SWA FO Pay Rates?

[Ticker]

Really,

95% Strike vote.

No progress whatsoever with your management....

Them all of sudden post announcement.

Boom... 30% Pay Raise right before Christmas????

Yeah, that pay bump... Remember???

Ok...I'll give you that. I'll even fess up that after MY KY Brown Bourbon I got a little testy and assumed you were talking about the SW Pay Rates...touche'.

Post announcement, my rate went up nowhere near 30%. The percentage it went up was offset by the reduction in flying we have now. My paycheck is the same now matter how I bid. I've tried...trust me. We have captains who now are facing downgrade because they made bidding decisions based on inaccurate information that some believe was intentionally misrepresented. Those pilots are facing a very real pay CUT.

Jimmy, when you offer a "you're welcome" to someone who didn't say "Thank You" first, you're acting like a conceited, arrogant, pompous, jerk. You can thank one of your super senior FA's this morning who did just that for my bad mood.

KYBB...if you guys do the "You're Welcome" thing to those cranky Morris Air guys, I can't say I blame them.

Y'all put your shorts on just like the rest of us...one leg at a time. Stop looking down your noses at us and you might realize we're a good bunch.


“Praise can be your most valuable asset as long as you don't aim it at yourself.”

Orlando A. Battista

 

[jimmykjet]

Ok...I'll give you that. I'll even fess up that after MY KY Brown Bourbon I got a little testy and assumed you were talking about the SW Pay Rates...touche'.

Post announcement, my rate went up nowhere near 30%. The percentage it went up was offset by the reduction in flying we have now. My paycheck is the same now matter how I bid. I've tried...trust me. We have captains who now are facing downgrade because they made bidding decisions based on inaccurate information that some believe was intentionally misrepresented. Those pilots are facing a very real pay CUT.

Jimmy, when you offer a "you're welcome" to someone who didn't say "Thank You" first, you're acting like a conceited, arrogant, pompous, jerk. You can thank one of your super senior FA's this morning who did just that for my bad mood.

KYBB...if you guys do the "You're Welcome" thing to those cranky Morris Air guys, I can't say I blame them.

Y'all put your shorts on just like the rest of us...one leg at a time. Stop looking down your noses at us and you might realize we're a good bunch.


“Praise can be your most valuable asset as long as you don't aim it at yourself.”

Orlando A. Battista

Ticker,

Never ever mentioned you were not a good bunch, in fact I know you are a great bunch!

I have many friends at AirTran and welcome each and everyone of you guys aboard.

I admit. None of us asked for this! My point is simply, we are labor. The decisions management makes with our families livelihoods are tied to a mutual success. We are turning your modestly profitable airline into a potentially unprofitable sector of SWA just by the points I made.

No bag fees
No Biz Seats
Large pay raises across the board

This truly is an experiment we WILL ALL LIVE THROUGH. Like it or not.

I do not know the outcome, however. I do know we are changing the way SWA does business and I'm very very nervous.

BTW

Welcome Aboard Brother!

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

I do know we are changing the way SWA does business and I'm very very nervous.

Don't take that out on us too. We had nothing to do with that either.

 

[jimmykjet]

Don't take that out on us too. We had nothing to do with that either.

Maybe if you reread my posts, you'll notice I was not taking anything out on you.

Just making observations.

Quit being so damned sensitive ladies...

 

[b747dogg]

1.1393 x trip rate = per hour is the published conversion rate.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Y'all put your shorts on just like the rest of us...one leg at a time. Stop looking down your noses at us and you might realize we're a good bunch.

Actually, I don't do that. I hold my shorts and then jump into the air, landing with both legs through the appropriate leg-holes at the same time. It's more challenging that way. What can I say?--I'm a rebel. One of these days, though, I'm probably gonna' miss and land on my face.

Bubba

 

[PCL_128]

If you don't want be labeled an idiot, you shouldn't post idiotic things^^^

I agree. Claiming that Gary was exercising financial control over a competitor that Southwest did not yet own, violating numerous federal laws in the process, was a pretty idiotic thing for him to say.

Anyone who was involved can tell you that Southwest took a completely hands off approach not only with negotiations, but with just about every aspect of AirTran's business prior to SOC. They were incredibly cautious about anti-trust issues, to the point that many felt that they were being too cautious.

 

[redflyer65]

PCL

You would have us believe that Airtran management just decided to give you an agreement because they suddenly felt you deserved one? Had absolutely nothing to do with the announcement one week beforehand?

 

[humveedriver]

PCL

You would have us believe that Airtran management just decided to give you an agreement because they suddenly felt you deserved one? Had absolutely nothing to do with the announcement one week beforehand?

I guess you could say the announcement inspired the AirTran management team to formulate an offer that the pilots would be willing to accept. Essentially both parties wanted to see the purchase happen. AT management got paid, pilots got a potentially more stable career. AT management didn't have to worry about how the contract would impact the bottom line. That would be SWA's problem. Not that our current contract is out of line one way or the other.

 

[chjack]

I guess you could say the announcement inspired the AirTran management team to formulate an offer that the pilots would be willing to accept. Essentially both parties wanted to see the purchase happen. AT management got paid, pilots got a potentially more stable career. AT management didn't have to worry about how the contract would impact the bottom line. That would be SWA's problem. Not that our current contract is out of line one way or the other.

spot on, humvee!

 

[redflyer65]

I guess you could say the announcement inspired the AirTran management team to formulate an offer that the pilots would be willing to accept. Essentially both parties wanted to see the purchase happen. AT management got paid, pilots got a potentially more stable career. AT management didn't have to worry about how the contract would impact the bottom line. That would be SWA's problem. Not that our current contract is out of line one way or the other.

Yes Sir. That's the way I view it as well. AT had to clean it up for the purchase.

 

[PCL_128]

PCL

You would have us believe that Airtran management just decided to give you an agreement because they suddenly felt you deserved one? Had absolutely nothing to do with the announcement one week beforehand?

red, as I've told you repeatedly, the reason that you don't get this is because you don't have the slightest clue what the bargaining positions were at the table, and you don't know who made the big moves to get it done. You assume that management suddenly came to the table and threw down a bunch of money (at Gary's direction, according to some) and we cheered and signed on the dotted line. Wrong! In reality, management kept stonewalling, and the pilots had to make a very tough decision. We could either make a big move and accept pay rates far lower than what we previously demanding, or we could take a risk of not getting a new CBA at all because the NMB said that they weren't going to get involved in allowing self help in what had then become a merger. So, we adjusted our expectations and settled. Management didn't make some big magnanimous move. They didn't throw a bunch of money on the table. We made a big move, and they made a series of small moves to get to a deal that was far lower than what we would have accepted had we not been faced with the merger. If anything, we should be blaming SWA for forcing us into a situation where we had to accept a worse agreement than we otherwise could have achieved with the help of the NMB. Not thanking them.

 

[madjack]

we should be blaming SWA for forcing us into a situation where we had to accept a worse agreement than we otherwise could have achieved with the help of the NMB. Not thanking them.


you are going to be a funkiller at SWA aren't ya...please don't come out to vegas!

 

[boomlrd]

ALPA is a joke, AT pilots now have to pay them the privilege of representation for the next 2 years and are stuck on AT wages, when they could have accepted the deal and been SWA employees immediately. ALPA manipulated your negotiators into holding out for a better deal, which did not work out, but got ALPA 2 more years of dues from AT. Unless you are a UA or DL ALPA member, you don't matter!

 

[humveedriver]

red, as I've told you repeatedly, the reason that you don't get this is because you don't have the slightest clue what the bargaining positions were at the table, and you don't know who made the big moves to get it done. You assume that management suddenly came to the table and threw down a bunch of money (at Gary's direction, according to some) and we cheered and signed on the dotted line. Wrong! In reality, management kept stonewalling, and the pilots had to make a very tough decision. We could either make a big move and accept pay rates far lower than what we previously demanding, or we could take a risk of not getting a new CBA at all because the NMB said that they weren't going to get involved in allowing self help in what had then become a merger. So, we adjusted our expectations and settled. Management didn't make some big magnanimous move. They didn't throw a bunch of money on the table. We made a big move, and they made a series of small moves to get to a deal that was far lower than what we would have accepted had we not been faced with the merger. If anything, we should be blaming SWA for forcing us into a situation where we had to accept a worse agreement than we otherwise could have achieved with the help of the NMB. Not thanking them.

PCL you busted your ass an put up with alot of crap getting a dysfunctional in house union a little more organized under ALPA. I think you can be proud of your accomplishments. I really didn't want the ALPA battle star. If I was you at this point, I would just let this situation die on its own over time. I think you will eventually be involved with SWAPA, once this crappy part is behind us.

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

ALPA is a joke, AT pilots now have to pay them the privilege of representation for the next 2 years and are stuck on AT wages, when they could have accepted the deal and been SWA employees immediately. ALPA manipulated your negotiators into holding out for a better deal, which did not work out, but got ALPA 2 more years of dues from AT. Unless you are a UA or DL ALPA member, you don't matter!

ALPA was going to be on property at least 2 more years no matter what happened. Had SLI1 been put to a vote and somehow passed by both sides, SWAPA would still be (rightfully) dragging thier feet in taking on a second CBA which they are unfamiliar with to administer.

 

[Lonestar]

I am unaware of a published conversion of hours to TFP in our contract. As far as I know, our Pay is calculated by mileage only. Our rigs further enhance our pay.

For purposes of this Section, a "standard trip" will be any trip for which the nonstop mileage according to the CAB book of airport to airport mileage is two hundred forty-three (243) miles or less. If CAB book does not have airport to airport mileage listed, DOT published figures will be used between airports.

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

KYBB...if you guys do the "You're Welcome" thing to those cranky Morris Air guys, I can't say I blame them.

Y'all put your shorts on just like the rest of us...one leg at a time. Stop looking down your noses at us and you might realize we're a good bunch.


“Praise can be your most valuable asset as long as you don't aim it at yourself.”

Orlando A. Battista

First of all, it's KBB, if you drink the KY kind, that's your perogative!!!

And I never said I treated them any differently, I wasn't around then. I was explaining that happened 20 years ago and they're some that are still pissed. Some people are gonna be miserable no matter what, if i would've been around in 93, i wouldve had the same attitude they have now! "it doesnt affect me"...i hear it all the time. BUT it is gonna affect them when they get to fly with someone who is totally pissed off.
Prime example: About 50% of the time I ride on you guys as a nonrev. About 50% of those times now I get $#^*, usually from the FO....last time conversation went like this. I just trying to make small talk..me: everything going good? (meaning your day, your trip, whatever, i would never had brought this crap up, touchy subject for most) A/T FO: that's a bad question to ask. I've got 17 years left and I'm not gonna upgrade!" me: "ok, thanks for the ride!" and I go take a seat...If I didn't need the ride to work, I would've explained to him that I don't freaking care, he had no idea where I was on the seniority list, I'm in no better position than he is, but in his little world, he was more important than anyone else!

If you get so bent out of shape, maybe you should lay off the Bourbon and stick to the Kool-aid but I'll go ahead and warn you, I peed in it a long time ago. There is a group of us over here that didn't like what was going on here well before the A/T thing. Hopefully "we" can get it straightened out sooner rather than later, If not, us Junior guys are all in for a bumpy ride!

KBB