1224 statement on picking up open time.

[laserman2431]

Somewhere out there is one person who was one number away from getting to keep his/her job for at least a little longer. The company was able to furlough him/her because there are plenty of pilots willing to pick up the open flying, including union leaders using union business leave.

OK. I'll wait a little while to see what DC-9 has to say. Tomorrow, I'll share a PM I received from DC-9 that raises some very serious concerns for me.

 

[DC-9er]

Here's what he sent me. Three trips going back to December, and another guy who's picked up opf before he left the company.

Laserman, this was once a good job. After all, you chose to come here. But the people who screwed it up are DHL, along with ABX management. Not the pilots.

 

[laserman2431]

Here's what he sent me. Three trips going back to December, and another guy who's picked up opf before he left the company.

Laserman, this was once a good job. After all, you chose to come here. But the people who screwed it up are DHL, along with ABX management. Not the pilots.

One of the trips is in April 2009! That was for a person who DC-9 says is "intimately" involved in negotiating the severance pay. Who do you think that person is looking out for? I'm guessing he's not too worried about the lower half of the seniority list.

Three trips? I can think of some pilots who would really like to be doing three trips this month.

I think DC-9 has admitted he was wrong.

Any malfeasance on the part of DHL or ABX does not erase the shame of 1224 leaders picking up open flying while their brothers and sisters are out on the street! We can't control what DHL or ABX leaders do but we can say that it is not alright to engage in this kind of behavior.

I have plenty more names DC-9. Do you want me to send more? Watch it get all quiet now.

 

[TWA]

My opinion on the matter is a moot point. People will not be called out on this board. Once you start, it is a slippery slope. Do you want all the people who bid Japan without good work rules called out here too? I know they weren't too popular around the 1224 hall either...

Regardless, calling out names on this board will not be tolerated.

 

[DC-9er]

I'm guessing he's not too worried about the lower half of the seniority list.

You'd guess wrong. I know I'm talking to a wall here, but it's not the union that's kept you from getting severance. If you want to continue to blame your bad fortunes on pilots, so be it. The union will continue to try to get you severance regardless.

Anyway, it's my opinion that we'll all be out of jobs once this has played out. CCI is already taking over DHL trips from ABX and Astar.

 

[laserman2431]

My opinion on the matter is a moot point. People will not be called out on this board. Once you start, it is a slippery slope. Do you want all the people who bid Japan without good work rules called out here too? I know they weren't too popular around the 1224 hall either...

Regardless, calling out names on this board will not be tolerated.

Sure. I don't care if you want to out the KIX CA's. The local was wrong about that one but it's ancient history now. The union leaders picking up open time while their brothers and sisters are out on the street is happening now.

OK. I'll hold off on releasing the names for now because I don't want TWA to shut down this thread. Anyone can look it up for themselves. Just go to the 1224 web site and look at the the leaders including the Committee Chairmen then check their lines.

 

[laserman2431]

You'd guess wrong. I know I'm talking to a wall here, but it's not the union that's kept you from getting severance. If you want to continue to blame your bad fortunes on pilots, so be it. The union will continue to try to get you severance regardless.

Anyway, it's my opinion that we'll all be out of jobs once this has played out. CCI is already taking over DHL trips from ABX and Astar.

DC-9er. You're not talking to a wall. I'm hearing what you have to say. First you said I was providing incorrect information about 1224 Local leaders picking up OPF while others are out on furlough. Then I provided you the proof and you backed off from that statement.

I'm not sure about the relevance of your statement that we will may all be on the street eventually. Are you saying that makes it OK for some pilots to take jobs away from others because they want more money?

We have a situation where Local 1224 leaders are picking up open time and nobody is doing anything to encourage them to stop. This indicates that they are greedy and don't care if they are taking jobs from other pilots. Then you say that one of these greedy bastards is one of the main guys negotiating the severance package. That would be the same severance package that Local 1224 want to primarily go to compensate the pilots who get to keep their jobs while the scraps go to those who will actually be out of work.

I'm not blaming my fortunes on pilots. I already said that I will be on the street either way. I am saying that there are others who are just barely on the wrong side of the furlough line who might be working if not for the greed of others.

Can you address one question? Do you think it is OK for pilots to be picking up OPF while others are out on furlough?

 

[mxer]

This is an issue that has been around since 2002 when ABX did the first furlough of 42. If I am not mistaken, didn't Orville apply for a single pilot waiver and cause Wilber to get furloughed. Think I read that somewhere. Good Luck to all on the street. It's getting crowded out here.

 

[OrionFE]

I think this issue is different. In this case 1224, representing furloughed ABX pilots would be trying to save some pilots from being furloughed. The company is able to cut deep with furloughs because some greedy pilots are willing to pick up open time and get JM'ed. If they didn't grab the open flying for themselves, the company might not be able to furlough so deep. These guys are incredibly greedy. It's similar to the senior guys who want the majority of the severance pay to go to the ones who get to keep their jobs. They want to throw some scraps to the ones who will actually be out of work. Greediest scumbags you'll ever meet.

That goes on in any and all locals. You figure out how to stop it and I vote you MEC! This comes up all the time in all airlines that have guys furloughed. There is no unity in the Airline Union$. Guys will still chase the $$$$. Guys that have no idea or think they know what is going on in the Union Leadership start screaming to fire the Union EXEC Council. As was posted already, you can't put out a statement and say no OT! What legality do you have? The real point is......where is the UNITY????

Currently Furloughed!!

 

[laserman2431]

That goes on in any and all locals. You figure out how to stop it and I vote you MEC! This comes up all the time in all airlines that have guys furloughed. There is no unity in the Airline Union$. Guys will still chase the $$$$. Guys that have no idea or think they know what is going on in the Union Leadership start screaming to fire the Union EXEC Council. As was posted already, you can't put out a statement and say no OT! What legality do you have? The real point is......where is the UNITY????

Currently Furloughed!!

They didn't have a problem with a statement last year at this time. You would think at least the local leaders would forgo it.

I'm really having a problem with the idea that this guy is supposedly representing me and others in negotiations over a severance package and he can't even lay off the OPF (other people's flying) for a couple of months.

 

[DC-9er]

DC-9er. You're not talking to a wall. I'm hearing what you have to say. First you said I was providing incorrect information about 1224 Local leaders picking up OPF while others are out on furlough. Then I provided you the proof and you backed off from that statement.

You claim there were union leaders picking up trips in March. That is simply not true. I didn't check anything outside of March until you pm'd me a trip in December, January, and April.

If you want to jump on your soapbox about those trips, then have at it.

 

[laserman2431]

You claim there were union leaders picking up trips in March. That is simply not true. I didn't check anything outside of March until you pm'd me a trip in December, January, and April.

If you want to jump on your soapbox about those trips, then have at it.

Apology accepted. By the way, there were some in March too. I won't be bothering to send more. The point has been made. BTW. I hope you were aware that we've had pilots out on furlough since Oct. 25th, 2008.

You see. There is a huge issue of trust here. There is $75,000,000 available for severance compensation. We are being represented by a small number of people who are negotiating with the company about how to distribute that money. The person/people negotiating on my behalf should be held to a higher standard. I am not accusing anybody of anything, but, the possibility for corruption does exist. That is a lot of money. The people in charge should be held to a higher standard. If they lack the integrity to forgo the OPF (other people's flying) then why should I think they have to integrity to negotiate a fair settlement?

Anyway. You seem like a person who knows the difference between right and wrong.

 

[DC-9er]

By the way, there were some in March too.

*sigh* No, there's not.

Anyone can look it up for themselves. Just go to the 1224 web site and look at the the leaders including the Committee Chairmen then check their lines.

That's obsolete. The website has not been updated since the new eboard took over


Laser, you've demonstrated repeatedly here and on other threads that you don't really know what's going on with the union. Like I told you in a p.m., post all you want. But when you're wrong, expect to be corrected. I won't even ask for an apology!

 

[laserman2431]

*sigh* No, there's not.


That's obsolete. The website has not been updated since the new eboard took over


Laser, you've demonstrated repeatedly here and on other threads that you don't really know what's going on with the union. Like I told you in a p.m., post all you want. But when you're wrong, expect to be corrected. I won't even ask for an apology!

Does it really matter? March, April, February. It's just as wrong in April as it is in March. That's why I see no need to send more data. I think it's you who have been corrected my friend. The situation is that union leaders are picking up OPF (other people's flying). Do you deny that fact? Do you denounce it as wrong? Don't worry about little things like if it happens in March or April. Look at the BIG picture.

As far as the info being obsolete, When I see UNBS (union business) and OPF (other people's flying) in the same month, that is a problem.

 

[DC-9er]

When I see UNBS (union business) and OPF (other people's flying) in the same month, that is a problem.

I would think you'd like to see UNBS. The more, the better for you. Because that means another pilot was needed to cover the trip

 

[laserman2431]

I would think you'd like to see UNBS. The more, the better for you. Because that means another pilot was needed to cover the trip

Sure. Every little bit helps. Let's just not cancel it out with the OPF (other people's flying).

The situation is that union leaders are picking up OPF (other people's flying). Do you deny that fact? Do you denounce it as wrong? Your silence on the issue would seem to be your answer.

What was the motto last year? "We're in Washington trying to save jobs?" How about "We're down at the Union Hall trying to save jobs?"

 

[Box-Hauler]

Did anyone watch the last meeting, I saw it on the web. Towards the end an issue was brought up about using union money to help pay for furloughed medical coverage. One suggestion was to "tax" or "asses" the OPF time at a huge rate to help pay for it...... What a great idea. Make people be unified via a tax......... if it works for the govmet it works for me........

Just a thought on how to "handle" the open flying crowed left in the union. "Asses" all OPF flying at 90% or even more. I vote for a 110% tax. That way if you pick up open time you actually spend some of your base pay to pay for the furlough fund...... brilliant.

 

[laserman2431]

Did anyone watch the last meeting, I saw it on the web. Towards the end an issue was brought up about using union money to help pay for furloughed medical coverage. One suggestion was to "tax" or "asses" the OPF time at a huge rate to help pay for it...... What a great idea. Make people be unified via a tax......... if it works for the govmet it works for me........

Just a thought on how to "handle" the open flying crowed left in the union. "Asses" all OPF flying at 90% or even more. I vote for a 110% tax. That way if you pick up open time you actually spend some of your base pay to pay for the furlough fund...... brilliant.

Box Hauler. I like the way you think! Treat them like a bunch of AIG executives.

I hope you're doing OK.

 

[ultrarunner]

Folks picking up open time goes back as far as furloughs. It cannot be prevented. And a union can not endorse any action that violates the 'status-quo'.

Concentrate on something you have control over. You'll be much better served!

Good luck

 

[laserman2431]

Folks picking up open time goes back as far as furloughs. It cannot be prevented. And a union can not endorse any action that violates the 'status-quo'.

Concentrate on something you have control over. You'll be much better served!

Good luck

It's OK. It doesn't hurt to increase awareness. It doesn't cost anything and it makes me feel good. Thanks for you support though.