Airtan Pilots

[UALX727]

CRJ,

Just wondering how much the staffing changes at your bases over the year. Is it common for guys on the bottom to float around on reserve or is there more stability there then we are seeing? For example, can a reserve pilot move to a junior base and be safe from all of the "bumping"? Thanks for the info. The reserve issue is something a lot of us will be dealing with if this all pans out.

 

[CRJsensa]

UALX727, If the airline is growing there is no problem and no one gets forced out of base. The ups and down of staffing has been a recent (2-3yrs) occurrence and primarily in the bases of seasonal flying (MCO) I am not sure how many other bases have experienced as drastic of a change as MCO. Most of the time the number of pilots is in the single digits. The problem is, the pilot that is displaced does not have any "super seniority" to return to that base so when there is a vacancy it could be filled with a more senior pilot. Most pilots I have talked to that have been displaced from a base they live in are fairly successful at giving away there flying and picking up in the base they want.

What base are you considering?

 

[On Your Six]

So, your theory is AAI pilots should just roll over and play dead for you. Highly unlikely.

Some of the SWA pilots on here are really trying hard to sugar coat this turd. GK wanted this deal, not SWAPA. The best thing that could happen IMO absent arbitration is for the AT MEC to vote this down and send it back for a better deal. As future SWA pilots, the AT guys will work just as hard for the high pay as their corndog counterparts, but why accept the bad deal from your own NC? Get rid of them too.


OYS

 

[UALX727]

Basically anything but OAK. Heck, it really doesn't matter...BWI, MDW, or even LAS.

I think many of us here at AirTran have sat a lot of reserve in the last 5 years or so, including me. I'm off reserve now, but I can tell you it was a living h#ll back a few years ago. 10 days off a month...a lot of 5 on, 2 off....while commuting. Ready reserve was used all the time. One time I called in sick and after returning was assigned 5 ready reserves in a row...basically they used it as a way to punish guys who wouldn't "play ball". I could go on and on....

So at AirTran we really aren't used to reserve being a good thing, that's why a lot of guys are really upset. Sounds like it's tolerable over there...at the Tran it isn't pretty. I know it's gotten better since the contract was done. It really helps to live in base when sitting reserve at AirTran....I'm looking at 10 years plus on reserve....the only way I figure I can control my quality of life somewhat is by moving to a base. Thanks for the input. Off to fly my red-eye!

 

[redflyer65]

It sounds like the differneces in reserve at AAI and SW are huge. What you posted above is the kind of treatment normally seen at a regional. That's not a slam just an obseravtion. For starters we have no ready reserve at all. Two hour call out. Hope to get long call on the next contract. We have either 3 or 4 day blocks of reserve with either 3 or 4 off. The only time you might get a long stretch of reserve days is on monthly overlap...that sucks but it can be challenging to bid around.

We get used on reserve a fair amount. Especially over this busy summer season. I've been on reserve for awhile and other than not know which trip you will get, its a lot like having a line here. Very rarely to I ever talk to scheduling. I just self notify the trip they assign and I'm on my way.

RF

 

[whalepilot747]

I am gload this thread was started because I was thinking of doing the same. I spent numerous years at ALPA carriers, was reprented by the teamsters and also in house. SWA is my 10th airline. When I came here I possesed the same paranoid ALPA attitude that I always had and still do in some ways. I always felt that the company was out to get me and had to cover my a$$. The hammer was gonna drop at any moment. Over time SWA has consistently surprised me and has exceeded my expectations. It truly is a different company to work for but hard to explain if one does not know the difference. I am not saying it's perfect, far from it but far exceeds anything I have ever experienced.

I am NO kool-aid drinker or Kernal. In fact, after having held numerous union positions throughout my years, quite the opposite. What was written about schedules and the like are completely true. I fly my normal line and maybe pick up a turn during the month. My schedule is very flexible due to our CBA and if I need to move something then generally it's not a problem.

If a Trannie bids back to FO, you will be making the same and probably more $$. If you stay a capt then you will definitely make serious $$ and have to work a little harder to manipulate your schedule but it can be done. Reserver here more often than not goes senior.

Vote how you feel is best for your family, check your egos at the door and make an objective (unemotional) decision. I just hope that after all the BS is done the culture here survives becasue it really is great place to work.

And no, I am pushing you (trrannie or swa pilots) to vote yes or no. Thats completely up to you and please keep the smart a$$ comments to yourself, they serve no purpose......

 

[Captain Jeff]

Thanks for your well thought out explanations.

 

[JT12345]

Why do you guys keep talking about what an Airtran pilot said ages ago. That was "BEFORE" this contract.

I got a 30% raise and I am very very happy with my life now. The contract bullsh!t has stopped. I am enjoying the extra cash and a better lifestyle. Not worse. Going from 70k to 100k is a lot different than going from 100k to 140k

especially with all the sh!t end of the stick negatives that is coming with this current offer.

Did u get that end part................. current offer.

 

[redflyer65]

Going from 70k to 100k is a lot different than going from 100k to 140k

What?

 

[4day]

He is drinking early..

 

[SWA/FO]

Did u get that end part................. current offer.

uh, final offer?

 

[Lear70]

Lear, I know it sounds unrealistic to imagine you could be awarded a line with all weekend flying and never have to work a weekend the entire mth. I will not lie and tell you it is simply to do, but it is very possible. Although, someone has to work the weekends. I get a weekend sch of Fri, Sat, Sun almost every month. Through Line Improvement Trip Trade (elitt) and Trip Trade Giveaway (ttga) I am very successful at trading this into the sch I want and my first choice when bidding which is sun mon tue turns and 2 days. For now you will just have to take my word. You will have it all figured out soon enough.

If you wanted to keep QOL and same $ then you could give away half your flying and enjoy 20+ days a mth off and 60 ttfp. The choice is yours. This mth I currently have 68 tfp and 22 days off. I will pick up open time and credit close to 135 and 15ish days off. I live in base which makes it much easier to be flexible.

Can you really do that being in the BOTTOM 10%? That's where I'll go... from #7 in MCO to 89.5% down from the top of the total list. If you can, then it changes a lot of pre-conceived ideas about the difficulty of dropping your trips through TTGA from another thread on the topic last week (and I haven't seen just how much of your line you can manipulate through ELITT as a VERY junior pilot).

I credit 80 hours here with 19 days off, all weekends and holidays off. Crediting the same there with the same schedule, even if I have to spend a lot of time at the computer playing with stuff, would make the pill a lot easier to swallow.

Lear 70, I respect you and your intellect on this SLI right up to the point that you say things like this when you were very willing, TWICE, that's 2 times to be a new hire at SWA and give up everything. Be real and you will be more respected.

The first time I was at a regional. The 2nd time I had just been hired here at AAI and wasn't off reserve. In both cases, moving to SWA would have been a Quality of Life improvement. My life right now is pretty dang good, which is why I never re-applied to SWA after the 2nd time. Once my year was up and I could re-apply, I was off probation, making a livable wage, and getting partial weekends off, so I never re-applied.

That said, I'm not trying to come off as disingenuous. I would still love to be part of Southwest airlines, have no qualms saying that, and that's the only reason I'm not out there screaming my head off for this deal to die. It's a crap deal for our pilots. Anyone who looks at the list can see that. It's not a great deal for YOUR pilots, either, but you're not losing any part of your current lifestyle. Not Quality of Life, not Pay, NOTHING. We are. So we're trying to figure out how to deal with that.

 

[zman]

I have a question for the SWA pilots, how common is it to drop all your trips and pick up trips in a senior base if you are junior? If so, how common is it to do that during certain times of the year? Also do you guys have long call reserve or do you guys have Pre-assigned Reserve long call as well? Plus do your reserves get used often, if so how much? Do certain bases get used more then others?

 

[madjack]

Not Quality of Life, not Pay, NOTHING. We are. So we're trying to figure out how to deal with that.

Yes we give up "nothing" but you gain $$ (1.4Bill for AAI vs $188mil for SWA) that's a LOT of anti angst medicine...put the crack pipe down and get over to the SWA side ASAP...you think the last 10 years were F'd up...

 

[Lear70]

Yes we give up "nothing" but you gain $$ (1.4Bill for AAI vs $188mil for SWA) that's a LOT of anti angst medicine...put the crack pipe down and get over to the SWA side ASAP...you think the last 10 years were F'd up...

I'd like to... truly. If they can work out the protections to be EXACTLY what the AIP was agreed to, there will probably be a vote and it will probably pass.

If they can't work out the 4-party agreement, the MEC will kill it and they'll go back and tweak it - still plenty of time for that before arbitration. Right now there's too many POTENTIAL loopholes in SL9 for me to vote YES to an agreement based on it (I sent a list of 12 I saw right off the bat to the MC 3 days ago and to the MEC today - my thanks to your NC for posting it on SWAPALUV so I could go through it line by line BEFORE the full agreement comes to vote over here). The 4-party agreement will have to answer/close all of those questions/issues.

We're not trying to CHANGE your SL9, simply clarifying in the 4-party agreement how it will work as we transition (how many crews/aircraft MINIMUM go to SWA with each AAI plane pulled from AAI service, what happens to 717 crews if they decide to extend the 30-month integration timeline, etc).

And no matter HOW much cash is involved, it WILL be an adjustment going from #7 in domicile to the bottom 10% of the combined list. It's not crack, and you can't just throw money at the problem. You guys will have to adjust to the inequities you see on your side, we will have to adjust to ours. It's human nature, can't fight it, just deal with it, keep a good attitude, and move on down the road. That's MY plan, at any rate... :beer: