Life on reserve at swa

[easydoesit]

I know this has been posted before, but I am trying to decide whether or not to stay on the 717 as an FO and not commute, or go to the 737 and commute with the pay raise. I have 2 elementary school aged kids. I 've been reading the swa cba and it seems like reserve is a lot better than at AT.

Could anyone at swa expand for me?

 

[scoreboardII]

don't commute, stay with the little ones, you'll never regret it.

 

[N1atEcon]

Where are you trying to commute from, what city pairs? If your going to burn alot of time then no. I was lucky when I was a commuter as I had 20 plus flights a day between city pairs. And I rarely had to overnight on my nickle. Also what kind of $$$ a year difference are you looking at?

 

[Whataburger]

You will get max 15 duty periods/month. ie. On months with 30 days, you will have 15 days off. Months with 31 days you will have 16 days off. 90 TFP/mo. Unless you pick up extra flying which is paid at second year pay.

Max days in a row of work is four. Min days off between trips is three.

Reserve lines are pure AM or PM initially.

You have to do whats best for your family. The kids grow up quick. They don't understand money, they understand if daddy is at home or on the road.

 

[wood pecker]

From what I have gathered from old pilots is that when retirement is approaching the 2 things you never have enough of, are money and time with the family.

Both decide which nursing home you get sent to. Only 1 decides if you will have visitors or if sit in your room all day looking at birds until your vision goes out.

 

[Lear70]

Doing the same thing... looking at foregoing the pay raise and moving back to the 717 for Quality of Life. It's a $40-45k a year loss for most of us that would be above the 50% line on the 717, probably for 18-24 months (unless you're super-senior and on the 737 in ATL and can go over before Oct next year).

The issue is, most of the 717 lines are running around 16-17 days off a month, some are commutable, depending on where you live, some aren't. At Southwest a junior guy either holding a line or on reserve is going to get within a day or two of that anyway, so the only real difference is that on the 717 you get to hold your weekends off and some/most holidays if you're senior over your SWA schedule.

So is 1-2 more days off a month and holding the weekends and holidays off worth $100k over the next 3 years? That's the question many AirTran pilots are asking themselves right now...

 

[slaquer5]

Lear

If ur getting 2 more days off that is money also.

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[50Pesos]

You will get max 15 duty periods/month. ie. On months with 30 days, you will have 15 days off. Months with 31 days you will have 16 days off. 90 TFP/mo. Unless you pick up extra flying which is paid at second year pay.

Max days in a row of work is four. Min days off between trips is three.

Max days is 6.
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[PropPiedmont]

And you will work your butt off on reserve. SWA doesn't pay reserve pilots to sit at home and cover sick calls.

 

[Lear70]

Lear

If ur getting 2 more days off that is money also.

Yeah, I hear you, and that's what I mean...

Is 2 days off a month worth $4,000 a month loss?

How about 2 days off a month plus holding partial holidays? That's a lot of green... Makes it a harder decision when the days off are that close to what a 717 guy would hold. Hence the original poster's question about reserve QoL.

As such, the 717 F/O seat is going surprisingly senior. If I bid 717 FO, I'm already in the bottom 40% of an ATL base (if it went pure seniority later) with all the guys senior to me who are bidding 717 FO, and 1/4 of our pilots haven't bid yet, and I'm not exactly "junior", bidding #1,155 out of 1,737.

 

[slaquer5]

I know it is a hard choice. Bur also for what it is worth the holidays pay time and half

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[Flying the Line]

From the December Bid packet. The numbers are total F/O bid positions and the second is the number of reserve lines.

BWI 382 44
DAL 279 30
HOU 308 31
LAS 333 44
MCO 315 36
MDW 467 57
OAK 327 42
PHX 484 58

System wide line averages 95.5 trips with 17.5 days off.

Also they are hiring about 140 early next year and they will probably be the plug in OAK and Vegas, and maybe a few in other bases.

 

[Bwipilot]

Never commute if you can drive to work. It's four extra days of work a month and a lot of headache.

 

[carl p]

There is no substitute for driving to work, and time with the little ones can't be bought. If you can hold hollidays off and be with family, why give up those times?

 

[Whataburger]

Max days is 6.
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Reserve lines are not built with 6 in a row. 6 in a row can happen on month-to-month overlap.

 

[JohnQ]

And you will work your butt off on reserve. SWA doesn't pay reserve pilots to sit at home and cover sick calls.

As a non-SWA guy, pardon my interruption (and I mean that respectfully) but if reserves at SWA always fly a bunch, why not just build more regular lines to begin with?

Or, given the large number of flights SWA has throughout the system coupled with one aircraft type (until recently at least), is it just inevitable that the reserves fly a bunch because things are always "coming up" and their services are needed?

Thanks (from a DAL guy)

 

[shootr]

The "perfect" reserve manning model for SWA would be if all open time (no matter how it's generated) is flown by reserves and all reserves are used up. It never works out perfectly but they try.

 

[LUalum]

Can you drop (straight drop) trips and/or reserve days at SWA? Is there a method of doing that? I assume there would have to be adequate coverage on the days in question, but if there was, could you do that? Are there a minimum number of days/hours worked per month required?
At AirTran, currently you can drop trips if there is coverage available (there usually is, surprisingly) and there is a minimum of 35ish hours worked per month.

 

[huronip]

Can you drop (straight drop) trips and/or reserve days at SWA? Is there a method of doing that? I assume there would have to be adequate coverage on the days in question, but if there was, could you do that? Are there a minimum number of days/hours worked per month required?
At AirTran currently you can drop trips if there is coverage available, and there is a minimum of 35ish hours worked per month.

No one can just drop anything. You can put your entire line up for giveaway. You can give your whole line away and not work at all, but you aren't going to get paid either. There is no minimum.

 

[doylehargraves]

So, I assume off the street hires into swa will be behind all the airtran peeps? If you got hired at swa now, how long would you be on reserve?? A lot of people here at flexjet are trying to get on at swa and I'm not so sure its such a good move now, is it??? I know swa is a great company but if you're a fairly senior captain at flexjet getting schedules you want etc... is it really worth the jump? I'm mainly talking Qol, I know the pay is more.

 

[LUalum]

No one can just drop anything. You can put your entire line up for giveaway. You can give your whole line away and not work at all, but you aren't going to get paid either. There is no minimum.

Good to know. If you tried giving away trips do people normally pick them up? ie. could you plan on doing that or is it hit and miss as far as the trips actually getting picked up? If on reserve can you give away reserve days? If not, how could you adjust your reserve schedule. Assuming you didn't mind small paychecks but want to maximize time at home whilst keeping the SWA seniority number.

 

[shagadelic]

So, I assume off the street hires into swa will be behind all the airtran peeps? If you got hired at swa now, how long would you be on reserve?? A lot of people here at flexjet are trying to get on at swa and I'm not so sure its such a good move now, is it??? I know swa is a great company but if you're a fairly senior captain at flexjet getting schedules you want etc... is it really worth the jump? I'm mainly talking Qol, I know the pay is more.

If you have to ask, stay where you are. SWA hires people who really want to work at SWA. I don't want to sound like a dik, but really, you are comparing a career at flexjet to SWA? I'm assuming you're in your late 50's?

 

[Sluggo_63]

I don't want to sound like a dik...

Too late...

 

[scoreboardII]

Thea reality is, nobody picks up reserve lines, you might swap AM ro PM or different days but nobody is going to give you a line for a reserve unless they really need a day off which is rare.

The reality is, this is a very bad time to start at the bottom of any airline seniority list, period.

 

[ArcadiaMaxima]

8out of 10 times if you want a day off you can getting through bidding or ELITT I'm bottom 1/3-1/4 of MCO FO and have never had an issue...hell I got xgiving and Xmas off this year....you have to know how to bid.....no cartel here....no reserve either.

 

[slaquer5]

Can you drop (straight drop) trips and/or reserve days at SWA? Is there a method of doing that? I assume there would have to be adequate coverage on the days in question, but if there was, could you do that? Are there a minimum number of days/hours worked per month required?
At AirTran, currently you can drop trips if there is coverage available (there usually is, surprisingly) and there is a minimum of 35ish hours worked per month.

As others have said you cant drop your res days. You can give the block or res away. You can give away the trip SWA gives you when you get the trip or any time it goes through your base.
You can give away part of your reserve days, that they have not used you yet. (ex. 3 day block of res and you have a 2 day trip, you can give away last day)

the last example is what most want. We have pilots that call the res pilot and ask for his last day of res.


Most SWA pilots( even our union reps) have no clue how our contract works along with pay. Find one of few that took the time to steep over the pennies to grab the dollars.
There is so much money to be made at this place if you know what is actually allowed .

Yes you can drop all your flying but SWA does not take it. You have to put it in give away and someone else has to pick up your trips.



PSS To the thread hijacker, I agree w/ Sag. Stay where your at, I do not think you would be happy here

 

[slaquer5]

So, I assume off the street hires into swa will be behind all the airtran peeps? If you got hired at swa now, how long would you be on reserve?? A lot of people here at flexjet are trying to get on at swa and I'm not so sure its such a good move now, is it??? I know swa is a great company but if you're a fairly senior captain at flexjet getting schedules you want etc... is it really worth the jump? I'm mainly talking Qol, I know the pay is more.

No one can be that stupid to have to ask that question. Can they ?


Your Analogy is like saying
( I am a CFI , I love wearing Epaulets and living at home w my parents. Is it worth giving all that up to go to flexjets?.)
I'm mainly talking Qol, I know the pay is more.

 

[doylehargraves]

No one can be that stupid to have to ask that question. Can they ?


Your Analogy is like saying
( I am a CFI , I love wearing Epaulets and living at home w my parents. Is it worth giving all that up to go to flexjets?.)
I'm mainly talking Qol, I know the pay is more.

For the record, I didn't use an analogy and, if I did please show me where I did. The reason I asked is because i don't know. Alot of people here are talking of bailing to SWA and I'm curious if that is the right choice for them because they ask my advice, that is why I asked. I'm sorry, I know it's inconceivable and heartbreaking to you that I don't want to work at SWA and have never wanted to work there.

Also, your analogy does not parallel my sentiment but it is funny. And no I'm not even close to being in my 50's.

 

[doylehargraves]

If you have to ask, stay where you are. SWA hires people who really want to work at SWA. I don't want to sound like a dik, but really, you are comparing a career at flexjet to SWA? I'm assuming you're in your late 50's?

I wasn't comparing, I was asking because I don't know. If I was comparing, it would be assumed that I knew the answers for comparison. I'm not asking for me, I'm asking due to everyone talking about it at work. I don't know every detail about swa schedules and days off, hence me asking the question. If I thought I wanted to work at swa, I would be asking you if it would be possible for me to make over 100k and get 18 days off a month; that's the kind of things I would be interested in.

 

[shagadelic]

I wasn't comparing, I was asking because I don't know. If I was comparing, it would be assumed that I knew the answers for comparison. I'm not asking for me, I'm asking due to everyone talking about it at work. I don't know every detail about swa schedules and days off, hence me asking the question. If I thought I wanted to work at swa, I would be asking you if it would be possible for me to make over 100k and get 18 days off a month; that's the kind of things I would be interested in.

Ok, fair enough. As an FO it is very easy to have 18-19 days off and make over 100K...Except for the new guys, I doubt few make less than 100k. Our schedules are extremely productive and fairly easy to manipulate to get what you need.