AA Contract Proposal

[waveflyer]

Bingo ack- and +1 to all who see through it-
Btw, where's that "liberal/leftist" media now? This is what OCCUPY is all about once you get past the drakes.
You can't grant the type of raises and bonus's AMR execs have granted themselves AFTER huge worker concessions, and then go after more concessions-
It's the flimsiest crap I've seen airline execs pull in a long time.

As a Wn pilot- am really pulling for AA pilots.
I've noticed the very small beginnings of mgmt here wanting our pilots to cut pay in return for growth- we need help with that bar.

 

[HA25]

Well, let's see. We saved their a$$es from BK in 2003 with the current POS contract we have now. And today - SEVEN YEARS LATER - they're right back where they were in 2003. Of course! It's the pilots' fault!

If that doesn't spell MANAGEMENT INCOMPETENCE, I don't know what does. Everyone knows they are headed to BK anyway. I'll be darned if I'm giving one more iota to those goons. Let the Judge take it all away!

NO to Contract Offer
YES to Strike
FUPM!!

bravo aa73......hope there is a lot of unity on that there.

 

[DonVerita]

Well, let's see..... for starters, they are proposing a b-scale rate of $139/hr for the A319 CA... meanwhile, Spirit A319 CA $164/hr...

That Spirit $164/hr. pay rate is at Year 15.

Are you saying that at Year 15 an American A-319 Capt. would have a $139/hr. pay rate under the b-scale? Or is that at an earlier year?

 

[shadesofBS]

I'm surprised they haven't proposed a B-scale for the Airbus with the provision that the airplanes are staffed with stapled jetblue pilots.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Unless the B-scale is permanent, most F/Os will be out of the B-scale window when they upgrade.

 

[shadesofBS]

B-scale for 10 years. Staple the jetblue pilots to fly the b-scale (make it lame enough that even an AA FO wouldn't fly it) and no training or giant flush and bump.

 

[rjacobs]

Realistically besides the 170/190 and possibly the A319(depending on seating configuration) what other aircraft would be on this proposed B-scale?

Also, what aircraft has management seriously considered getting(again besides the A319) that would be on the B-scale? How many A319's are they talking about getting out of their total order? Are they talking about yanking the CRJ7's from Eagle? Talking about buying 170's/190's/CRJ7's/9's/10's/etc...?

Im just trying to understand if this would really affect anybody or if people are getting worked up about a B-scale for nothing.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Im just trying to understand if this would really affect anybody or if people are getting worked up about a B-scale for nothing.

If you outsource the domestic side of your operation, then I suppose it wouldn't affect any AA pilot, other than the fact they would be furloughed. That would affect them.

 

[rjacobs]

If you outsource the domestic side of your operation, then I suppose it wouldn't affect any AA pilot, other than the fact they would be furloughed. That would affect them.

I think you missed my point.

If the APA is going to capture these aircraft(70+ seats) in their scope clause and have a B scale for them, yet AA has no plans to actually acquire said aircraft(except possibly a small number of A319's), than does it really affect anybody?

I could see if AA had an outstanding order for 250 E190's or all 260 Airbus orders were for A319's that nobody would want this, but does it really affect anybody?

 

[Draginass]

The company's pay "raise" proposal is a fake and actually a pay cut when you see that they want to stop night and international pay. Also lower the guarantee for reserves.

And then they want to lock in the B-scale for the A319 and below for TEN YEARS or two negotiating cycles (which in AA dog years is about 12).

Start with a crappy commuter caliber rate for a narrow body airliner, then let inflation erode it for TEN YEARS and see what you have.

The company's contract proposal is ludicrous, in NO way realistic or serious, and has NO chance of even being put to a vote.

 

[HA25]

The company's pay "raise" proposal is a fake and actually a pay cut when you see that they want to stop night and international pay. Also lower the guarantee for reserves.

And then they want to lock in the B-scale for the A319 and below for TEN YEARS or two negotiating cycles (which in AA dog years is about 12).

Start with a crappy commuter caliber rate for a narrow body airliner, then let inflation erode it for TEN YEARS and see what you have.

The company's contract proposal is ludicrous, in NO way realistic or serious, and has NO chance of even being put to a vote.

brilliantly put.... I hope the average pilot is smart enough to understand this basic logic and accept nothing more than "more"

 

[tathagatha]

"The reality of deregulation"

Under the CAB, fares were set and airlines competed on service
Post CAB, airlines compet on fares and service (or costs thereof) hit rock bottom.
The business model IS by definition bankruptcy!!!

Everyone has to compete with the last one out of bankruptcy, good luck.

 

[HA25]

"The reality of deregulation"

Under the CAB, fares were set and airlines competed on service
Post CAB, airlines compet on fares and service (or costs thereof) hit rock bottom.
The business model IS by definition bankruptcy!!!

Everyone has to compete with the last one out of bankruptcy, good luck.

I'd say it's broken.

I mean, heck... you can't get into a taxi cab with out the price being set by the local municipality..... but God forbid we allow high capitalization businesses like airlines to fix prices..... That's just un-American! (pardon the pun)

 

[Draginass]

When a cab ride from the airport to downtown in NY costs a third of a cross country airline ticket, there's something very corrupt and sick about our economic system.

 

[St. Nic]

I have no horse in this race-but I am all for our industry drawing a line in the sand and doing the right thing. When these execs are taking in huge salaries and bonus's and are the cause of the demise of a company-they need to go. I do not think Bankruptcy will push them out and punish them-look at the other companies that went into Ch11 and see the money they got for leaving..... As someone previous has said, it is better not to go into bankruptcy with a lower pay and bennies since the judges and the attorneys are all too stupid to look at the forest for the trees.

FYI-I am a mesaba pilot who is seeing most of our 4-5 year FO's see upgrades going to Colgan FO's with 1-2 years at the company because some attorney was an idiot when he put a minutes worth of thought into his decision.

Another reason for DOH