1261 days to go!

[Flopgut]

Didn't you read what I wrote.

Yeah I did. What? Am I suppose to believe you? I don't. Not at all.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

Flopgut: The question is this: At what age will you retire from Part 121 airline flying, or are you already "retired."

 

[nimtz]

Al,

It's a minor point of pride for me that none of my students ever paid you a dime as an examiner.

 

[PCL_128]

Flopgut: The question is this: At what age will you retire from Part 121 airline flying, or are you already "retired."

An irrelevant question, since you've forced him to work past age 60 if he wants to make the same amount of money that he would have made before you selfish pricks pushed through Age 65.

 

[Flopgut]

Flopgut: The question is this: At what age will you retire from Part 121 airline flying, or are you already "retired."

Hmmm. Really? That's the question? We're just going to fast forward off the subject of what a pig you've been? You think your own hubris should be excused? Whatever. I will be done with 121 appropriate to my feelings expressed on here. I will always work, and it might be flying (as long as I can). We've always had that option, as you found out yourself.

That you didn't go back and fly at UAL, accept the furlough AND even go to Skywest and fly to 65, is inexcusable human behavior. You sank to attaching your argument to basic discrimination, it worked (you got your way) then you didn't fly??!! There were more FAs that came back and flew who had been fired for getting married (all those years ago) than guys like you! To me that's unbelievable.

So the market came up and helped you. And you found a flying job and an airport job. Both good. I'm glad those things worked out for you. But do you not see that those sorts of things were always available/possible? That's what you, me and every other 121 retiree was suppose to do. I've always understood that. I think you have too. But you were going for the seniority grab.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

Hmmm. Really? That's the question? We're just going to fast forward off the subject of what a pig you've been? You think your own hubris should be excused? Whatever. I will be done with 121 appropriate to my feelings expressed on here. I will always work, and it might be flying (as long as I can). We've always had that option, as you found out yourself.

That you didn't go back and fly at UAL, accept the furlough AND even go to Skywest and fly to 65, is inexcusable human behavior. You sank to attaching your argument to basic discrimination, it worked (you got your way) then you didn't fly??!! There were more FAs that came back and flew who had been fired for getting married (all those years ago) than guys like you! To me that's unbelievable.

So the market came up and helped you. And you found a flying job and an airport job. Both good. I'm glad those things worked out for you. But do you not see that those sorts of things were always available/possible? That's what you, me and every other 121 retiree was suppose to do. I've always understood that. I think you have too. But you were going for the seniority grab.

Flopgut: You are just so full of it that I find it difficult to reply, except to say that just why you think I should have taken a 90% cut in pay and gone back to UAL 11 months after I "retired" is ridiculous, and I really know of no one who did that at UAL except I heard of maybe 1 or 2 at other airlines. As I have said, I was doing other things by that time and had accepted better options, including helping others. What have you ever done to help others? Probably nothing.

Also, you seem to give me way too much credit on changing the rule. There were about 150 or so actively involved in the effort to end discrimination against pilots between 60 and 65, and many more were financial contributors. When I "retired" and missed the cut, I could have been selfish and just "packed up," but I didn't. I kept involved for you and all the thousands of others who would all eventually have the option to keep working after age 60.

So, what kind of part did I play? Very small, but I am proud, in the long term that I was part of something to help many hundreds of thousands of other pilots for as long as the jet fuel holds out and this is a career.

Flopgut, you and other members of this Board are so disappointing to me. Your group is selfish, as your philosophy, apparently, has then and now been to evict others, including your own grandparents, out of their homes so you can live there.

Yes, I'm proud that I have had a very small part in helping other pilots, you included. I'm still waiting for your "thank you" posting.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

Al,

It's a minor point of pride for me that none of my students ever paid you a dime as an examiner.

Yes, I can understand that. Your students were weak and you wanted to find a "Santa Claus."

 

[PCL_128]

I'm still waiting for your "thank you" posting.

Please hold your breath.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

Please hold your breath.

So, are you going to retire early, at age 60? Or do you like having the option of working to 65, for whatever your reason?

And, could you please tell me what did you do for the 5-years from 11/2007 to 11/2012? Were you flying as a F/O or what?

 

[Mamma]

UF,
You appear to either be tone-deaf, completely incapable of seeing how your actions affected thousands of lives in a very negative way or a narcissist/psychopath who is here to gloat over others misfortunes. Nobody here benefited from age 65. That is the audience here. Is it that hard for you to comprehend this? I'm sure you do and are just being a prick. So, why don't you just go away.

 

[PCL_128]

So, are you going to retire early, at age 60? Or do you like having the option of working to 65, for whatever your reason?

I'm leaving professional aviation, but had I not decided to leave, yes, my financial planning was all based on an age 55 retirement. I wasn't necessarily opposed to raising the age limit to 65. However, there first needed to be peer reviewed scientific data to confirm that safety would not be degraded, and it needed to be phased in slowly if the data did show that it was safe. Instead, we had no data, and it was implemented instantaneously during the worst possible time in industry history.

And, could you please tell me what did you do for the 5-years from 11/2007 to 11/2012? Were you flying as a F/O or what?

I was a 717 FO.

 

[kwick]

I'm leaving professional aviation, but had I not decided to leave, yes, my financial planning was all based on an age 55 retirement. I wasn't necessarily opposed to raising the age limit to 65. However, there first needed to be peer reviewed scientific data to confirm that safety would not be degraded, and it needed to be phased in slowly if the data did show that it was safe. Instead, we had no data, and it was implemented instantaneously during the worst possible time in industry history.



I was a 717 FO.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out!

If you can't compete in your chosen profession,without restricting your
competition because of race, or religion, or age, or whatever illegal
prejudice that you may have, then you're just not that competitive.

That's what's great about a free society. The cream rises to the top and the
losers complain and get passed up by the better, in this case, pilots.

 

[Flopgut]

Also, you seem to give me way too much credit on changing the rule. There were about 150 or so actively involved in the effort to end discrimination against pilots between 60 and 65, and many more were financial contributors. When I "retired" and missed the cut, I could have been selfish and just "packed up," but I didn't. I kept involved for you and all the thousands of others who would all eventually have the option to keep working after age 60.

Here's an idea: Get the APAAD boys rounded up and have a little reunion. Put some letters out to all the same elected and non elected officials that you plead your case to before, (the ones who supported you) and ask them if they're happy with how the change went. Ask them if they regret anything. Ask them if theyre surprised someone so vocal as yourself didn't go back and fly. I believe you'd be very surprised, and you would realize you don't have much to be proud of.

Just like all the guys who insist they deserve a "thank you" for keeping cal running from 83-85, you'll get no such thing from me. Those guys and you=so much the same mentality is scary. Good day, I'm going flying.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

UF,
Nobody here benefited from age 65.

Are you out of touch with the world or what?

Every single working pilot and those who will choose this career, eventually, benefit from the age change. Young pilots don't think about retiring but eventually they will all be grateful to have the option of working 5 more years and adding what might be much needed cash to their 401k plans or their kid's college funds. Nowadays, college costs $100K to $200K and those kinds of expenses usually come up right when a parent is in their 50's. And, of course, there are practically no more guaranteed pensions, so most everyone who works for an airline only has what has been put away in a 401k type program.

You should all know that nobody knows their financial situation into the future. No matter how much you plan, possibly there will be illness in the family or an accident that drains hundreds of thousands of dollars that insurance won't cover, or a divorce or two, or college for 4 or more children, or a stock market crash or possibly just bad investments. Possibly your children will dream of being a pilot like you, so you will want to help them with that $100K expense, plus college is now another $100K or more. If you have girls there are weddings to pay for and when they leave the house you will want to help your children to help them make a down payment a house, if you can. All of these things usually come up right while you are 50 to 60 or older. Of course, if you are one of the few that has no children and none of the above problems, yes, then you can quit flying anytime you wish. Others, are not like that though, they need to keep earning an income. For most pilots, airline flying is the only thing they know well.

So now you say, "Nobody here benefited from age 65." Are you too young or whatever to understand what I have said here or what? Every pilot benefits from the options that the Age-65 rule change provides.

 

[Twisted Mind]

Sounds to me like you are making the case for not changing the age 60 rule. The earlier pilots can move on from the regionals, upgrade, ect... the earlier they can start saving for retirement, college, houses. Some guys were furloughed from multiple regionals spent 6-10 years as RJ FO's.
You gained from the age 60 rule then didn't like the rule and changed it so you can get more. You thought 90% pay cut was bad. Try the RJ FO's they took 99% pay cut by not getting an opportunity to move on to the legacies.