Age 65 Vote

jetstream

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Just got my e-mail from ALPA informing me of an upcoming vote, November 17th, in the Sentate Transportation Committee to change the mandatory retirement age to 65 within 30 days of it being adopted as the ICAO standard in November 2006.

The ALPA e-mail was requesting that members call certain Senators and encourage them to vote NO.

As a regional airline pilot trying to give my family a decent standard of living, save for retirement, and with two kids I hope to be able to put through college I'm thinking I might need to work until 65. That is unless the great minds at ALPA can figure out a way get me a substantial pay increase.

Anybody else feel this way?
 

Flying Illini

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Good: When you turn 60, you can still work another 5 years because you will need too.
Good: You will probably be pretty senior, therefore able to draw a decent paycheck while having a decent schedule

Bad: If you are 40, hoping to finally get a decent line as your seniority increases, you may have to wait awhile as the age 60 guys may hang around for a while longer.
Bad: Airlines won't want the high overhead that a senior pilot demands...especially for another 5 years.

Compromise: Allow pilots to still retire at age 60 (or 61,62,63,64) if they want, without any pension (what's left) or benefits penalties.
What I'm saying is, let those extra 5 years be "bonus" years. Stay if you want and make more money, or retire if you want, and take your pension with no penalties whether your 60 or 63.

Corp. guys can work past 60, why can't the airline guys? If you need a few more years to make the financials of retirement work out, you should be able to do it.
 

tjsatter

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This issue especially shows the absence of real leadership at ALPA as well as one of the real faults with democracy. True leaders do the right thing which may not be the most popular thing. Governing by polls or to appease the majority is not real leadership. Sometimes the right thing to do is not the most popular. I oppose ALPAs stance on Age 60 and the manner in which they reafirmed it. A poll will always show support for maintaining the age 60 rule which was institued and retained for the reasons that Fliyng Illini lists. The rule has nothing to do with technical reality but is political.

The Old farts are overpaid and in the way of my upgrade and lifestyle improvements. I was lobbying another guy to participate in the ALPA poll: "Don't you oppose mandatory retirement at 60?" Well, yes, of course but they should wait until after the Delta guys retire and I'm on there. That's not how it works, someday with luck you may be an old fart too needing to work longer but unable to do so due to an artifical rule and you will be the minority.

ALPA is WRONG on this issue.

tj
 

BoilerUP

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Everybody knew about the Age 60 rule when they got into the business. Although times may currently be bad, they won't always be...but some of you want to change the rules in the middle of the game?

Once you turn 60 you can still fly 91 or 135. Yes, your airline career may be over but you don't have to retire your headset permanently once you get the water cannon salute. There are many flying jobs available to highly-experienced retired airline pilots, but not at the same income level. If you are are 60 and "have" to work to pay off your debts you did a piss-poor job of managing your funds. Even as a RJ captain with 5 years seniority you make upwards of 60K, which is more than the median household income in many states. You don't need a Beemer and you don't need a McMansion, you need to live below your means and at 60 (or 55 if you are lucky) retire to the golf course, hunting shack, lake or wherever else your interests take you. It doesn't take a $250K/year salary to accomplish that, either.

I should not have my career in general and my upgrade and QOL specifically impeded because pilots are financially irresponsible. Yes that is selfish but so is changing the rules now because it is financially convenient to you. Upping the retirement age from 60 to 65 would be detrimental to every pilot hoping to be hired at a legacy or LCC in their career.
 

ultrarunner

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BoilerUP said:
Upping the retirement age from 60 to 65 would be detrimental to every pilot hoping to be hired at a legacy or LCC in their career.

Hopefully the lawmakers will consider those that DO work at those carriers and not those that WANT to, when they change the law.
 

Redan

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Twice in a day I feel I have to comment, unusual.

I'm afraid I can't agree with Boiler Up on this issue. Yes, everyone knew about Age 60. But it's not about changing the rules in the middle of the road at all. It's about righting a wrong. Rules and laws of any sort which are purely political and unsubstantiated are wrong and need to be corrected. Tjsatter is quite correct in his post. Citing financial, QOL, or upgrade as reasons to maintain an arbitrary rule are not valid. Abolishing the 60 rule will certainly not enhance my career progression either, but that is not the point.
 

jetstream

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BoilerUP said:
Everybody knew about the Age 60 rule when they got into the business. Although times may currently be bad, they won't always be...but some of you want to change the rules in the middle of the game?

Once you turn 60 you can still fly 91 or 135. Yes, your airline career may be over but you don't have to retire your headset permanently once you get the water cannon salute. There are many flying jobs available to highly-experienced retired airline pilots, but not at the same income level. If you are are 60 and "have" to work to pay off your debts you did a piss-poor job of managing your funds. Even as a RJ captain with 5 years seniority you make upwards of 60K, which is more than the median household income in many states. You don't need a Beemer and you don't need a McMansion, you need to live below your means and at 60 (or 55 if you are lucky) retire to the golf course, hunting shack, lake or wherever else your interests take you. It doesn't take a $250K/year salary to accomplish that, either.

I should not have my career in general and my upgrade and QOL specifically impeded because pilots are financially irresponsible. Yes that is selfish but so is changing the rules now because it is financially convenient to you. Upping the retirement age from 60 to 65 would be detrimental to every pilot hoping to be hired at a legacy or LCC in their career.




Thanks for the lecture but as long as I am mentally and physically qualified to do the job, the decision as to when to retire should be mine and not mandated by law.
 

AZ Typed

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jetstream said:
Just got my e-mail from ALPA informing me of an upcoming vote, November 17th, in the Sentate Transportation Committee to change the mandatory retirement age to 65 within 30 days of it being adopted as the ICAO standard in November 2006.

The ALPA e-mail was requesting that members call certain Senators and encourage them to vote NO.

As a regional airline pilot trying to give my family a decent standard of living, save for retirement, and with two kids I hope to be able to put through college I'm thinking I might need to work until 65. That is unless the great minds at ALPA can figure out a way get me a substantial pay increase.

Anybody else feel this way?

You "THINK" you'll need to work till 65? Get a financial plan guy. By the way - how is ALPA looking out for it's members if ALPA supports firing them at 60? Nice.

AZT (ALPA Member & Supporter (usually))
 

kngarthur

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jetstream said:
Just got my e-mail from ALPA informing me of an upcoming vote, November 17th, in the Sentate Transportation Committee to change the mandatory retirement age to 65 within 30 days of it being adopted as the ICAO standard in November 2006.

The ALPA e-mail was requesting that members call certain Senators and encourage them to vote NO.

As a regional airline pilot trying to give my family a decent standard of living, save for retirement, and with two kids I hope to be able to put through college I'm thinking I might need to work until 65. That is unless the great minds at ALPA can figure out a way get me a substantial pay increase.

Anybody else feel this way?

You mean I'm going to have to wait until 65 to smoke weed!
 

NewBlue

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BoilerUP said:
...but some of you want to change the rules in the middle of the game?quote]


Why not? It was changed to 60 in the middle of the game.
 

100LL... Again!

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Hey PCL-

Hilarious to hear a PFT'er talk about other people being in their way. I guess it is the way you guys think.

Too many CFIs and freight dogs who paid their dues were in front of you, I guess.

When you are cooling your heels at whatever major you wind up at waiting for your upgrade, he11 - where is your checkbook, anyway??
 

indianboy7

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kngarthur said:
You mean I'm going to have to wait until 65 to smoke weed!


Damn skippy........i'm gonna retire at 45 for that exact reason :pimp:

why delay the happiness for any longer than I have to ??
 

bailout

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Thank goodness the email included all the voting senators, which i promptly emailed everyone of them asking for their support to vote YES......

You guys who dont want it extended are complete idiots, naive and short sighted to say the least. This will help EVERYONE. So you make captain a few years later, so what. Youll be one for that much longer. Yeah im older, and yeah i had a good financial plan, but guess what?? LIFE happened... Marriage, kids, sick kids, health issues,divorce, etc... We'll see how you feel about it when youre out of daipers..
 

SuperPilot

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What I don't like is that the government makes you retire at 60 and then penalizes you for retiring early. What is that all about!?!
 

CoATP

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Chase someone out of the cockpit that has experience and skill (gets 6 mo physicals and checkrides) does not seem to be very smart. The age 60 rulke was cooked up in a smoke filled back room so the "big wigs" of aviation could get the high paid experienced pilots out of the way.

This sounds like something they are doing now but in a different way. If one wants to work and can continue then why not let them?

If this is true in the rest of the world why not here?

Email your senator with your opinion to VOTE YES!
 

Dirty Sanchez

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I am glad to see my dues put to such good use.

If pensions still existed, this would not be an issue.
 

pilotyip

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For all the pro age 60 retirement age pilots, put it in your union contract that is the mandatory retirement age, but don't force your opinions down on the rest of us.
 
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