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bobbysamd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 5,710
TAB P-F-T
Sure, it's humorous. They ran the same stupid banner in last month's Flying as well. That issue also had an article about the "company."
Tell the furloughees that airline hiring has resumed.
Now, I have another reason to scream about age discrimination. I'm 51 and they take people only 50 and under!
TAB P-F-T in and of itself is bad enough. It just slays me to see a heretofore reputable magazine stoop to running such blatant multi-page ads and call them "articles."
Sure, it's humorous. They ran the same stupid banner in last month's Flying as well. That issue also had an article about the "company."
Tell the furloughees that airline hiring has resumed.
Now, I have another reason to scream about age discrimination. I'm 51 and they take people only 50 and under!
TAB P-F-T in and of itself is bad enough. It just slays me to see a heretofore reputable magazine stoop to running such blatant multi-page ads and call them "articles."
VelcroJetDriver
Active member
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2002
- Posts
- 31
The article in FLYING doesn't surprise me. Although overall it is a good GA magazine, their editorialists have in the past (mid-90's) reasoned that pay-for-training is justified. They also once had a two-page story about a Lear driver who scabbed at CAL, didn't like airline flying, and went back to flying the Lear. Made him out to be a hero.
Before you take out a huge loan to go to TAB, or another one of the huge flight schools consider this. The monthly payment on a $80,000 at 10% is $772 each month. Try comming up with that much each month as a CFI. Also, that total cost of the loan will be about $185k. Pretty expensive for some King Air time.
Funny.
I happen to live in Deland where TAB keeps their a/c and thier not so large flight school. Those King Airs don't fly that often and many are not in airworthy condition. Something smells funny about that whole operation. BTW, the guys there all walk aroung in airline uniforms, hat and all. OBSURD! Total joke of a program.
TAB = minor leage before going to Gulfstream.
I happen to live in Deland where TAB keeps their a/c and thier not so large flight school. Those King Airs don't fly that often and many are not in airworthy condition. Something smells funny about that whole operation. BTW, the guys there all walk aroung in airline uniforms, hat and all. OBSURD! Total joke of a program.
TAB = minor leage before going to Gulfstream.
bobbysamd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 5,710
Don't pay the TAB (sorry)
Sure, it smells funny. Nice to hear a first-hand view of the place. I will say that uniforms wouldn't bother me; I wore a uniform when I was an FSI instructor and had no qualms about it. No caps, though; that sounds funky.
Let's say you go through the program at somewhat low time, say 500 hours. You leave with the 100 hours of turbine multi in your logbook. Let's assume further that it is completely legal time. Probably not PIC but SIC. You send in your resume to some commuter, hoping it will get attention from the H.R. pukes. They'll see the time and will scratch their head, "how could this applicant get 100 hours of turbine multi in a scheduled operation with such low time?" They'll delve into it further and figure out the semi-quasi-P-F-T aspect, and will know it was paid for.
Sure, there are plenty of hoops to jump through to get to the goal, and you have to jump through the hoops in sequence. Trying to circumvent the system and routine generally gets you nowhere.
It's frustrating. I was plenty frustrated years ago when I saw that commuters wanted 500 hours of multi and I was impatient to get it. Eventually, I did, by getting a job and biding my time. And, I got interviews.
Read the article about the place in the May Flying. It bills itself as producing FOs ready for the line. Whatever advantage there may be is automatically negated because every new-hire has to go through specific initial training at his/her company. No school, in any industry or profession, can boast that its graduates are company-ready. Every company has its own way of doing things and every new-hire has to be trained in its procedures. The best a school can do is familiarize its trainees with generic procedures, which may be completely different at a specific company.
I could absolutely live with the notion of a TAB Express if it just was a sort of pilot finishing school and billed itself as such. But, still, the advantage gained would be doubtful at best.
Sure, it smells funny. Nice to hear a first-hand view of the place. I will say that uniforms wouldn't bother me; I wore a uniform when I was an FSI instructor and had no qualms about it. No caps, though; that sounds funky.
Let's say you go through the program at somewhat low time, say 500 hours. You leave with the 100 hours of turbine multi in your logbook. Let's assume further that it is completely legal time. Probably not PIC but SIC. You send in your resume to some commuter, hoping it will get attention from the H.R. pukes. They'll see the time and will scratch their head, "how could this applicant get 100 hours of turbine multi in a scheduled operation with such low time?" They'll delve into it further and figure out the semi-quasi-P-F-T aspect, and will know it was paid for.
Sure, there are plenty of hoops to jump through to get to the goal, and you have to jump through the hoops in sequence. Trying to circumvent the system and routine generally gets you nowhere.
It's frustrating. I was plenty frustrated years ago when I saw that commuters wanted 500 hours of multi and I was impatient to get it. Eventually, I did, by getting a job and biding my time. And, I got interviews.
Read the article about the place in the May Flying. It bills itself as producing FOs ready for the line. Whatever advantage there may be is automatically negated because every new-hire has to go through specific initial training at his/her company. No school, in any industry or profession, can boast that its graduates are company-ready. Every company has its own way of doing things and every new-hire has to be trained in its procedures. The best a school can do is familiarize its trainees with generic procedures, which may be completely different at a specific company.
I could absolutely live with the notion of a TAB Express if it just was a sort of pilot finishing school and billed itself as such. But, still, the advantage gained would be doubtful at best.
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qwerty
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2002
- Posts
- 159
I know a couple of people who went there and are very pleased with the training they got. They fly for the commuters now. That is what most of us kids are trying to do, right?
They are airline pilots...and I still spend 12hrs at the airport to log 4hrs dual given in a 152, on a good day.
who knows..who knows
They are airline pilots...and I still spend 12hrs at the airport to log 4hrs dual given in a 152, on a good day.
who knows..who knows
publisher
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2001
- Posts
- 592
Bobbysamd
Bobby,
Go visit the place and then make the judgements. This is definitely not PFT so lets get that straight right off. No passengers, no airline. This is a school.
Second, people have been hired out of this program in the last 6 months.
Third, an un-named CEO said at the RAA that they continue to get their people from college programs and affiliated flight schools.
Let us realize that most of the major furloughee's are untouchable, for better or worse.
Every instructor I met at TAB was and is an airline pilot.
The airplanes looked good to me.
Bobby,
Go visit the place and then make the judgements. This is definitely not PFT so lets get that straight right off. No passengers, no airline. This is a school.
Second, people have been hired out of this program in the last 6 months.
Third, an un-named CEO said at the RAA that they continue to get their people from college programs and affiliated flight schools.
Let us realize that most of the major furloughee's are untouchable, for better or worse.
Every instructor I met at TAB was and is an airline pilot.
The airplanes looked good to me.
bobbysamd
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 5,710
Is it really ONLY a school?
I dunno about it not being a revenue or pax-carrying outfit and it being just a school.
I saw this on the Newsletter link at www.tabexpress.com :
"TAB Express to launch FAA Part 135 Operations in Addition to our First Officer Training Operations.
"TAB Express is currently going through the motions to launch 'On Demand' two-crew 135 charter service. Combining the cost effectiveness, reliability, passenger space and speed of the King Air will give TAB pilots needing to build up to 500+ hours that some of the regional airlines may require. TAB First Officers will serve as FO's on these flights."
Then, if you go to the Enter Here button on the home page, you see what very much looks like a scheduled carrier timetable, e.g, with flights from Deland to Tallahassee, along with a route structure map.
Combine a timetable, route structure, and plans to create an on-demand charter service in which its FO trainees will fly these flights, and you get persuasive evidence that TAB is, or contemplates, a revenue-producing operation apart from the FO program. We then could delve into the op specs issue to determine if these folks are required crewmembers. Therefore, while the place may not be blatant P-F-T as it is at you-know-where, it's hard not to say the place isn't at least semi or quasi-P-F-T.
I'd love to visit there, actually. Once again, I have no problems with the idea of wearing uniforms.
I'm sure P-F-T people do get hired. Not to restart this debate, but what will the reaction to them be down the road. As Qwerty said, who knows? Who knows?
I dunno about it not being a revenue or pax-carrying outfit and it being just a school.
I saw this on the Newsletter link at www.tabexpress.com :
"TAB Express to launch FAA Part 135 Operations in Addition to our First Officer Training Operations.
"TAB Express is currently going through the motions to launch 'On Demand' two-crew 135 charter service. Combining the cost effectiveness, reliability, passenger space and speed of the King Air will give TAB pilots needing to build up to 500+ hours that some of the regional airlines may require. TAB First Officers will serve as FO's on these flights."
Then, if you go to the Enter Here button on the home page, you see what very much looks like a scheduled carrier timetable, e.g, with flights from Deland to Tallahassee, along with a route structure map.
Combine a timetable, route structure, and plans to create an on-demand charter service in which its FO trainees will fly these flights, and you get persuasive evidence that TAB is, or contemplates, a revenue-producing operation apart from the FO program. We then could delve into the op specs issue to determine if these folks are required crewmembers. Therefore, while the place may not be blatant P-F-T as it is at you-know-where, it's hard not to say the place isn't at least semi or quasi-P-F-T.
I'd love to visit there, actually. Once again, I have no problems with the idea of wearing uniforms.
I'm sure P-F-T people do get hired. Not to restart this debate, but what will the reaction to them be down the road. As Qwerty said, who knows? Who knows?
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