Air France Flight Missing

[~~~^~~~]

Whoops - already reported. Disregard.

 

[poppi]

As it pertains to this AF thread, the ability to hold any kind of pitch to within a degree or 2 at FL350 is nullfied by the presence of severe or extreme turbulence, the definition of which is the aircraft is at least sometimes "impossible to control", especially in a sluggish, wallowing aircraft. That means your pitch may be at least partially controlled not by you, but by outside forces you're merely fighting to counteract.

Throw in being knocked around on the roll axis with the corresponding sudden rises in wing loading (which will further serve to degrade speed and raise the low-speed buffet margin) threatening to stall one or both wings because you're high, and the only answer arises....pitch for a descent if possible to help maintain and increase aerodynamic control, and keep it right side up.

And if you're caught in a CB-produced severe updraft that lets go while you're still in a nose-up, level flight attitude based on FL350 numbers, at FL370 that same attitude puts you in a world of hurt. What works as an answer for the single problem of erroneous airspeed readings at 10000' or FL350 in smooth air isn't necassarily the best answer or what should be applied to what the AF likely found itself in.


spot on

 

[glasspilot1]

The recovered parts of the Titanic from that depth so they should be able to get the recorders.

The problem is not the depth, it's "where are they"?

 

[Princedietrich]

at 0210Z : from bottom to top :
- AUTO FLT AP OFF
-F/CTL ALTN LAW
- FlAG ON Capt PFD
- FLAG ON F/O PFD
- AUTO FLT ATHR OFF
- NAV TCAS FAULT
- FLAG ON CAPT PFD
- FLAG ON F/O PFD
- F/CTL RUD TRV LIM FAULT
- EFCS2...1..EFCS1...AFS
- EFCS1...X2..EFCS2X

at 0211Z :
- FLAG ON CAPT PFD
- FLAG ON F/O PFD

at 0212z:
- NAV ADR DISAGREE
- ISIS ....ISIS
- IR2...1,EFCS1X, IR1, IR3

at 0213Z :
- F/CTL PRIM1 FAULT
- F/CTL SEC1 FAULT
- AFS 1 FMGEC1

Please forgive my lack of knowledge on this subject, but I'm not a glass cockpit jet pilot and therefore I'm not fluent in the failure codes. Any chance someone could translate these?

 

[Donsa320]

Please forgive my lack of knowledge on this subject, but I'm not a glass cockpit jet pilot and therefore I'm not fluent in the failure codes. Any chance someone could translate these?

OK I'll stick my neck out a little. The events suggest a cascading electrical failure. At the end there may have been no aircraft attitude instruments available. In cloud, at night, in turbulence, arg!

But what started it? That is the $64 question. Bomb? Static discharge? Structural failure? Mechanical failure? Mid-air? Meteorite strike? One can go as far out as you want at this point.

This will be a tough one to solve.

DC

 

[Mike man]

The pilots should have direct control of the aircraft...no moving of a joystick...which signals a computer to signal a flight control actuator. Bound to cause an accident sooner or later.

When did this become amateur hour?

The A320's have been flying for over 20 years now, which accidents have been caused by the flight computers? Do tell...please.

 

[Mike man]

I found this on a different site...

02:10Z:Autothrust off
Autopilot off
FBW alternate law
Rudder Travel Limiter Fault
TCAS fault due to antenna fault
Flight Envelope Computation warning
All pitot static ports lost

02:11Z:Failure of all three ADIRUs
Failure of gyros of ISIS (attitude information lost)

02:12Z:ADIRUs Air Data disagree

02:13Z:Flight Management, Guidance and Envelope Computer fault
PRIM 1 fault
SEC 1 fault02:14Z:Cabin Pressure Controller fault (cabin vertical speed)

 

[Fedora]

When did this become amateur hour?

The A320's have been flying for over 20 years now, which accidents have been caused by the flight computers? Do tell...please.

Try the Paris Air Show years ago when the flight computer landed the jet in the forest. Trying to do a low pass the crew didn't realize what "mode" the computer was in. It was landing. Crews advanced throttles and rotated the aircraft, both actions were overridden by the computer logic. Am I wrong here? It was a long time ago.

 

[Whine Lover]

"..the crew didn't realize what "mode" the computer was in. "

Therefore, Pilot error.

However, were there no FBW ( direct mechanical control ) and no "modes" to deal with there would have been no crash.

Hmmm. A conundrum.

Next: Which came first? The Chicken? Or, the Egg?


MKR

 

[Lear70]

That's one thing I don't like about the Airbus.

On a Boeing, if I override the autothrottles (just by moving them) or kick the autopilot off, I have control of the airplane. Period. The end.

Of course, this could have nothing to do with the accident sequence, it's just a personal pet peeve I have of Airbus. I didn't get this far to let a computer fly my plane,,,