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135 Pft

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p.b. said:


You are right that everyone pays for their training, but there is a difference between going to Gulfstream to fly the CRJ with 300 hours and earning your ratings and finding your own experiences.

Yeah, there IS a difference. Gulfstream is PFT! MPD isn't. It's pay for ratings. No job guarantee at the end, no PFT, no foul.

For the record, Gulfstream doesn't even fly shiny jets like the CRJ; they fly the 1900 (I loved flying the Beech, by the way) And don't lump all of Gulfstream together. The captains that babysit the PFT FO's are usually guys who interviewed and were hired b/c of their skill as pilots, not the size of their wallet.


jstyle13 said:
Appreciate the input. I've decided I am going to do it ( I had pretty much already decided before I made the post).

As for you, jstyle: If you'd already decided you were going to do it, why'd you even post? It's not like ANYONE supported your decision. Of course, what did you expect? :)

I wish you the best of luck in your new PFT Lear job.

-Boo!
 
BE CAUTIOUS and do your homework before you write the check. A company with lears today that it turning over pilots most likely has a serious problem.

Find one of there X-pilots and find out why they left. You may find out about lack of maintenance, employee abuse or regulation violations. They may also lay off pilots due to flying shortages every 6 months. Its easy do do when they did not spend any money on you. Ask around the local airport.

If you are gonna do it, make sure the training is in a full motion sim, and you get your type. Otherwise Insurance companys will not recognise your experience or your training. This has only gotten worse since 9/11, dont let the sexy lear get you ripped of, and then mabe killed. Do some homework on the Payne Stewart accident and you will see what kind of mess a low time poorly trained crew can get you in to.

Best of luck!
 
good luck

Let's see, spend some money and have a salary. Don't spend money and make no money. People who throw stones usually just don't have the money and are crying foul. I don't like it but I understand it.

What is the difference between pay for training to get a lear job and paying for an MEI to be able to instruct in a twin at your flight school in order to get a better job down the road? There is none. It is an investment in your future...not to mention a risk.

The industry sucks right now and anyway to get a job is a good one. If he pays and the company screws him over then he is out of a lot of money. So the risk/reward is a decision he is making. Who are you to tell him he can't or shouldn't do it?

A lot of preachers here with type ratings worried about the other guy taking their rightful spot. Just worry about yourself and it will probably work out for you down the road.
 
THE DIFFERENCE??

Have you even read the previous post? The difference is the MEI he would pay for will be with him forever, the single company Lear training will not, meaning, if he goes to a different lear operator then he will have to go through their training program, and they could care less if he has been through a previous companies program. Now if he is getting typed that is a little different, but still.

So what is he going to do? Keep paying for training that is specified for that one company? Give me a break. You have no idea do you? Paying for your private and comm and inst and multi are basic requirments that you must meet to be able to work in the first place, so you are saying you understand paying for additional training that is company specific after you are qualified to work for your time and be paid accordingly?? Dude I don't know where you came from, but get your SH1TT straight before you jump in this discussion!!! You have the majority against you!!

So go spend some money and contribute to the downfall of this industry, or just go away!

SD NEVER PAID FOR A DIME OF TRAINING!! I get paid for what I am worth or I don't waiste my time with them! You pay me, or you don't get me! If more people had the backbone and self-respect to follow the same example, our wages wouldn't be in the crapper and NOBODY would have to pay for anything. Dude, get educated before you post on a subject!
 
Sorry if I seemed pissed, but I have seen PFT screw this industry up twice in the last decade, this subject makes my blood BOIL.

I mean isn't the meaning and definition of a JOB for you to submit your time and skills for money or compensation? Never in the history of the word JOB did it say you must submit your compensation for the JOB, not until modern day aviation. GO FIGURE. Look at the history of aviation and see just when PFT hit the scene, then look at the industry before and after and you will see what I mean. Just do some research.

SD (NEVER SOLD OUT)
 
A lot of preachers here with type ratings worried about the other guy taking their rightful spot. Just worry about yourself and it will probably work out for you down the road.


Judging from your flight time, you were not in the business back in the late 80's and early 90's when we were going thru pretty much the same times job wise. I had all the opportunities in the world to go to the regionals (think we still called them commuters back then) the pft route. Never did it, just kept humping them boxes five nights a week because I wasn't going to pay for a company to hire me. I hung on an extra year or so and was offered my first corporate job without a type and six months later was typed and upgraded to captain. All them type ratings on the back of my ticket - I earned them all.

As for being worried about someone who buys their type to take someones rightful spot, they're not. Most of these outfits know that they're hiring lesser experienced people with equally low pay and the experienced pilots wouldn't consider the job because of the pay.

In the end we all got to make the decision that works best for us. I had the patience to wait it out and so far it's working pretty darn good. The next person may see it differently.
 
Buying your job cheapens the industry. Be forewarned. Defecate in your bed, and tomorrow you must lie in it. It's always the new guy that thinks he's special, that the rules don't apply, that he can do it to get ahead...the gotta-have-it-now generation. But wait a few years down the line when you're whining about how poor the pay is, how low the respect, the lack of security, and how you can't seem to get ahead because the employer will just take on someone who is willing to buy their job, rather than give you a raise.

All the touchy-feely garbage about good luck with your decision is wasted breath. Buying a job is a cancer to the industry.

Do you think that you are in a predicament that somehow none of the rest of us have ever felt? Not hardly. Why earn money for a new stereo when there is credit to buy it now? Why walk to the store when you can drive? Why train at the dojo that takes ten years to achieve your first belt, when you can have the black belt locally for two hundred dollars down and a hundred bucks a month...in two years? Why not skip paying your dues, earning your experience (which cannot be bought), and just buy the job? Why not, indeed?

You make your bed. You lie in it. But don't whine to anybody a year or two down the road when there is anything about the industry that you dont' like, because you just helped make it that way. You'll get no sympathy from me. I've quit employers rather than work for someone who will stoop to such filthy, pathetic depths, to aid in the cancer of the industry.

Buy your job, you piss in my cherios. Don't ever speak to me in the field. You won't like the response, and then I'll turn my back and walk away. Earn your wings, don't buy them.
 
It all hast to do with self respect.

You either have it, or you dont.

Avbug is right, if you PFT, you can not come back and complain about pay, bennies, or anything that is oriented toward the better of your conditions personally.

You have already told your employer from the get go, that it really doesnt matter to you, your flying, and thats all that mattered.
 
Jstyle, care to name the company? If the company's in the same town as your avatar, I think I declined a job offer from them. I was already current 135 in lears, so there was no mention of PFT. If that is indeed the same company, thank god I declined it (and i'm not even religious)!

PM it to me if you don't want to make it public.
 

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