Is Spirits quick upgrade enough to work there?

[suupah]

With the new richer contracts at the legacies, you stand to lose out on a large pile of money coming to spirit even if you upgrade quickly. Looking at uniteds new contract, their pay scale on the FO side keeps pace with spirits captain side for the first 7-8 years.

 

[suupah]

 

[johnsonrod]

Interesting analysis. Sounds compelling from a monetary perspective. What's the estimated upgrade time at UAL for a newhire these days? Spirit would still be preferred by some people who don't want to be somebody's beeeotch for long. It comes down to what you are looking for in the job (I'll take the cash!). Personally, I'd be happy to take a 787 FO slot at UAL down the road and sit for awhile.......

I find it interesting in the grid above that the negotiated Bombardier CS300 rates are higher than the E195 rates even though the seat numbers are not too far off. Wonder if Republic has offered to sell its CS300 orders/options to UAL????

 

[suupah]

Point is to get the info out for the 2015 negotiations. A small pay raise is not enough in this generation of contracts

 

[SAABaroowski]

I guess it's certainly worth the discussion but your comparing United's 2017 rates vs Spirits 2015 rates that were negotiated YEARS ago. Hopefully our rates come up significantly

 

[suupah]

Hopefully... But if they fiddle fu(k around in negotiations for 2 years then get a cba with gradually increasing contractual rates over four years to achieve parity we won't see great rates until like 2021. That's a lot lost. Our greatest hope the way I see it is to dissuade people from coming here because of the disparity of pay and benefits forcing mgmt to get a deal done quickly or face labor shortages

 

[SAABaroowski]

^ I hear ya but there will NEVER be a shortage of pilots applying, you might just see the "less qualified" I think attrition buy junior guys will open mgmts eyes before lack of applicants.

 

[Flyer1015]

I wouldn't rely on future aircraft orders as good hope for what will happen. The current quick upgrade matters for those hired 2.5 years ago. Anything could change because this is aviation after all.

 

[suupah]

^ I hear ya but there will NEVER be a shortage of pilots applying, you might just see the "less qualified" I think attrition buy junior guys will open mgmts eyes before lack of applicants.

True, but I bet mgmt doesn't want to become a training ground for the kegacies

 

[Dart]

Pay will increase significantly next contract....but, what do we have to give up to get it!?

 

[ROSWELL41]

The quick upgrade is not the best reason to work at any airline. On a W2 basis, NK pilots are not much below the new UA contract for comparable equipment. What we need most is a boost to our retirement contribution by the company. There we lag UA and DL significantly.

 

[Beetle007]

With the new richer contracts at the legacies, you stand to lose out on a large pile of money coming to spirit even if you upgrade quickly. Looking at uniteds new contract, their pay scale on the FO side keeps pace with spirits captain side for the first 7-8 years.

If Spirit offered you the United contract (in its entirety), would you take it? No sarcasm....an honest question.

Pref bid, no more 4 days off, required to bid training on days off, no more transition conflicts, etc.

 

[SAABaroowski]

^ I don't know! my friends at United Are always working, I think the 4 days off thing absolutely needs to stay. I know it takes away flexibility from the company but they also work us 5+6 days in a row.............

 

[joevollers]

The question is better asked if it's worth leaving your current job regardless. Don't compare Spirit to the legacies because what if you don't get hired at the legacies? Maybe you go to Spirit then a legacy. Maybe you don't. Unless you can know for sure you have a legacy job in pocket, it's not a zero sum game.

 

[suupah]

If Spirit offered you the United contract (in its entirety), would you take it? No sarcasm....an honest question.

Pref bid, no more 4 days off, required to bid training on days off, no more transition conflicts, etc.

Personally I would not. Modest pay raises with similar work rules is what I would like to see but def no pref bid

 

[SAABaroowski]

^ agreed

 

[suupah]

Personally I would not. Modest pay raises with similar work rules is what I would like to see but def no pref bid

Most of the candy is at the top of this pay scale. The center of gravity needs to shift a bit

 

[hyflyin]

You will lose a ton of cash if you allow the company to use pref bid. Raise the money, keep the rules.

There is a lot of money and QOL in work rules. You just have to know how to use them.

 

[ROSWELL41]

I would prefer to keep our work rules with a modest (10% over three years say) pay raise. I would also like to see a DC to our 401k along with our soon to be 9% match. Also a solid long call reserve policy would be nice to have.

 

[SAABaroowski]

All good ideas. It's easy to get pay back, but hardly ever do groups get work rules back once given up