ACA might not be joking

[El Duderino]

Excuse my ignorance, but what are Green on Green rules.

thanks
duder

 

[enigma]

Excuse my ignorance, but what are Green on Green rules.

thanks
duder

I don't try and remember info that won't apply to me in the next few months, so I've forgotten the exact hours, but "green on green" refers to a 121 rule that dictates that someone in the cockpit must have at least 75 hours in the type of aircraft. This rule is routinely exempted for new fleet types. The rule is aimed at keeping an airline from pairing a new FO with a newly upgraded Captain who had not flown the type before the upgrade. Not a problem for single type carriers like SWA, but take AA for example. A pilot could spend his FO career in Boeings, but take the Maddog or Fokker for the upgrade; in which case he can't be paired with a newhire FO.

Hope this helps,
enigma

 

[ifly4food]

I think that it's just a threat to put the heat on UAL to keep them.

The whole deal is reminiscent of the days right before Delta executed its hostile takeover of Comair. That could get interesting.

As for the DAL PWA "prohibiting" codeshare with ACA, the DCI operation would go back under the ACJet certificate. ACJet is a wholly owned sub of ACA's parent company. In this regard, the Delta PWA wouldn't be applicable because ACA and ACJet would be separate companies.
This separate companies argument is the same one that the Delta pilots used to thwart a merger when ASA and Comair were purchased by Delta. It's funny to hear Delta pilots scream how "separate companies" is only applicable when it's in their benefit, but I guess that's what we've come to expect. Maybe there's too much lead in the water down there in Peachtree City.

 

[46Driver]

I am going to disagree with you here. I do think we have every intention of going it alone - or with somebody other than United. (hopefully Sir Richard Branson and Virgin) News today in the USA Today (via the Denver newspaper) that UAL may be forced to close down its Dulles hub and rely on US Air.

 

[rightrudder]

Green on green doesn't apply with a new A/C type is introduced.

 

[Bravo F/O]

So what you are saying is neither pilot has experience in the new airframe. To me that sounds worse then "green on green".

 

[Typhoon1244]

Can you safely switch from captain on an RJ to captain on a 737 with just sim training, a few bounces and a type rating?

Oh no! Of course not! Flying a 50,000 pound jet does absolutely nothing to prepare you for flying a 100,000 pound jet. That would be like transitioning from a bicycle to...a bigger bicycle! Suicide!



I expect this kind of ignorance from the general public. Sad to see a question like this coming from a pilot.

 

[siedkick]

Probably wouldn't be too bad once you got used to the slower approach speeds.

 

[guyincognito]

Wow, Typhoon, got some anger management issues there?

For starters, I AM part of the 'general public'. I'm just a little 'ol private pilot, living vicariously through you guys by surfing this board, while doing my part to keep you in a job. (I've flown over 80,000 miles this year.) I rent a lot of cars in my line of work. If I'm driving a Ford one day, then a Chevy the next, it takes a few minutes to sort out where all the switches are. When I transitioned from Cessnas to Pipers, it took a few flights to start feeling comfortable in the new plane. Is it 'ignorant' of me to think it might take a while for even a brilliant, infallible CRJ captain like yourself to get comfortable switching from a Bombardier to a Boeing?

Call me crazy, but as much time as I spend in the back of your planes I'd like to know that at least one of the guys up front knows his aircraft intimately, because if and when the shizit hits the fan, I don't want 2 guys who've been in the airplane for a combined total of 43 hours flipping through the manual trying to troubleshoot the thing.

And if I'm so 'ignorant', why does the FAA even have the green on green rules? (Yes, I know the FAA has a lot of stupid rules, but this one sounds ligit.) Does it really make any sense to have this rule, but then say: "Oh, you just bought the plane and NOBODY in your company has experience on it? In that case, don't worry about it."

Go back and read my post again Typhoon, tell me where the ignorance is...

 

[LGAPilot]

Green on green doesn't apply with a new A/C type is introduced.

It's not that green on green doesn't apply. It's just that the airline is issued a waiver from the FAA. I was initial cadré on the J328 and was line checked to be a captain and a checkairman on the same day (August 1, 2000).

Acquring larger a/c will be no different. We will receive a green on green waiver from the feds and the initial cadre will be trained by contract sim instructors who are experienced in whatever type we acquire.

LGAPilot