AirTran management pilots

[717capt]

I guess I had a different take on their SWA/737/FO bids. I thought that many of those guys wouldn't see the line until 2015,and therefore had the decency to NOT take a CA slot away from somebody else, only so that slot would go unused.

I agree with you. That was my thought on it as well.

 

[carl p]

Hey Carl,

I like your new avatar. I guess we now know your transistion bid..... Where did you find that, anyway?

Bubba

Bubba,

Thanks, I got the pic after the announcement was made last year. I was hoping to get the 737 and bid west coast but I missed it by about 90-100 numbers. Can't wait for 2015 so I can stop commuting LAX-ATL.

 

[PCL_128]

Our union officials have a duty to represent all of our pilots, check airman included. Not whom they like or dislike. Yeah I know that our management pilots are not part of alpa, but most of our check airman are. Even the tools. To suggest some sort of covert sit down with swapa and "talk badly" about one pilot or another whom they represent is not only morally wrong, it's against the law and a dfr waiting to happen. If this is really a sticking point, then I would suggest to ask the opinion of any airtran line pilot.
In my view however if that person does provide any information about another fellow pilot, then they need to look at themselves really really hard. YMMV.

I don't think anyone was talking about the checkairmen. They are part of the bargaining unit, and almost all of them are members in good standing. Everyone here was talking about management pilots, and their management jobs aren't in our craft or class.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Bubba,

Thanks, I got the pic after the announcement was made last year. I was hoping to get the 737 and bid west coast but I missed it by about 90-100 numbers. Can't wait for 2015 so I can stop commuting LAX-ATL.

Well, you shouldn't have any problem in 2015. OAK is traditionally the most junior base for everyone: F/As, CAs, and FOs. I was flew there for a few months a few years ago, and flew with a guy who lived in ORF, and commuted to OAK. I think it took him a minimum of two legs, and sometimes three, to get to and from work. Basically, all friggin day in each direction. He said he could hold BWI, but only on reserve, and that he could get a line in OAK. That was his rationale, anyway. Well, then he forgot to bid, and got weekend reserve in OAK anyway. I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere.

Merry Christmas,
Bubba

 

[GuppyWN]

There is. Put in a standing bid!

 

[carl p]

Well, you shouldn't have any problem in 2015. OAK is traditionally the most junior base for everyone: F/As, CAs, and FOs. I was flew there for a few months a few years ago, and flew with a guy who lived in ORF, and commuted to OAK. I think it took him a minimum of two legs, and sometimes three, to get to and from work. Basically, all friggin day in each direction. He said he could hold BWI, but only on reserve, and that he could get a line in OAK. That was his rationale, anyway. Well, then he forgot to bid, and got weekend reserve in OAK anyway. I'm sure there's a lesson there somewhere.

Merry Christmas,
Bubba

Lol, yep that would suck. Eventually I'll get back out west, and all will be good!

Merry Christmas & Happy Festivus!
Carl

 

[chris69]

Still hearing DEN then LAX on internal forums. Didn't SWAPA discuss "what if's" at the Dec BOD meeting wrt representing all AT pilots before 2015? Something like a side SWAPA? Have a close bud on the BOD who mentioned this and but haven't heard anything since. May be too complicated or something tabled until after SOC.

 

[Lear70]

The ATN NC and MC and MEC officers are headed to DAL to discuss representation issues in late January.

That said, you're likely correct, as I'm sure nothing will be done regarding representation issues until after SOC.

 

[Britpilot]

Can't come soon enough.
Time to get rid of the self serving, worthless wannabe politicians.

 

[carl p]

True dat

 

[sixlegs]

Does anyone think that alpa or the At MEC did a good Job on the process? With the refusal of the first offer by Murphy, lindon, and the gang, is the average AT pilot pissed? I would be. What are your thoughts? Educate me here.

 

[Ualexpress]

Niether Murphy or Linden voted. Murphy was not on the MEC, and Linden would have cast the tie breaking vote if needed. Since it was a 7-1 vote, it was not needed. I believe Linden would have voted yes if it was a 4-4 vote.

 

[PCL_128]

Does anyone think that alpa or the At MEC did a good Job on the process? With the refusal of the first offer by Murphy, lindon, and the gang, is the average AT pilot pissed? I would be. What are your thoughts? Educate me here.

Some pilots are pissed that the first offer got voted down, some pilots are pissed that the second offer got vote in, but most pilots are just moving on and not spending a whole lot of time thinking about it. It's over.

 

[Ty Webb]

Does anyone think that alpa or the At MEC did a good Job on the process? With the refusal of the first offer by Murphy, lindon, and the gang, is the average AT pilot pissed? I would be. What are your thoughts? Educate me here.

Yawn.

 

[scoreboardII]

Can't come soon enough.
Time to get rid of the self serving, worthless wannabe politicians.

how you gonna get rid of those SWAPA guys?

 

[SWA717]

The first offer was voted down because are elected LEC reps said enough people had emailed them to vote it down. Ofcourse you will never see this evidence because it was all a lie, hence their recalls. What a joke.

 

[Spud]

The first offer was voted down because are elected LEC reps said enough people had emailed them to vote it down. Ofcourse you will never see this evidence because it was all a lie, hence their recalls. What a joke.

You musta missed the meeting... Overwhelming opposition would be an understatement.

 

[27 driver]

You musta missed the meeting... Overwhelming opposition would be an understatement.

Ya the meeting was a true representation of the pilot group. Maybe the few that were off and able to get to the meeting.....but nowhere near a true cross-section of our group.

 

[PCL_128]

There were 200 and some odd pilots at that meeting. With only 1,700 total pilots, and only about 700 off on any given day, that's an incredible sample size. There can't be any real doubt that at that time, the overall pilot group was opposed to AIP1. Their minds only changed after the letter from GK the following week.

 

[sixlegs]

Interesting. So if most of the pilots did not want the first offer anyway, why are they so pissed at ALPA / AT MEC/ LEC? Didn't their elected officials do what the pilot's collective will was? I had an AT jumpseater on the other day and he was way pissed - still. It just strikes me as odd that the pilots didn't want the first offer andthen got pissed at their reps for listening to them. (Unfortunately the offer behind door number two was worse for them)

 

[dicko]

Interesting. So if most of the pilots did not want the first offer anyway, why are they so pissed at ALPA / AT MEC/ LEC? Didn't their elected officials do what the pilot's collective will was? I had an AT jumpseater on the other day and he was way pissed - still. It just strikes me as odd that the pilots didn't want the first offer andthen got pissed at their reps for listening to them. (Unfortunately the offer behind door number two was worse for them)

I think they may have believed in the whole Mediation, Arbitration and integration thingy. It was all laid out in a bunch of special documents with cool names and lots of important signatures. Like a fairy tale.

:0

 

[27 driver]

There were 200 and some odd pilots at that meeting. With only 1,700 total pilots, and only about 700 off on any given day, that's an incredible sample size. There can't be any real doubt that at that time, the overall pilot group was opposed to AIP1. Their minds only changed after the letter from GK the following week.

With all due respect. You have no idea what the pilot group wanted. You had been out of touch with the rank and file for a long time. I only know about the guys I flew with but most wanted the chance to vote. Some would have voted no, some yes but either way we should have voted. You know damn well that only the vocal minority show up at those meetings.

 

[PCL_128]

You know damn well that only the vocal minority show up at those meetings.

No, the vocal minority only shows up at typical routine meetings. This meeting was neither typical nor routine. There were lots of people at that meeting that I have never seen before. They weren't your typical malcontents and loudmouths. It was a wide cross-section of the membership. Denying it is to rewrite history.

 

[Spud]

No, the vocal minority only shows up at typical routine meetings. This meeting was neither typical nor routine. There were lots of people at that meeting that I have never seen before. They weren't your typical malcontents and loudmouths. It was a wide cross-section of the membership. Denying it is to rewrite history.

All true.

I don't blame the magnificent seven, they were representin' in the ATL, know what I'm sayin.

Our Guys did what they thought was right. Hell, even SWAPA was against the B scale.

There is only one person that deserves blame in this fiasco...GK! Just weeks after saying no ones job was in jeopardy he comes out and says everyone's job was in jeopardy- Not what we were expecting from the golden rule club, more like the golden shower club.

 

[Kenney G]

Does anyone think that alpa or the At MEC did a good Job on the process? With the refusal of the first offer by Murphy, lindon, and the gang, is the average AT pilot pissed? I would be. What are your thoughts? Educate me here.

I do. I think they did the right thing as not to allow the BS threats to affect them. It was always about the senority and then the airtran pilots turned it into a money issue after the fact. How could any of the FO reps vote for a complete staple? And for those of you who will argue the threat angle please post any statement in writting that SWA put out saying the would not intergrate. Or where any Top SWA management said they would not intergrate other than to the MC behind closed doors. Yes the threat was implied but never confirmed as yes we will in fact 100% not intergrate if we go to arbitration. All I ever saw was they would take a look at it.

 

[Cometman]

No, the vocal minority only shows up at typical routine meetings. This meeting was neither typical nor routine. There were lots of people at that meeting that I have never seen before. They weren't your typical malcontents and loudmouths. It was a wide cross-section of the membership. Denying it is to rewrite history.

It won't be long and you will not be involved in any union activities for a long time. ALPA will be finished with you and I seriously doubt you will ever get a SWAPA position. Especially with your reputation. You will just be a bottom feeder for a long time.

 

[SWA717]

The fact of the matter is that threats where made to our elected reps before SLI 1 was released, but some of these elected reps decided not to be honest and hide these threats, namely one who went as far to release an official ALPA email saying that there were no threats made. So alot of the people who were against SL1 were basing their wants based on not knowing about the threats. Once they found out that they were lied to, then they changed their mind.

 

[Kenney G]

The fact of the matter is that threats where made to our elected reps before SLI 1 was released, but some of these elected reps decided not to be honest and hide these threats, namely one who went as far to release an official ALPA email saying that there were no threats made. So alot of the people who were against SL1 were basing their wants based on not knowing about the threats. Once they found out that they were lied to, then they changed their mind.

Again can you show me where that is in print or said in a public forum the they would not 100 % intergrate if it went to arbitration? Was what was said behind that closed door an implied threat or we will not intergrate if you go to arbitration. I heard they would reevaluate. Big Big difference. Threats are a part of negotiations

 

[Uppercrust]

I was at the meeting with Ty and -9Capt and each of us will tell you there was strong opposition against the first agreement.

 

[stalker]

I must have come across a couple of the malcontents the other day in PHL. AT capt and fo waiting for their hotel van, as I walked within five feet of them I said hi guys hows it going, to which both of them turned their heads in the opposite direction and looked away without a word! WTF!