.

Clearly employee wages are not the only factor determining the financial success of a company. There are many factors. We should be complaining that you guys at large airlines have pulled down wages by allowing your companies to fall into banckruptcy and accepting huge pay cuts which is strikingly similar to the effect detrimental effect foreclosures have on home values in real estate.

Another example, the union auto companies of Detroit now have lower wages than many of their foreign competitor's, yet they still continue to struggle. GM is in desperate need of cash, and Chrysler may not survive without a buyer soon. If your argument were correct, then the company should be doing well given their sub-standard employee wages. They are not. Why? Answer that too.

None of that matters though, because Allegiant's wages are improving and eventually they will be similar to other airlines.

 

[BRA]

We'll lets see. Let's say your company decides to expand rapidly and compete with ups/fdx directly (the freight world is much different, so it's hard to compare). They would probably do well because their costs are lower because you accept low, below standard pay and benefits. As your company continues to expand and do well on the backs of it's underpaid employees, it hurts ups/fdx. Eventually ups/fdx have to lower costs to compete with your company. This would include pilots taking paycuts. This is how the industry is brought down by pilots working for substandard wages. Get it now.

Still though, what do you suggest this guy should have done. He didn't by pass applying to the higher paying places, they wouldn't take him. He didn't try to beat the system. Does he sit home and collect welfare until UAL called? Multiple places shot him down and he still has bills to pay. He most likely invested some money into being an airline pilot. Does he have to not be an airline pilot because a choice company didn't hire him. I got shot down by one airline and several others that I applied to decided I wasn't worth their time. I got hired at other places and I got several type ratings and became a checkairman. I have thousands of hours of letter of investigation free PIC. So nothing was wrong with me. How much did your first flying jobs pay and were they paid at or above industry standard?

Is it fair to say that over 90% of the pilots on this board have worked at places that did not have industry leading pay? Weren't all those pilots that accepted jobs at companies without industry leading contracts helping to bring the industry down?

 

[BRA]

Anyone hear that in the near future Allegiant will revolutionize the industry by actually employing roadies for ramp operations. Even using them in place of flight attendants. Drug testing and allowing pyrotechnics on the runway are the last road blocks to making it happen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCJLoie5EGg

 

[Mamma]

We should be complaining that you guys at large airlines have pulled down wages by allowing your companies to fall into banckruptcy and accepting huge pay cuts which is strikingly similar to the effect detrimental effect foreclosures have on home values in real estate.

Interesting take but I think you are reaching a little too much. First, rank and file employees do not "allow" management to take a company into bankruptcy. That is management decision alone. Second, most airline employees did not "accept" lower pay when in bankruptcy...rates were forced upon them by judges. I think your rates are too low but your quality of life seems to rock when compared to just about everyone else.

 

[Daytonaflyer]

Interesting take but I think you are reaching a little too much. First, rank and file employees do not "allow" management to take a company into bankruptcy. That is management decision alone. Second, most airline employees did not "accept" lower pay when in bankruptcy...rates were forced upon them by judges. I think your rates are too low but your quality of life seems to rock when compared to just about everyone else.

I agree with you, but it's a stretch to say that Allegiant is bringing down your pay rates too. If pay rates were so dependent on competitors pay rates, SWA would no longer pay significantly more than other B737 operators.
FedEx and UPS would no longer pay more than other jumbo jet cargo operators either.
It is the business plan, decisions of management, and success of the entire company that determines whether pay is raised or lowered.

The day these companies show continuous losses, they too may lower their pay rates, regardless of what their competition is doing.

 

[Tri-holer]

Still though, what do you suggest this guy should have done. He didn't by pass applying to the higher paying places, they wouldn't take him. He didn't try to beat the system. Does he sit home and collect welfare until UAL called? Multiple places shot him down and he still has bills to pay. He most likely invested some money into being an airline pilot. Does he have to not be an airline pilot because a choice company didn't hire him. I got shot down by one airline and several others that I applied to decided I wasn't worth their time. I got hired at other places and I got several type ratings and became a checkairman. I have thousands of hours of letter of investigation free PIC. So nothing was wrong with me. How much did your first flying jobs pay and were they paid at or above industry standard?

Is it fair to say that over 90% of the pilots on this board have worked at places that did not have industry leading pay? Weren't all those pilots that accepted jobs at companies without industry leading contracts helping to bring the industry down?

Not me. I purposely avoided applying at those industry leading companies and only applied at LCCs whose stated purpose was to bring down the industry. There, I've said it and I feel free. I had no desire to work at a company with good pay and good schedules and instead concentrated on those companies where I knew I would be getting less pay for flying the same aircraft. Isn't that the American way.

Now, here I am stuck flying MD-80s for less than I could get at one of those industry leading companies and doggone it, my company is starting to pay pretty decent. I think it is almost time to start sending resumes out to more of the lower paying companies and see if I can get a job there and continue to "bring down the industry."

If you are at one of those industry-leading companies (not totally sure who that is anymore), congratulations. It is great that you are set for life and have a good retirement program. Just realize that because my family needs shelter and food, I have to work. I may not be in what you consider the best job (or even a suitable job), but I am doing what I have to do. We all do - even the guy who cleans out portapotties. I am sure he isn't exactly where he started out wanting to be.

The only fly in the ointment to my plan to leave here and go find a lower paying opportunity is my family. They like me being home every night and off a lot. Isn't that just the way it goes?

 

[chperplt]

The only fly in the ointment to my plan to leave here and go find a lower paying opportunity is my family. They like me being home every night and off a lot. Isn't that just the way it goes?

You can always replace the family....

 

[727Niteflyer]

We'll lets see. Let's say your company decides to expand rapidly and compete with ups/fdx directly (the freight world is much different, so it's hard to compare). They would probably do well because their costs are lower because you accept low, below standard pay and benefits. As your company continues to expand and do well on the backs of it's underpaid employees, it hurts ups/fdx. Eventually ups/fdx have to lower costs to compete with your company. This would include pilots taking paycuts. This is how the industry is brought down by pilots working for substandard wages. Get it now.

well lets see. My company doesnt compete against fdx or UPS and never will. My company is expanding but at a snails pace. I would hardly say that they are expanding on the backs of employees. They are expanding because of acquiring contracts which are very few and far between. The pipe dream of me ever working for a major carrier freight or passenger is long since gone. Now Im in it for myself and my family, not some jacka$$ american delta or fedex pilot. But gee maybe a large carrier like ups will buy my carrier. And Ill have the opportunity to work for a real airline making big bucks, Just like what happened to emery, cat, challenge and countless others. THATS HOW PILOTS TREAT PILOTS. Bottom line they dont care about me I dont care about them. Get that !!

 

[727Niteflyer]

so just to add more salt in the wound. I didnt get hired at a major carrier. I wasnt qualified with 9000hrs. The guys with 1500 hours were more qualified. So now I have to work where I can. And if that means my company competes against yours and hurts your agenda so be it. Just remember Im one of the ones that got turned down.

Go allegiant !!

 

[Freight Dog]

Got a question for ALGT boys and girls...

In the lobby over at corporate offices, aside from MD80 models and Allegiant memorabilia, they have an Airbus in the display. Re-fleeting sometime soon?