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A justifiable gripe?

cforst513

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I was reading the Gulstream/TEB (http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=64082) thread and i had a question about professionalism and whether or not i have a legitimate gripe:

yesterday i was flying in the soup, through a mighty level 2 rainstorm, getting vectors to final for the GPS 29 approach into new smyrna beach. at KEVB there is a charter/PFT outfit called Vintage Props and Jets. On approach i keep hearing this vintage king air pilot asking daytona approach if they can get the approach into DAB, break it off, cancel, and head over to KEVB in VFR conditions at like 1000'. approach said no. they couldn't shoot the GPS 29 b/c they aren't GPS equipped and the NDB is INOP at KEVB. so basically they had to enter the field VFR. i was on short final, broke out of the clouds around 800' or so, which is the TPA for KEVB. at around 300' above ground level, flaps 10 degrees, i'm told to do a left 360 by the tower to let the king air fly straight in rwy 11. so this requires me to do a climbing left turn in the crap-tacular weather, which i was OK with, but i didn't want to head back into the actual conditions. not only that but there was another a/c on final for GPS 29. so who do i complain to? was this bad show of professionalism on the part of the king air guys or the tower? or should i just not worry about it b/c this sort of thing happens from time to time? i wasn't in any danger, it was more of an inconvenience. i don't think that there are any towers in the immediate area.
 

jackotron

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cforst513 said:
...there is a charter/PFT outfit...
Flamebait

cforst513 said:
was this bad show of professionalism on the part of the king air guys or the tower? or should i just not worry about it b/c this sort of thing happens from time to time?
Yeah, you have the right to be upset, but just let it go. That would have ticked me off, but remember, everyone is busy in the soup.

jack
 

Hipster Loser

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You could have easily declined. I think I would. Low altitiude, IMC not safe to be doing what you did.
 

Pedro

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cforst513 said:
On approach i keep hearing this vintage king air pilot asking daytona approach if they can get the approach into DAB, break it off, cancel, and head over to KEVB in VFR conditions at like 1000'. approach said no. they couldn't shoot the GPS 29 b/c they aren't GPS equipped and the NDB is INOP at KEVB. so basically they had to enter the field VFR.
I'm surprised they didn't ask for the ASR approach to RWY 11, the mins are even lower than 29.

Bothing surprises me about them, ask Leigh about what we saw them doing a while ago in the Beech 1900....
 

starvingcfi

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ok. i'll bite. leigh, what you see them doing a while ago in the beech 1900?
 

dhc8fo

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Hipster Loser said:
You could have easily declined. I think I would. Low altitiude, IMC not safe to be doing what you did.
No, you CAN'T easily decline an ATC instruction. It was a dick move, no doubt, but you can't just decline. You could try an "unable" and say why and probably get a nice response from ATC.

If you were IFR you probably should have been told to go missed approach, but since you were visual (I assume that you called the runway in sight or something) the controller probably thought he was doing you a favor by NOT sending you all the way out on the missed. Who knows.

Bottom line is that it wasn't cool, but it does happen. It is good training for when YOU are the guy who needs to turn some poor fella off final...
 

GravityHater

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That would have been a good one to ask for a conference call on with all involved. ATC probably needed some encouragement to call that guy on the carpet. 300'. Sheesh.
 

jaxpilot

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How much does it cost to be a pilot at VPJ? Whats the pay and QOL?






*ducks for cover*

you mean they charge people to fly their POS King Airs?
 

cforst513

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jaxpilot said:
How much does it cost to be a pilot at VPJ? Whats the pay and QOL?






*ducks for cover*

you mean they charge people to fly their POS King Airs?
LOL!! i think you pay them $18,000 for the training, and they pay you $6.25/hr. no joke.
 

avbug

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yesterday i was flying in the soup, through a mighty level 2 rainstorm, getting vectors to final for the GPS 29 approach into new smyrna beach.
Your pedigree shows your experience as all Cessna 172...were you doing this in the Cessna?

If so, this begs the question, what were you doing there?
 

BoilerUP

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avbug said:
Your pedigree shows your experience as all Cessna 172...were you doing this in the Cessna?

If so, this begs the question, what were you doing there?
He was shooting the GPS 29 approach at New Smyrna?
 

avbug

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He was shooting the GPS 29 approach at New Smyrna?
I believe that's what he said.

Why the climbing turn? Why not just do the 360 where you were? You said you had "broken out," that you were in the clear. Especially if you're concerned about returning to IMC...why not just make the turn where you are?

Being the lowest and closest on approach, you should have had the right of way. The King Air should have gone around, barring a safety of flight situation. You may not have had all the facts that the controller had.

If it were a distasteful situation that were bugging me, I'd pay the tower a visit and ask the controller about the decision. Ask him what he'd have preferred you do, and tell him how you feel about doing it. You both might learn something.

If making that 360 presents a safety issue for you, then most certainly "unable" is an appropriate response.

Who is pilot in command?
 
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