Age 60 Battle vs ALPA

[PHX767]

Age 60 is a political issue. Wake up and smell the BK!

B.S!

It's a retirement (no more A fund) issue!

 

[Workin'Stiff]

Exactly! Age 60 really has nothing to do with physical/mental issues. With todays technology, more and more "flying" is being taken out of the pilots hands. Lets face it, we are becoming professional "monitors."

This issue comes to front row when the airline your working for declares bankruptcy and the nest egg you've built up is suddenly gone. I'd ventrue to say that most of these pilot are looking to work a few extra years to recover something... Even though they may be grabbing for straws...

 

[michael707767]

ALPA is basically a democratic organization in that it's votes that affect its policies. Becoming a non-member means no vote which means no input. Their protest will not have the desired effect.

Right on the money. I hate ALPA. Would love it if our pilot group left. But why would I quit and loose my ability to have a vote? Foolish.

 

[330 man]

Sorry General Lee but age 60 has never been about safety. In the late 1950's the head of American airlines was having trouble with his senior pilots. They were starting to make too many demands on management about pay and scheduling. So he called the head of the CAB who happened to be a very close relative, (brother in law I think) and asked for help. The two of them came up a plan to set a manditory retirement age. They decided that 60 was a good number because it would rid AA of most of the trouble makers. Congressional hearings were held and the government doctors testified that a pilot over 60 "may not be as safe" as one who was under 60, and congress bought it. In all of the hearings since 1957 there has never been any evidence submitted showing that a pilot over 60 is unsafe.

It was originally a labor issue, and then became a political issue.

It does suprise me that alpa is not in favor of changing the rule, because I was surprised that the membership voted against it. There are 15000 pilots so far who have lost most of their retirement, and surly more wil follow. The only way to make it up is to work longer. Unfortunately that is not possible, partially thanks to our glorious leaders at alpa. In my entire career they have been nothing more than my $200 a month pen pals!
Regards,

330 Man

 

[Freight Dog]

ALPA put out a survey of the ENTIRE active membership, not just some random people. ALPA membership has spoken and it has spoken against it.

Bear in mind, this did not include furloughed pilots who didn't find another employment, or anything like that. Just because you are close to 60 and want to keep working doesn't make your vote any more important than those of more junior FO's.

Now, had this happened in 1998, in the peak of hiring/record wages... you probably would have had a different result. Now..... the membership has spoken, and the old guys are throwing a temper tantrum instead of gracefully bowing to the majority.

Sad.... very sad...

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Every other professional in the world strives for a fairly early retirement at a fairly young age. It is interesting that 121 airline pilots are the only professional group that is actually fighting to work longer. With the average salary and benefits of an airline pilot, if you cannot afford to retire at age 60, then yes, it is a mental issue.

 

[semperfido]

Every other professional in the world strives for a fairly early retirement at a fairly young age. It is interesting that 121 airline pilots are the only professional group that is actually fighting to work longer. With the average salary and benefits of an airline pilot, if you cannot afford to retire at age 60, then yes, it is a mental issue.

average salary and benefits of yesteryear you meant to say!

 

[TheDonger]

You can tell whose getting a pension

Gee, somehow I think those that are against the over 60 rule would change their minds in a heartbeat if/when they lose their pension.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

average salary and benefits of yesteryear you meant to say!

Thank-you , exactly. This is all different of course for the young guys who are not yet worried about 60 and out.

 

[General Lee]

Agreed, age 60 is a safety issue for ALPA. Just like the three pilots that were required to fly the B-737. How come we now have all these unsafe 737s flying around today with only two pilots?

The JAA in Europe has changed the age to 65, Japan has gone to 65, Canada, Australia, and NZ have no max age.

MD11 Captain, huh? Thought so. You have a little more invested in this issue than most. Well, you may be Superman and have great health, but most of you DO NOT. As far as the 737 and the GIB (Guy in Back), that had nothing to do with health. We used to have ROPES (Real Old Pilots) fly FE on the L1011 and 727 until we got rid of them, but they were not allowed to "fly" the plane. I think the old timers should be retained in some way----like recurrent ground school or sim instructors. As far as the age rules in Europe and Japan etc-----that is just an accident waiting to happen. I believe the English version has the Captains demoted to FO, which is still unsafe IMO. IF you want to keep flying after 60, go corporate----which won't endanger as many lives. (unless you hit a 747)


Bye Bye--General Lee