AAEagle Future Expansion

[ch47fe]

Have the rules imposed on AAEagle been removed so they can expand their RJ fleet in the future?

My understanding of Eagle was during their 'boom' they were restricted to a certain number of jets. Are they still making money for the parent airline?

Does anyone think Eagle will start hiring in the next 16 months or so?

 

[FlyinBrian]

Does anyone think Eagle will start hiring in the next 16 months or so?

I'd say probably not.

The scope restrictions have not been lifted. AMR (parent company of Eagle and AA) has illegally circumvented the language by farming feed flying to other airlines. Do a search, and you will find a lot of info about this topic.

 

[Draginass]

American can expand their RJ fleet anytime they want without limit . . . . but they must be flown by AA pilots. Instead they pull service out of politically sensitive cities in hopes of influencing Washington to kill the RLA and force unilateral abrogation of scope contracts via legislation. It's not about RJ's . . . . it's about cheap labor and emasculating unions

 

[MINIME]

Listen everyone,

Don't believe this propaganda that the AE pilots are losing flying due to outsourcing. I for one have followed this subject due to the fact that alot of my old buddies are at CHQ and TSA. The people in STL are FLIYING routes that have ALWAYS belonged to them! They have not gone to SJU, DFW or any other AE hub and started taking over their flying. The problem as I see it, is the fact that APA is applying an ASM cap on AE. Therefore, for every CRJ700 they recieve they in turn have to park some other equipment in order to comply. I'm sure that many at AE would argue that they are entitled to the STL flying but why? Because now after 9/11 they have incurred furloughs and they just feel justified to go to another group and put them on the street! I think not. Also, as I understand it, before 9/11 AE had no problem with the Connection carriers since they couldn't even keep up with their own demand.

This is my view, we all deserve the chance to pay our bills

 

[Airline Pilot27]

here we go again

American Connection is a SCAM. It is AMR's way of disquising the error they made when they purchased TWA. They plan on exploiting us all against each other to keep us under there whip. Chitaqua and Transtates are nothing but pawns in AMR's union busting charades. Why have Eagle pilots fly when you can contract other lower paid pilots to do it. Simple economics to me. But that is precisely why we must make a stand against this.
Some of you want us to wait until we start seeing Connection at our hubs before we get upset? By then it will be too late. Your airlines are prospering at the expense of Eagle. You have 4 year jet Captains. We have 4 year FO's who can't hold a descent line at some of our bases. That is wrong...our own company is screwing us. We need to get our flying back. I truly don't fault the pilots. It is natural to react as you do and us as we do. We are not trying to put you guys on the street but are merely reacting to the threat of whipsawing once more. My predecessors in 97 signed a concessionary contract mainly because of whipsawing. We don't want it to happen to us again. All this bickering back and forth does nothing but vent a little anger. Lets wait till the mediator and arbitrator rule. I have to admit that this subject really pisses me off and normally I stay away from it. But I can't stand to hear someone say that we are selfish or just a bunch of whiners. Once you have dealt with some of the **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** we have dealt with in this company, you would realize why we don't want to compete for AMR flying.

 

[TWA Dude]

Does anyone else see a pattern here? Management usually gets what they want -- one way or another. AMR has found ways around both the APA and Eagle scope provisions. We're dealing with an enemy that has the upper hand and our reaction is slow and ineffectual. Call me a cynic (which I certainly am) but I think the unions are completely clueless as to how to handle the current crisis in the aviation industry. And come to think of it, management ain't so competent either. Of course I hasten to add that I have no ideas forthcoming either. I think I'll have another beer...

 

[eaglefly]

Actually, the 14 EMJ 's in question will be flying many routes formerly flown by TWA pilots. Many of the TSA (and CHQ) pilots either refuse or are unwilling to see the real issue at hand. AMR's willingness to make "end run's" around labor agreements they negotiated in the first place.

One must not blame the Connection pilots though. Even though SOME are salivating over the the possible benefits of this situation, few understand the Eagle contract and what was promised for 16 years (no-one signs a 16-year agreement without a specific reason). Many (not all and those that are are either furloughees or hungry F/O's looking for upgrade) of these pilots see this issue as a "if its good for me, it good" issue.

Larger issues are at stake. AMR has circumvented the AA pilots contract by building Eagle far above what they represented to APA. Now they've found a cheaper source to not only screw Eagle but circumvent the AA pilots contract (ASM cap) even more. The APA and Eagle ALPA have to stand together and expose and defeat this before it gets out of control.

Hopefully, these two parties can do it together, because if one or both parties abandon the other than AMR wins by pitting one against the other. It's been succesful for them in the past.

 

[Cleared Direct]

Listen everyone,

Don't believe this propaganda that the AE pilots are losing flying due to outsourcing. I for one have followed this subject due to the fact that alot of my old buddies are at CHQ and TSA. The people in STL are FLIYING routes that have ALWAYS belonged to them! They have not gone to SJU, DFW or any other AE hub and started taking over their flying. The problem as I see it, is the fact that APA is applying an ASM cap on AE. Therefore, for every CRJ700 they recieve they in turn have to park some other equipment in order to comply. I'm sure that many at AE would argue that they are entitled to the STL flying but why? Because now after 9/11 they have incurred furloughs and they just feel justified to go to another group and put them on the street! I think not. Also, as I understand it, before 9/11 AE had no problem with the Connection carriers since they couldn't even keep up with their own demand.

This is my view, we all deserve the chance to pay our bills

It sounds like the only one who believes propaganda is you. And it is coming from your buds at CHQ and TSA. The people in STL are flying new routes that belonged to main line TWA/AA. TWA(AA) pilots have been hurt the worst by this whole American Connection thing in STL.

Eagle pilots and AA pilots have always had a problem with American Connection including before 9/11. The head of recruitment at Eagle was depositioned by the company for the scope arbitration and he said that Eagle could have staffed STL after the purchase of TWA. Guess what? The company never called him to testify.

No Eagle pilots want to put any other pilots on the street. They are simply fighting for their contractual right to an offer to fly the STL flying before it was contracted away.

American Connection is using an illegal reverse code share to circumvent not only the ASM restriction but also APA's scope clause. American Connection has not taken over any hub flying yet, but you can bet that will be next.

Paying your bills is one thing, but do it without violating someone elses contractual rights.

 

[Brother Francis]

Begs the question

"Paying your bills is one thing, but do it without violating someone elses contractual rights."

Without trying to give offense, the question is:

What specific actions would you have the TSA/CHQ/Mesa guys take in order to rectify this situation to your satisfaction?

 

[LAXSaabdude]

Re: Begs the question

What specific actions would you have the TSA/CHQ/Mesa guys take in order to rectify this situation to your satisfaction?

Nothing, really. I get kind of tired of some of my fellow Eagle pilots calling Connection pilots "scabs", when the definition doesn't fit, and there is nothing the Connection pilots can do, anyway.

I guess all we can ask of the Connection pilots is to stop calling us whiners and crybabies just because we are pursuing a just grievance through the proper channels.

BTW, Mesa is not a "Connection" carrier. Yet.....

LAXSaabdude