A Merry And SAFE Floptions Christmas

[skanza]

Wow. Lot's 'o strong words dude. You sound like a pseudo-fr8dog777... he scares me. oh well...

Anyways, I think I might not have been clear with my point partially because I lowered myself to the railroad and autoworkers' blue collar level of bitchin' about blue collar stuff. I guess my point was to show poeple that even though they may honestly not be trying to shut down a company by protesting, shutting down the company may be the result of thier actions and that is dangerous. I believe that fair pay and treatment are due to all pilots, I just don't think that "playing the game" is the right way to do it. Since negotiations in progess, I don't think that disrupting the operation is a good, professional way to prove a point. If the owners are not happy, they will not buy into Flight Options and there will be nothing to negotiate. Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

 

[x402]

Wow. Lot's 'o strong words dude. You sound like a pseudo-fr8dog777... he scares me. oh well...

Anyways, I think I might not have been clear with my point partially because I lowered myself to the railroad and autoworkers' blue collar level of bitchin' about blue collar stuff. I guess my point was to show poeple that even though they may honestly not be trying to shut down a company by protesting, shutting down the company may be the result of thier actions and that is dangerous. I believe that fair pay and treatment are due to all pilots, I just don't think that "playing the game" is the right way to do it. Since negotiations in progess, I don't think that disrupting the operation is a good, professional way to prove a point. If the owners are not happy, they will not buy into Flight Options and there will be nothing to negotiate. Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

First you insult the hard working people that build our cars in this country. Just because you happen to wear a tie ( I wouldn't if it wasn't required) doesn't give you any right denigrate the Auto Workers and Railroad Workers of America.
Secondly you have decided what to write up on an aircraft. If a placard is required and is not MEL'able or on some MX Carryover program, it is you JOB to write it up. The company says so and more importantly the FAA says so. We don't get to pick and choose which regulations we like.
Flight Options owners need to feel the heat of poorly managed and poorly maintained aircraft. Then they can speak to the Company.

 

[Freedom]

Hey Snaggle Tooth (name calling per your request):

Wow. Lot's 'o strong words dude. You sound like a pseudo-fr8dog777... he scares me. oh well...

Anyways, I think I might not have been clear with my point partially because I lowered myself to the railroad and autoworkers' blue collar level of bitchin' about blue collar stuff. I guess my point was to show poeple that even though they may honestly not be trying to shut down a company by protesting, shutting down the company may be the result of thier actions and that is dangerous. I believe that fair pay and treatment are due to all pilots, I just don't think that "playing the game" is the right way to do it. Since negotiations in progess, I don't think that disrupting the operation is a good, professional way to prove a point. If the owners are not happy, they will not buy into Flight Options and there will be nothing to negotiate. Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

Are you suggesting that the NetJets Pilots are UNPROFESSIONAL???

Because they did exactly what is being suggested be done at Flight Options.

Result: An Industry Leading Contract that forced their management to deal with their Pilots in a respectful manner by Showing the Pilots THE MONEY.

And once NetJets Management realized they could no longer get one over on their Pilot Group, what did they do? Continue the War? No. They went back to the table with the Pilot Union to get an even better deal for the Pilots and the Company.

If Flight Options goes out of business, it will be Scheeringa's fault, not the Pilots. Ford and Harrison could care less whether the place stays in business. In fact, if it went out of business, it would just bury one of their union organizing campaign losses.

The real question here is, will Scheeringa be as smart as Santulli, and when he realizes the doors will close unless he settles with the Pilots, will he call off the hired guns of Ford and Harrison, or will he let the place burn down.

My guess is, as much as Scheeringa hates Unions, he is more concerned about his Professional Reputation as a Leader. He cannot afford to have another operation go under on his watch like happened at Metro Jet (USAirways attempt to compete with Southwest using an airline within an airline concept), so he will do the right thing and settle with his Pilots.

But he will do no such thing unless he is forced to, and he feels the company will fail unless he settles.

It is the job of the Pilots to make him understand we would rather see the place go under, than continue to live under severely substandard industry compensation.

Freedom is not Free.

 

[WabiSabi]

Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

The airplane is either down or it is not down. It is not up to the pilots. It is up to maintenance. Trip delay for a missing placard? That's the cost of doing business.

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

Hey d!ck, why end the company?

Not only are you a spineless coward, you're a hypocrite.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Wow. Lot's 'o strong words dude. You sound like a pseudo-fr8dog777... he scares me. oh well...

Anyways, I think I might not have been clear with my point partially because I lowered myself to the railroad and autoworkers' blue collar level of bitchin' about blue collar stuff. I guess my point was to show poeple that even though they may honestly not be trying to shut down a company by protesting, shutting down the company may be the result of thier actions and that is dangerous. I believe that fair pay and treatment are due to all pilots, I just don't think that "playing the game" is the right way to do it. Since negotiations in progess, I don't think that disrupting the operation is a good, professional way to prove a point. If the owners are not happy, they will not buy into Flight Options and there will be nothing to negotiate. Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable. Delay a trip because there are some stickers on the outside aft part of the aircraft missing?? Come on guys!

Oh, and name calling is for kids, or retards on the internet...the affect is the same. But I guess I'm one just like the rest...

I agree with x402 that you should not belittle another group or profession to excuse your narrow and immature view of the state of affairs at Floptions. Man up dude!

$hithead and Punjab will not allow the company to shut down, their resumes are at stake. You characterized what pilots are doing now as a protest of some kind. You could not be more wrong. They are exercising their authority as the captains of their ship to decide when and if it fly’s. What’s at play here is a simple economics equation, nothing more nothing less and one simple principal needs to be made painfully clear to management. The equations is this; until we make the cost of dragging out the negotiations process, as management has been doing, become more expensive then the cost of completing contract, management has no incentive to change anything. They will drag it out as long as we let them. If you have been in this business long enough to have witnessed how the negotiation process at NJ you would know this. For years NJ negotiation floundered producing a TA not worth the paper it was printed on. And nothing would have changed except a group of pilots came along that understood what it was going to take to persuade management of their folly. 10 months later NJ signed a contract that set the bar in the fractional industry. Since they signed that agreement the pilots have now made NJ prosperous and profitable.

The only ones that are playing a dangerous game are your management buddies. They are the ones that are putting this company at risk. They are the ones that are keeping this company from profitability, they are the ones that are fostering a hostile environment, they are the ones that are holding back the pace of negotiations.

You say you are for fair pay and treatment for pilots, and that you don’t think that we are going about it the right way. What would your way be????? Expect management to do the “right” thing, having another bull$hit pilot focus group???? That’s worked real good for us so far. We are not “playing the game”, we are doing what is necessary to persuade management to step up to the plate. Nothing else will work and you are naïve, ill informed and blinded by management koolaid to think anything different.

“Of course I do not condone flying an illegal aircraft (and anyone that does is the ultimate example of being unprofessional) but one should be reasonable.”

Pal you are speaking out of both sides of your mouth. The jet is either legal or its not, there is no in between. We have FAA approved documents to decide if a discovered discrepancy will allow the jet to continue, you do not have that discretion. Our job is simply to discover and document. Those “stickers” you mention if discovered by a FAA ramp check could cost you a stamp on your ticket. Are you willing to take one in the a$$ to make points with your management pals. I’m not!!!

Get your head out of that dark smelly place dude and see what is plainly in front of you.

 

[fischman]

FLOPS Pilots

Guys,

There is a lot of emotion on this thread, and I understand why.

Do you want a contract?

Here's how.

You MUST take emotion out of the equation. You MUST keep ice water in the veins at ALL times. Remember it is just business. On both sides of the table.


Unity Pride Strength.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Guys,

There is a lot of emotion on this thread, and I understand why.

Do you want a contract?

Here's how.

You MUST take emotion out of the equation. You MUST keep ice water in the veins at ALL times. Remember it is just business. On both sides of the table.


Unity Pride Strength.

You are right, there is a lot of emotion in this fight. I came into it late, paying my dues all along but not really "on the program". After the latest rump stuffing I took over this past year and getting a cold sholder form management when a tried to talk to them about it I got major league pissed and started asking about what was going on with negotiations and when we would have a contract. Some of our union leaders helped me to understand what needed to happen for us to be successful in our quest for a contract. I have committed myself to doing what ever I have to to make sure that management knows that they will lose this fight and to persuade them to learn it now rather then later. When I see guys like skanza that still have no clue, running his Internet trap, it gets me a little hot under the collar.:angryfire

 

[Frac Cap]

Talking to a bunch of Net Jet guys yesterday, and even though they were working Christmas, they all had smiles, were positive and motivated. This positive Christmas spirit was also noticed and commented on by their passengers.

I was thinking how does Flops management expect to keep a motivated, positive and friendly work force when we all are upset knowing we don't make the $900 extra for Holiday pay that Net Jets does for being away for yet another Holiday from their family's. Having the company acknowledge the fact that we are making a sacrifice from being away from our family's on a Holiday by paying us something extra would help take the sting out of it. Doing that, in turn would allow us to all have an attitude that would attract potential customers. I hope with our new management they will understand this.

 

[jetwash]

I hope with our new management they will understand this.

NO they won't

 

[fischman]

You are right, there is a lot of emotion in this fight. I came into it late, paying my dues all along but not really "on the program". After the latest rump stuffing I took over this past year and getting a cold sholder form management when a tried to talk to them about it I got major league pissed and started asking about what was going on with negotiations and when we would have a contract. Some of our union leaders helped me to understand what needed to happen for us to be successful in our quest for a contract. I have committed myself to doing what ever I have to to make sure that management knows that they will lose this fight and to persuade them to learn it now rather then later. When I see guys like skanza that still have no clue, running his Internet trap, it gets me a little hot under the collar.:angryfire

BELEIVE ME. I understand.

Remain professional. Do the job TO THE LETTER. Fly safe. Provide excellence in customer service.

You must remind FLOPS why you are worth the money you want, why you are worth the schedule you want, why you are worth the respect you want. EVERY DAY.

Ice in the veins brothers. It is just business. Have faith in the MEC and E-board. They know what they are doing.

Ice in the veins. It is just business.

Unity Pride Strength