ABX's Future

erichartmann

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Anybody see any hope out there? The stock price is in the dumps, debt is high, credit markets are "tight". DHL looks to be intent on committing suicide. ABX/ATSG management seems to have been unable to make further inroads in the non-DHL ACMI market, and blames the pilot's CBA for it. A White Knight perhaps?. If so, who?
 

rotor&wing

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Why is Joe Hete still employed there?? Any CEO that oversees a company who has lost 95% of it's value would be tossed out on the street.
 

abxdx

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I don't know if that is the case. All the acft available are working. I do think that for it to grow significantly and to be successful the pilots along with all of those who will be left will have to face the reality of what we will be and will have to take paycuts etc....

ABX/ATSG management seems to have been unable to make further inroads in the non-DHL ACMI market, and blames the pilot's CBA for it. A White Knight perhaps?. If so, who?
 

abxdx

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What would you have him do. We are still on the hook to DHL till 2010 or whenever they leave. They are an albatross weighing us down. Lets see what happens after we shed DHL. If he can't turn it around then, get rid of him. But a lot of where we are is our entanglement with DHL.

Why is Joe Hete still employed there?? Any CEO that oversees a company who has lost 95% of it's value would be tossed out on the street.
 

mxer

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You have got to be kidding! Stay off the Cool Aid! The Hete ego and the DHL ego are whats to blame, in equal measures. Two children that couldn't play together. Listen to the congressional hearing tapes and you will see just how much he screwed us and Wilmington. He wasn't exactly setting the world on fire before DHL came to town either.
 

shooter

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You have got to be kidding! Stay off the Cool Aid! The Hete ego and the DHL ego are whats to blame, in equal measures. Two children that couldn't play together. Listen to the congressional hearing tapes and you will see just how much he screwed us and Wilmington. He wasn't exactly setting the world on fire before DHL came to town either.
I think you misinterpreted what was said, mxer. What would someone else be able to do in this situation? He has a plan for DHL, but last we heard DHL was not listening to ANY other offers. Not Hete, not Dasburg and not even the State of Ohio. Do you really think they would listen to anyone else? So how do you suppose we can get our costs in line with other ACMI carriers in order to be competitive in that market when our current (although short term) costs are still tied to the DHL operation?
 

hvydriver

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I think you misinterpreted what was said, mxer. What would someone else be able to do in this situation? He has a plan for DHL, but last we heard DHL was not listening to ANY other offers. Not Hete, not Dasburg and not even the State of Ohio. Do you really think they would listen to anyone else? So how do you suppose we can get our costs in line with other ACMI carriers in order to be competitive in that market when our current (although short term) costs are still tied to the DHL operation?
At this stage, I think you're probaby right shooter. DHL is not interested in Hete's plan. They never were. They were interested in buying him out to streamline operations. He didn't want to sell. End of interest, and pursuit of the dreaded "other alternatives".
 

shooter

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At this stage, I think you're probaby right shooter. DHL is not interested in Hete's plan. They never were. They were interested in buying him out to streamline operations. He didn't want to sell. End of interest, and pursuit of the dreaded "other alternatives".
True when you look at where we are at right now. But you seem to be turning a blind eye to the fact that Hete wanted to buy out Astar as well. In fact before DHL even wanted to buy out ABX, ABX was looking to buy out Astar. When you listen to the hearings starting at about the 3 hour mark, Mullen even remarks that it did not matter if ABX bought Astar or Astar bought ABX, both sides did not reach an agreement so they went on to UPS. And now we are where we are, I guess.
 
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hvydriver

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True when you look at where we are at right now. But you seem to be turning a blind eye to the fact that Hete wanted to buy out Astar as well. In fact before DHL even wanted to buy out ABX, ABX was looking to buy out Astar. When you listen to the hearings starting at about the 3 hour mark, Mullen even remarks that it did not matter if ABX bought Astar or Astar bought ABX, both sides did not reach an agreement so they went on to UPS. And now we are where are, I guess.
I'm not turning a blind eye to it Shooter. It doesn't matter what Hete wanted to do. DHL wasn't interested. They wanted Joe to go away. I agree with you that we now are where we are. It's all moot anyway.
 

shooter

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I'm not turning a blind eye to it Shooter. It doesn't matter what Hete wanted to do. DHL wasn't interested. They wanted Joe to go away. I agree with you that we now are where we are. It's all moot anyway.
No, again I will point out to what was said at the hearings. DHL did not care if Astar sold to ABX or ABX sold to Astar. And even if it went one way or the other, would the reduced costs for a combined carrier eliminate the $1.3 billion they say they are losing? Would they just shut down the carrier anyway since they do not see the value to put in the capx for new aircraft anyway?
 

hvydriver

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No, again I will point out to what was said at the hearings. DHL did not care if Astar sold to ABX or ABX sold to Astar. And even if it went one way or the other, would the reduced costs for a combined carrier eliminate the $1.3 billion they say they are losing? Would they just shut down the carrier anyway since they do not see the value to put in the capx for new aircraft anyway?

No, it wouldn't Shooter. I've said all along that my view is that the issue is not air ops. it's ground. You can point out what Mullen said all day long. It was a simple comment he made to point out that they couldn't get a single operator so they went with UPS. This is a fruitless discussion buddy. I've got to get my day underway.
 

shooter

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No, it wouldn't Shooter. I've said all along that my view is that the issue is not air ops. it's ground. You can point out what Mullen said all day long. It was a simple comment he made to point out that they couldn't get a single operator so they went with UPS. This is a fruitless discussion buddy. I've got to get my day underway.
Again no. It was not a passing comment by Mullen. He says clearly that he will take Hetes word that discussions were tossed back and forth but both sides could not reach an agreement so they went with a UPS option. And I agree 100% the problem is not the air side. And the monumental loss of customers since the announcement keeps pushing DHL down.
 

mxer

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If I misinterpretted, I apologize. You guys are right, there is probably not a lot that could save this sinking ship at this point. I still think that we are in this spot in a large part due to a variety of egos and a lack of foresight and business ability. Good luck to everyone by the way.
 

shooter

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Just a quick check....is anyone going to go see Palin at the Roberts Center today?
 

TWA

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Just a quick check....is anyone going to go see Palin at the Roberts Center today?
If I wasn't busy, I would be there. Are tickets even still available?
 

ABXbooger

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Shooter, I know you care, but it's getting to the point that when you start posting about ABX, I can't seem to focus. Keep it short, and take a break every now and then.
 

ABXbooger

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To the original post: ABX is done, you guys that think some last minute deal is getting done, you are on crack, not cool-aid. Have you seen this thing called our economy? DHL couldn't compete when the economy was good, now they are toast.

Who wants a nearly defunct, debt ridden turd called ABX and for what?
 

shooter

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If I wasn't busy, I would be there. Are tickets even still available?
Don't know. If you find the time here:

Ticket Locations
Clinton County GOP HQ
1352 Rombach Ave
Wilmington, OH 45177
937-382-8516
Hours : Monday-Saturday 10am-7pm
Sunday 12pm-4pm
Warren County GOP HQ
30 West Main St
Lebanon, OH 45036
513-932-6089
Hours: Monday-Sunday 10AM-9PM
Greene County Victory Center
3317 Seajay Drive
Beaver Creek, OH 45430
937-431-5000
Hours: Monday-Friday 9AM-9PM
Saturday 10AM-7PM
Sunday 12PM-9PM
Highland County GOP HQ
230 N High St
Hillsboro, OH 45133
937-393-6512
Hours: Monday-Friday 12pm-5pm
Clermont County Victory Office
197 East Main St.
Batavia, OH 45103
513-732-1611
Hours: Monday-Friday 10am-4pm
Saturday 10am-4pm
 

shooter

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To the original post: ABX is done, you guys that think some last minute deal is getting done, you are on crack, not cool-aid. Have you seen this thing called our economy? DHL couldn't compete when the economy was good, now they are toast.

Who wants a nearly defunct, debt ridden turd called ABX and for what?
You're right, I get long winded so I will just state this and then I'm done.

It does NOT matter if someone sold to the other. Both offers were there and it matters none. UPS could have still made the call in Feb and we would be right where we are now. If DHL wanted one airline...they always could have had one. Just bleed ABX down and build Astar up with a re fleet. They started two more airlines abroad, so ABX was NOT blocking them to build up Astar if they wanted. This is what they want no matter what could have happened.

And there is no way ABX can compete with the costs they currently have in the charter business. And they cant negotiate with the pilots as long as DHL work is being flown, nor should they. No way is it right to pay the same group different rates depending on who's freight is in the back. Can they hold out long enough for the DHL shut-down or will they just close up the ABX shop and send their assets to other parts of ATSG? Who knows. We are all just along for the ride, and I for one think this last part of the ride is getting me a little sick to my stomach.
 
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