A Merry And SAFE Floptions Christmas

[GerryG]

Hey d!ck, why end the company? Is it because you and your lazy union-oids are so selfish and immature that you would (and I'm going to use your favorite phrase) bite, even sever the hand that feeds?! Don't you yet relize that far more people work for this company that want to than you and your self-destructive babies? Come on, just get out and let the people that count on Flight Options continue to have a stable income by contributing to the company that work for. And go ahead with your normal "you're a managment troll, go back in your hole" reply, just remember that I'm niether. Just because I'm anti lazy-folks, doesn't mean I am in managment.

And any dummy can see through the first post on this thread that this is a "fold your arms, hold your breath and pout" manuver, just because you don't get what you greedy, *the world owes me* people want. Fly "safe"? No airplane is 100% fit for flight...ever. That's why there are almost two of everything onboard, and they all seem to fly just fine because there are a lot of great pilots out there, and many at F.O.


Nice job keeping the 1-1-08 date a secret, I won't tell anyone...

Looks like we've found B-19's new screen name.

 

[skanza]

The airplane is either down or it is not down. It is not up to the pilots. It is up to maintenance. Trip delay for a missing placard? That's the cost of doing business.





Not only are you a spineless coward, you're a hypocrite.

Thanks for noticing. I did that intentionally and was going to include it in my post but I figured someone here would notice. See how ineffective name-calling is on the internet? Just like arguing...
I just wonder where you get the spineless coward part...

 

[FR8DOG777]

Wow. Lot's 'o strong words dude. You sound like a pseudo-fr8dog777... he scares me. oh well...

Anyways, I think I might not have been clear with my point partially because I lowered myself to the railroad and autoworkers' blue collar level of bitchin' about blue collar stuff. I guess my point was to show poeple that even though they may honestly not be trying to shut down a company by protesting, shutting down the company may be the result of thier actions and that is dangerous. I believe that fair pay and treatment are due to all pilots, I just don't think that "playing the game" is the right way to do it. Since negotiations in progess, I don't think that disrupting the operation is a good, professional way to prove a point. If the owners are not happy, they will not buy into Flight Options and there will be nothing to negotiate. Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

Yeah I'm a real scary dude, you better look out for me. Better yet, you ought to hope I don't find out who you really are. Me, I am just an ordinary 8,000 hour pilot trying not to end up dead or violated. I am also burdened with worries such as not being able to afford dental insurance next year, or how to pay my kids school lunches. Greedy, hardly. I have had three other opportunities to accept employment elsewhere over the year and a half and decided to stay to pour my five gallons of gas on managements inferno. Thats right let management and fools like you right burn it to the freekin ground, but wait there are so many people other than my greedy self that will lose their jobs too. Wake up.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Remain professional. Do the job TO THE LETTER. Fly safe. Provide excellence in customer service.

You must remind FLOPS why you are worth the money you want, why you are worth the schedule you want, why you are worth the respect you want. EVERY DAY.

Ice in the veins brothers. It is just business.

I am in complete agreement with this part. I do, however, take exception to the movement to make anyone who remains a FLOPS pilot have the union-spread rep of being a complete Wal-Mart welfare idiot to the rest of the industry. We get NO respect from mgt OR on the road thanks to that disgusting movement. We are PROFESSIONALS who not only deserve to be paid well, but deserve respect as collegues in the industry. Thanks to thuggish tactics we are now the laughing stock. So much for professionalism from the union...the morons in mgt act like those left have nowhere else to go, and are being allowed to treat us with more disrespect tha EVER... yet we are told we should stay in the interest of "Brotherhood???"
IBT and mgt are both responsible for that lack of respect and pay we now get

 

[fischman]

I am in complete agreement with this part. I do, however, take exception to the movement to make anyone who remains a FLOPS pilot have the union-spread rep of being a complete Wal-Mart welfare idiot to the rest of the industry. We get NO respect from mgt OR on the road thanks to that disgusting movement. We are PROFESSIONALS who not only deserve to be paid well, but deserve respect as collegues in the industry. Thanks to thuggish tactics we are now the laughing stock. So much for professionalism from the union...the morons in mgt act like those left have nowhere else to go, and are being allowed to treat us with more disrespect tha EVER... yet we are told we should stay in the interest of "Brotherhood???"
IBT and mgt are both responsible for that lack of respect and pay we now get

Again, I totally understand your frustration. I agree with it! Just make sure you vent your frustrations in the right direction. Is it really the Union that is causing the issues? Or is it Management that is causing the disrespect? Does the Union have the potential and ability to improve the QOL at FLOPS? The answer is that it depends on the pilots.

The "Union" isn't the leadership, it is the pilots. If you guys don't stand together, you will fall. Simple as that.

It is your choice, and the best you can do is remain professional, keep emotion out of the equation, keep ice in the veins.

Unity Pride Strength.

 

[dime line]

I am in complete agreement with this part. I do, however, take exception to the movement to make anyone who remains a FLOPS pilot have the union-spread rep of being a complete Wal-Mart welfare idiot to the rest of the industry. We get NO respect from mgt OR on the road thanks to that disgusting movement. We are PROFESSIONALS who not only deserve to be paid well, but deserve respect as collegues in the industry.

Thanks to thuggish tactics

we are now the laughing stock.

So much for professionalism from the union...

the morons in mgt act like those left have nowhere else to go, and are being allowed to treat us with more disrespect tha EVER...

yet we are told we should stay in the interest of "Brotherhood???"

IBT and mgt are both responsible for that lack of respect and pay we now get

1) Thuggish tactics? What? please name one that the union has done, and I will name quite a few our management(You) has done.


2) Where is the Professionalism from management?


3) Who is telling you to stay?


4) How is the IBT responsible for our current pay. The union said in writing that the company was able to give us the so-called-pay raise a year and a half ago

 

[Frac Cap]

And speaking of pay raise, the company has about 4 more days to announce what, if anything, they may give us starting the first of the year. If management doesn't attempt to make a appropriate adjustment to our unchanged 1990's wages, than I don't think it is HIG's plan to stop the subsidization of company profits from pilots 30K-60K under payed salaries. This in turn would not help change the negative culture of front line employees that are willing to give a fresh start to a new owner.

The rumors that I am hearing of only 12-15K I hope turn out to be a huge underestimate.

Time will tell.

 

[WabiSabi]

Thanks for noticing. I did that intentionally and was going to include it in my post but I figured someone here would notice. See how ineffective name-calling is on the internet? Just like arguing...
I just wonder where you get the spineless coward part...

Bull$hit. That's just a lame attempt at mitigating the fact that you were caught in your hypocrisy.

As for the spineless coward part; It is one thing if you're on the side of FLOPS management and take a stand. All of your posts are consistently gimpy and you make stupid arguments. I don't believe that you're part of a management effort to stake a presence of voice on this forum......if so, they should fire you because of your points have zero efficacy. Even though you have been proven wrong on a regular basis, you have repeatedly posted in favor of gross violations of FAR's. Your posts consistently suggest that you're just a simpleton ass kisser that refuses to take a stand for what is just. Hence, spineless coward.

Be true to your profession or get out.

 

[dime line]

And speaking of pay raise, the company has about 4 more days to announce what, if anything, they may give us starting the first of the year. If management doesn't attempt to make a appropriate adjustment to our unchanged 1990's wages, than I don't think it is HIG's plan to stop the subsidization of company profits from pilots 30K-60K under payed salaries. This in turn would not help change the negative culture of front line employees that are willing to give a fresh start to a new owner.

The rumors that I am hearing of only 12-15K I hope turn out to be a huge underestimate.

Time will tell.

What pay raise are we getting?

 

[HSDriver]

And speaking of pay raise, the company has about 4 more days to announce what, if anything, they may give us starting the first of the year. If management doesn't attempt to make a appropriate adjustment to our unchanged 1990's wages, than I don't think it is HIG's plan to stop the subsidization of company profits from pilots 30K-60K under payed salaries. This in turn would not help change the negative culture of front line employees that are willing to give a fresh start to a new owner.

The rumors that I am hearing of only 12-15K I hope turn out to be a huge underestimate.

Time will tell.

Frac Cap I think you will be lucky to even get 12-15K. Personally, I think its just a rumor and there will be nothing at all. I have yet to hear any substantiation regarding this raise from any reliable source. But, I do hope you are right. Just doubtful.

HS

 

[Frac Cap]

I don't have any reliable source for the info. Just third hand info from someone who claims to be in the "know". It is just my personal belief that if HIG and Flops wants to signal a fresh start and show good will, a pay raise has to happen by the first of the year. Any other time would not make sense and it would show a sign of weakness due to union pressure having a negative impact to the company that they were trying to change. Additionally, I feel it would be extremely difficult to get quality pilots to take a job here for the lowest pay in the industry. If they don't stop the attrition, our training costs will go through the roof, and operationally we are going to suffer due to lack of crews. Just last week when the seniority list was updated, we lost 7 guys in 1 week. Stopping the attrition is going to have a tremendous affect on the bottom line, and a pay raise can easily help change this. Not acting on this potentially costly problem when it is in their power to do so, would in my opinion be operational negligence.

If a pay raise doesn't happen, it is just my feeling that HIG and Flops missed an opportunity for a fresh start and a chance to change our tarnished image and to get cooperation back due to new HIG ownership and no history of bad blood and broken promises.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[jetwash]

I can't see how they can come out now and give us a raise. Didn't BT use the excuse of negotiations as the reason they couldn't give us the supposed raise after the union vote.

I think it is just CGF BS.

Don't get me wrong, I would gladly accept any increase in pay that I should have been getting years ago.

 

[Frac Cap]

I'm not a labor law expert, but I thought only the time from the announcement of the vote and the completion of the vote any company is prohibited in increasing pay during that "laboratory period". Because a increase in pay can affect the votes. After that period I was under the assumption they could increase or decrease the pay an benefits providing there is "operational necessity". In other words, the company would be harmed in the marketplace if they didn't make the required changes. I think one can easily make a case we will be harmed in the market place trying to find, train and replace all our pilots that are leaving.

It is entirely possible the person that I hear the rumor from "a person in the know" could also be the same person that started the rumor that Swift was going to buy us. Who knows, but it kind of made sense. The fact is, I will believe it when my check says it.

 

[skanza]

non-management

Bull$hit. That's just a lame attempt at mitigating the fact that you were caught in your hypocrisy.

As for the spineless coward part; It is one thing if you're on the side of FLOPS management and take a stand. All of your posts are consistently gimpy and you make stupid arguments. I don't believe that you're part of a management effort to stake a presence of voice on this forum......if so, they should fire you because of your points have zero efficacy. Even though you have been proven wrong on a regular basis, you have repeatedly posted in favor of gross violations of FAR's. Your posts consistently suggest that you're just a simpleton ass kisser that refuses to take a stand for what is just. Hence, spineless coward.

Be true to your profession or get out.

Nice one. But there we go with needless name calling. Anyways, my "stupid" arguments are just points that I bring up people here don't address directly. I have to say again that I don't condone illegal operations, but it's like the union-folks try extra hard to "make an airplane safe to fly" (e.g. look for write-ups) for the purpose of stalling the operation just to make your point, instead of just a genuine concern for safety. See how childish that is? No one has answered that point directly because as soon as there is a post from that skanza-b!tch, it must be nonsense be cause she doesn't support the union. Therefore you don't read and consider the content. You should be true to yourself...
And again, I was aware of the name calling deal, and its not hipocrisy. If I were caught doing that, I would acknowledge it out of self respect.

So, why do pro-unioners create and promote "how to break a FLOPS (airframe here)" posts? Anyone?

 

[skanza]

Better yet, you ought to hope I don't find out who you really are.quote]

A threat? That's fine, then I'll know who you are. PM me.

I am also burdened with worries such as not being able to afford dental insurance next year, or how to pay my kids school lunches.

Maybe you should modify your living standards to match a pilot's salary. Just a suggestion. Remember, just because you fly rich people around, doesn't mean you are entilted to live like them. We're all bus drivers, just different size and speed busses.

Thats right let management and fools like you right burn it to the freekin ground, but wait there are so many people other than my greedy self that will lose their jobs too.

I'm sorry you have that "If I can't have it, no one can!" attitude. But it's pretty low to actively harm people you don't even know because of your problem. Were those other offers more money?, if so that would have been great for you-you get more money, FLOPS people=unharmed. Good luck.

 

[dime line]

Maybe you should modify your living standards to match a pilot's salary. Just a suggestion. Remember, just because you fly rich people around, doesn't mean you are entilted to live like them. We're all bus drivers, just different size and speed busses.

You can't be a pilot. You have to be management (or F&H). Ya have to be

 

[fischman]

I have to say again that I don't condone illegal operations, but it's like the union-folks try extra hard to "make an airplane safe to fly" (e.g. look for write-ups)

This statement is a contradiction.

Every pilot of every aircraft should be looking "extra hard" for write ups. If you are not doing so, you are a danger to yourself and your crew. Shame on you for not trying your hardest.

I applaud the "union folks" in doing so, and encourage you to do the same. I wonder if the FAA feels the same way I do?

I suggest you rethink your stance on this.

 

[Frac Cap]

Better yet, you ought to hope I don't find out who you really are.quote]

A threat? That's fine, then I'll know who you are. PM me..

Please, can't we all just play nice. We are all in this thing together, well I at least most of us I think. We all have different point of views, and each should be respected, even if some are out in left field as a minority. It is a point of view, and should be debated and discussed maturely. When we get angry and start threatening each other, our point of view and message looses credibility as a mature debate.

Just my 1 cent (I still work at Flops, can't afford 2).

 

[skanza]

Please, can't we all just play nice. We are all in this thing together, well I at least most of us I think. We all have different point of views, and each should be respected, even if some are out in left field as a minority. It is a point of view, and should be debated and discussed maturely. When we get angry and start threatening each other, our point of view and message looses credibility as a mature debate.

Just my 1 cent (I still work at Flops, can't afford 2).

Very well put! I agree totally and hope that discussions do stay mature and open-minded to what others have to say. Thank you, sir (or 'mam).

 

[Frac Cap]

I am glad to help, and pleased you are receptive to an open minded forum. Thank YOU sir or madam.

Happy Holidays to everyone......and yes even to management. (it is the time for forgiveness, and miracles, ......so how about that pay raise?)