AA Coming to Love

[fox51ramprat]

Kevin Cox is going to have a hissy fit! American is thinking of splitting it's hub and reducing flights at DFW. I thought they had a deal. A Deals a Deal!

 

[OffHot]

Maybe Cox ought to resign! His boss makes near 350k, just got to wonder what Mr "I hate SWA" Cox, makes. Not bad for public employees.

 

[aa73]

I wish AA all the best in coming to Love Field however, isn't this the biggest injustice you could do to your employees and shareholders by going back to DAL knowing full well it's going to be a money losing operation fueled by ego.

I agree that it's a risky proposition, but I'm not so sure it would be a money loser. Used to be, whenever AA matched SWA's fares, we bled red ink. Not so true anymore... our costs are much lower than the last time we went into DAL. Maybe we'll break even...:blush:

 

[OffHot]

AA73 your costs are no where near ours. I know we see this seat cost mile vs that seat cost mile and how close they are, but read the fine print. AA has borrowed against their aircraft and that is debt. This debt has to be paid. When the payments are due, I have no clue, but unlike your pension fund it must be paid within the next twenty years. Not that AA hasn't lower costs, but they couldn't make money at Love when the airline industry was making record profits. AA73, we have two great airlines in DFW and I have many friends who fly for AA, I do wish them well, but fighting us over STL and MCI just to take a shot across our bow might back fire with the Dallas passengers, of cousre they just want $39 tickets and don't care which airline they fly. Time will tell.

 

[aa73]

AA73 your costs are no where near ours. I know we see this seat cost mile vs that seat cost mile and how close they are, but read the fine print. AA has borrowed against their aircraft and that is debt. This debt has to be paid. When the payments are due, I have no clue, but unlike your pension fund it must be paid within the next twenty years. Not that AA hasn't lower costs, but they couldn't make money at Love when the airline industry was making record profits. AA73, we have two great airlines in DFW and I have many friends who fly for AA, I do wish them well, but fighting us over STL and MCI just to take a shot across our bow might back fire with the Dallas passengers, of cousre they just want $39 tickets and don't care which airline they fly. Time will tell.

Hey I didn't say our costs were down around SWAs... I just said that they're a lot lower than last time we were at DAL. Whether we will make money over there is doubtful.. I am hopeful we can just break even.

I don't look at it as "taking a shot across SWA's bow," I just think AMR is trying to compete now that they think the WA is gonna fall. Competing means crossing over to DAL to try and keep its premium customers instead of abandoning them. It's just business.. Like you said, time will tell. It's gonna be interesting. Cheers from across town.

 

[FurloughedTwice]

Everyone talks about SWA's CASM being so low but AA doesn't need their CASM to be as low as SWA to be profitable.

Just hypothetically speaking, of course, if AA had a "successful fuel hedging business", as does SWA, they would have made just as much if not more money than SWA did over the last year. I realize this isn't the case and may never be but my point is it's not the airline that has made SWA profitable over the last couple years. The airline itself lost money. It's the "profitable fuel hedging business" they have that has made them successful. Those contracts aren't as cheap as they use to be and as time goes on the playing field starts to even out.

If AA can fill their first class seats in and out of DAL then I think they will have a shot at least breaking even. It's all about market share. If you can fill the seats and break even in certain markets to remain competitive then it's worth flying in there.

Just my opinion!!. :beer:

 

[poydras]

Aa+ae= Peckerwoods

 

[CSY Mon]

The last time they were here they used F100s with 50 seats and flew to LAX and LGA to compete with Legend.

That was Don Carthy?
Mr. Airline Fiasco.

 

[1BigRodeo]

SWA only loses money without hedgeing depending on who Gary Kelly is talking to that day. On the books, SW has not lost money without hedging, for the simple reason that without the Tax implications related to profit, the balance sheet would show a profit for a lesser income. (any accountant types can better explain).

Any communications with employee groups, or about employee negotiations will inevitably bring about the gloom and doom from our leader. Thats his job.

Any communications with regards to competition, expansion, or our financial health will bring about the profitable side of the equation.

Its that way anywhere you look in business. Its tough all over.

I think that American showing up at LUV field is great for SWA. It shows how rediculous the Wright Amendment is, and promotes the spirit of competition. AMR and SWA are utter opposites financially, culturally, and productively, but, will make Love Field a more viable player in travel for the customers. That is a Win-Win for all involved. Keep em spendin their loot. If AA can do it profitably, then their employees win too.

My Dad always said that the biggest injustice a company could do to its employees is to run an unprofitable business. I still believe that.

 

[canyonblue]

if AA had a "successful fuel hedging business",.........If AA can fill their first class seats

If if and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a wonderful Christmas.

 

[FurloughedTwice]

Originally Posted by FurloughedTwice
if AA had a "successful fuel hedging business",.........If AA can fill their first class seats

If if and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a wonderful Christmas.

That's pretty clever but I guess you didn't read the first part of the post, either that or you just wanted to share that cute little rhyme with everyone.

If you re-read the post you will see the following words in there.

Just hypothetically speaking, of course,/ I realize this isn't the case and may never be QUOTE]

 

[canyonblue]

Oh, you mean like.........

Just hypothetically speaking, of course,/ I realize this isn't the case and may never be but..............

If the Wright Amendment wasn't there, and a couple of Airlines had went out of business, and other airlines raised their ticket prices to a level where they actually MADE money, fuel hedging wouldn't even be a topic because we would have made so much money we would have to use Brinks trucks to carry it to the bank every hour.

 

[FurloughedTwice]

Oh, you mean like.........

Just hypothetically speaking, of course,/ I realize this isn't the case and may never be but..............

If the Wright Amendment wasn't there, and a couple of Airlines had went out of business, and other airlines raised their ticket prices to a level where they actually MADE money, fuel hedging wouldn't even be a topic because we would have made so much money we would have to use Brinks trucks to carry it to the bank every hour.

Yes, that's exactly what I meant. Except for the part about the Wright Amendment and a couple Airlines going out of business and raising ticket prices and fuel hedging wouldn't even be a topic, and oh yeah, the Brinks trucks. But other than that you are spot on. :laugh:

 

[Hamburgler]

Interesting move, will be fun to watch no matter which way the WA goes. Lucky break for consumers too - more flights, more options and head to head *airline* competition!

 

[Palomino]

chest thump
chest thump
chest thump

just participating in the gibberish

as a side note...how successful has SWA been in driving Continental Express out of Love Field?

 

[Sluggo_63]

disregard

 

[Mugs]

It'll be fun to watch their go-arounds from the slam dunks into the 13s....again, too.

Better than smacking it on halfway down the runway at 181 knots, right?

 

[canyonblue]

Yes, that's exactly what I meant. Except for the part about the Wright Amendment and a couple Airlines going out of business and raising ticket prices and fuel hedging wouldn't even be a topic, and oh yeah, the Brinks trucks. But other than that you are spot on. :laugh:

Ok then, I get what you're sayin'.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

chest thump
chest thump
chest thump

just participating in the gibberish

as a side note...how successful has SWA been in driving Continental Express out of Love Field?

I don't think that it has ever been a goal at SWA to drive anybody out of Love Field. The airplanes fly wherever they will make money.

 

[Hose A. Jiminez]

Better than smacking it on halfway down the runway at 181 knots, right?

1000 to 1 Swa has a better safety record than your airline.

 

[Mugs]

Maybe you do. I can tell you my airline helped you guys out in that regard a few years ago by aborting a takeoff at 120 kts and taking evasive action in thick fog at ONT as a result of your back taxi on the wrong parallel runway with no lights on. I realize that none of us can cast stones on the safety issue -- we have all had our share of screw ups (some well known, others not). That is why I dropped a hint to your arrogant comrade that seems to have forgotten that fact.

 

[RSRVWINDSURFR]

chest thump


as a side note...how successful has SWA been in driving Continental Express out of Love Field?

Actually, Continental Express was successful in driving SWA out of the DAL-IAH route.

BTW, could any SWA guys add a letter of rec to their flame coming my way?

 

[canyonblue]

Maybe you do. I can tell you my airline helped you guys out in that regard a few years ago....

And Usairways helped you guys out a few years ago in PVD, blah blah blah

 

[Mugs]

Exactly, now we've got that straight.

 

[Palomino]

my weiner dog is bigger than your dog's weiner

 

[SWA/FO]

Sounds like you helped yourself out by "getting out of the way".....

 

[cipolini]

"chest thump
chest thump
chest thump

just participating in the gibberish

as a side note...how successful has SWA been in driving Continental Express out of Love Field?"


Ummm, we have not tried to run Continental Express out of Love Field. I liked to get their flights up to CLE, so personally, I'm sad they cut those out after 9/11.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Maybe you do. I can tell you my airline helped you guys out in that regard a few years ago by aborting a takeoff at 120 kts and taking evasive action in thick fog at ONT as a result of your back taxi on the wrong parallel runway with no lights on.

Yeah, and wasn't there a professional radio call to the effect of "Southwest, you're toast"?

Anyway, nobody got hurt, no metal got bent, and nobody was "toasted." Thats really what we're all glad for....right?

Tejas

 

[The Prussian]

I'd say drop the knives and go back to the candy and nuts...