ABXAir to lower the bar?? Say it ain't so.

[shooter]

I don’t know if you were flaming here or not FAJ. It sure seems like it, but I will believe you when you said you were not. I don’t know if you have access to the hangar talks like you have the Graber Info lines you quoted. If you do, then you will have heard that ABX is not in negotiations with DHL for their work. They would like to, but I bet they would like to have a lot of things. It is my understanding that the costs are being lined up with related ACMI organizations ABX will be competing with. That is the pay reductions the rest of the work force will be getting come May 4th. Now, I am sure ABX will take that ACMI cost structure and try to sell it to DHL as they would any other ACMI customer they are trying to get work from. But a deliberate cost reduction for DHL work is not what the future of ABX has in front of it and DHL is not talking with ABX about it. If the pilots can negotiate a deal with ABX that has a "different" pay rate for DHL, then good for them. But as far as the company, they have to forget DHL and work on being competitive on an ACMI level or face closure.

You have no say in the future of ABX. So as far as if you have an opinion of my working at an ACMI ABX or being unemployed you can bugger off. I can show you examples right now, on demand if you wish, of former CEO’s applying for $12/hr janitor jobs, 6 figure a year engineers applying for cable installer jobs, and masters degrees applying at McDonalds. If I have a chance to work for the company I enjoyed working for over the years, prior to DHL destroying what it touched, I’ll take it. Or, at least look at it while I apply for that fry job next to the guy with the MBA.

 

[Fly Astar Jets]

I don’t know if you were flaming here or not FAJ. It sure seems like it, but I will believe you when you said you were not.

Fair enough Shooter. Everyone needs to be skeptical on public boards. But I do appreciate the benefit of the doubt.

I don’t know if you have access to the hangar talks like you have the Graber Info lines you quoted.

Hanger Talks, only sporadically in the past. Lately, not at all.

You have no say in the future of ABX. So as far as if you have an opinion of my working at an ACMI ABX or being unemployed you can bugger off.

From reading your posts these past years Shooter, I can tell that you and alot of other ABXA folks have alot of pride in their Co. just as I have in DHL (the Red and White DHLAirways ) before DP:smash: came in and and mocked it all up. You're right that I have no say in what you do or the future of ABXA. That was not the intent of my post. My post was a reaction and question as to what I believed was a paradigm shift in negotiating posture based on Graber's message to the troops.

If I have a chance to work for the company I enjoyed working for over the years, prior to DHL destroying what it touched, I’ll take it. Or, at least look at it while I apply for that fry job next to the guy with the MBA.

And it looks like you will get that chance to see what it looks like. That's a good thing shooter. Can't say that about my lot in this show. But I'll at least I'll have senority over you next to that guy with the MBA at the fry station.



FAJ

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

...I am sure ABX will take that ACMI cost structure and try to sell it to DHL as they would any other ACMI customer they are trying to get work from. But a deliberate cost reduction for DHL work is not what the future of ABX has in front of it and DHL is not talking with ABX about it. If the pilots can negotiate a deal with ABX that has a "different" pay rate for DHL, then good for them. But as far as the company, they have to forget DHL and work on being competitive on an ACMI level or face closure.

The message (assuming it is accurate) seems pretty clear in that the cost reductions he's asking for are to remain competitive in the ACMI market as a whole, not just to keep DHL's business. If so, it's the right move for him to make. There's enough DHL business out there to keep 10-15 airplanes working. Whose airplanes those are going to be is anybody's guess, but ABX certainly has the right fleet. If sharpening their pencils now keeps some of their guys working (and their capital assets producing revenue) for the next 2 years, what's wrong with that?

1,000 hrs/yr at $110/hr is a lot better than NO hours per year at $234/hr.

 

[shooter]

Fair enough Shooter. Everyone needs to be skeptical on public boards. But I do appreciate the benefit of the doubt.



Hanger Talks, only sporadically in the past. Lately, not at all.



From reading your posts these past years Shooter, I can tell that you and alot of other ABXA folks have alot of pride in their Co. just as I have in DHL (the Red and White DHLAirways ) before DP:smash: came in and and mocked it all up. You're right that I have no say in what you do or the future of ABXA. That was not the intent of my post. My post was a reaction and question as to what I believed was a paradigm shift in negotiating posture based on Graber's message to the troops.



And it looks like you will get that chance to see what it looks like. That's a good thing shooter. Can't say that about my lot in this show. But I'll at least I'll have senority over you next to that guy with the MBA at the fry station.



FAJ

I just want you to know that during the hangar talks it was made clear, very clear, that ABX and DHL are not in negotiations about flying their stuff. That leaves ABX just trying to restructure under an ACMI market. If that includes pay cuts, as it has for all of us not represented, it is not lowering anything since the DHL work is not even in negotiations. My guess would be that they come out of it with the best ACMI contract in the market. At least I hope.

 

[shooter]

The message (assuming it is accurate) seems pretty clear in that the cost reductions he's asking for are to remain competitive in the ACMI market as a whole, not just to keep DHL's business. If so, it's the right move for him to make. There's enough DHL business out there to keep 10-15 airplanes working. Whose airplanes those are going to be is anybody's guess, but ABX certainly has the right fleet. If sharpening their pencils now keeps some of their guys working (and their capital assets producing revenue) for the next 2 years, what's wrong with that?

1,000 hrs/yr at $110/hr is a lot better than NO hours per year at $234/hr.

Thats the way I look at it. Too old and over qualified for burgers, nothing but aviation (some of which can transfer easily enough) but the market is saturated. Show me what my hand is and at least I know if I need to start looking. Or if it is doable, and live to fight another day when things turn around, all the better. IMO

Plus, I really like this kind of flight planning. Europe, Asia, Iceland, Caribbean, Mexico, South and Central America....others in the pipe line I hope. Keeps it interesting.

 

[nitefr8dog]

I just want you to know that during the hangar talks it was made clear, very clear, that ABX and DHL are not in negotiations about flying their stuff. That leaves ABX just trying to restructure under an ACMI market. If that includes pay cuts, as it has for all of us not represented, it is not lowering anything since the DHL work is not even in negotiations. My guess would be that they come out of it with the best ACMI contract in the market. At least I hope.

Shooter, you have been at ABX long enough to know that if anyone from ABX is talking or anytime thier lips are moving..........just fill in the rest.

 

[shooter]

Shooter, you have been at ABX long enough to know that if anyone from ABX is talking or anytime thier lips are moving..........just fill in the rest.

I have seen the press reports today. :blush:
Maybe there is hope to save some more jobs.

Express shipper DHL, which has been trying since last year to hire rival United Parcel Service to sort and fly DHL packages in the United States, says it is talking again with its current cargo-flying partners, ABX Air and ASTAR Air Cargo.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/b/content/oh/story/business/2009/03/13/ddn031309dhlweb.html


Just on Feb 26th:

Although DHL now says companies other than UPS can be “a viable option” to be the air carrier for DHL’s international shipping operations in the United States, so far at least there have been no negotiations with ABX Air.

http://www.wnewsj.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=173992&SectionID=49&SubSectionID=&S=1

Maybe I should pay more attention to the verbiage used. Negotiations versus discussions, what could I have been thinking.