ABX, DHL and Astar family tree

[nitefr8dog]

It is just from casual observation!

 

[erichartmann]

And if J.H. had been willing to work with DHL this whole UPS deal would not have taken place instead of screwing them over and over. You have no idea what has taken place over the years.

I'm going to have to throw the BS flag on that one. DHL is not and never has been in the overnight express business as it exists here in the US even when they thought they were. They don't have a clue how it works and are unwilling to learn. Further, they were unwilling to "make it work" while paying for making the needed changes. I recently saw fresh evidence of this less than a week ago.

Airborne sold out to DHL because Carl Donoway had screwed the pooch with the 767's by not putting cargo doors in them. All Carl wanted was to make a pile and move on. He did so in multiple senses. JH was, to mix metap*************************, left holding the bag. He is not a very likeable person and most blame him as a result. There are many factors at work in this monumental cock up, but the biggest problem is DHL. We would be exactly where we are today or worse, depending on your POV, regardless of what JH and ABX did or did not do. Or worse, because some of us may survive this whole mess with a job as thing now stand.

 

[nitefr8dog]

I'm going to have to throw the BS flag on that one. DHL is not and never has been in the overnight express business as it exists here in the US even when they thought they were. They don't have a clue how it works and are unwilling to learn. Further, they were unwilling to "make it work" while paying for making the needed changes. I recently saw fresh evidence of this less than a week ago.

Airborne sold out to DHL because Carl Donoway had screwed the pooch with the 767's by not putting cargo doors in them. All Carl wanted was to make a pile and move on. He did so in multiple senses. JH was, to mix metap*************************, left holding the bag. He is not a very likeable person and most blame him as a result. There are many factors at work in this monumental cock up, but the biggest problem is DHL. We would be exactly where we are today or worse, depending on your POV, regardless of what JH and ABX did or did not do. Or worse, because some of us may survive this whole mess with a job as thing now stand.

Ok. you are right.

 

[erichartmann]

Dog,

Everyone has heard the rumors over the years. Can you elaborate on it?

Hvy, what lb lead are you using on that hook?

 

[727Niteflyer]

When DHL bought Airborne what was the attitude amongst the working groups. Did everyone see it as a positive? just curious.

 

[hvydriver]

Hvy, what lb lead are you using on that hook?

No hook eric. Just curious. It's all academic at this point anyway. DR had said JH was "double dipping" DHL at the MIA base in a hotline awhile back. I thought maybe that was what he was referring to.

 

[mxer]

When DHL bought Airborne what was the attitude amongst the working groups. Did everyone see it as a positive? just curious.

I think most thought of it as a positive. ABX had some "know how", but was unwilling to take chances in order to grow. DHL had deep pockets and an international presence. Most hoped for aggresive growth. We did hope DHL could show the same ability to adapt to the US way of business the same as they had done throughout the rest of the world.

 

[erichartmann]

When DHL bought Airborne what was the attitude amongst the working groups. Did everyone see it as a positive? just curious.

At the very least most of the pilots were cautiously optimistic. The disillusionment set in over varying lengths of time. Even after most realized that DHL hadn't a clue we kept doing the best we could and hoped they would wake up. There's a part of me that still hopes to this day, but I'm not counting on it, and haven't been for some time. I've seen to many legacy ground DHL folks who simply don't want to change.

 

[erichartmann]

No hook eric. Just curious. It's all academic at this point anyway. DR had said JH was "double dipping" DHL at the MIA base in a hotline awhile back. I thought maybe that was what he was referring to.

That is a matter of opinion, or perhaps contract talks rhetoric. The union felt MIA was understaffed and objected to a number of managment's staffing practices. Management, for example, used ILN based reserves to cover MIA trips if they weren't needed to cover DHL. The union, which wanted more pilots on the list and more CA seats felt this practice should not be allowed. I don't recall if it went to grievance or not, but if it did the union lost. Also, under the terms of the ACMI DHL bore the infastructure costs so long as the charter business did not exceed 10% of gross. This included such things as maintenance. ABX was very careful not to exceed the 10% limit because they didn't want to lose money while building the business. Management wanted to grow the DHL business as much as possible to provide increase the "10%" as much as possible, and made no bones about it. I would guess whether or not you see that as double dipping depends on your POV.

 

[hvydriver]

That is a matter of opinion, or perhaps contract talks rhetoric. The union felt MIA was understaffed and objected to a number of managment's staffing practices. Management, for example, used ILN based reserves to cover MIA trips if they weren't needed to cover DHL. The union, which wanted more pilots on the list and more CA seats felt this practice should not be allowed. I don't recall if it went to grievance or not, but if it did the union lost. Also, under the terms of the ACMI DHL bore the infastructure costs so long as the charter business did not exceed 10% of gross. This included such things as maintenance. ABX was very careful not to exceed the 10% limit because they didn't want to lose money while building the business. Management wanted to grow the DHL business as much as possible to provide increase the "10%" as much as possible, and made no bones about it. I would guess whether or not you see that as double dipping depends on your POV.

Ah, that makes sense Eric.