NEW Colgan Memo... YGBFSM!!! WTF!!!

[V1cutsrfun]

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Flight and Duty Time regulations have been a very sensitive topic for all of us the last several months. Colgan Air has been fully engaged with our local FAA FSDO to work out the issues in a collaborative effort. We are pleased to advise you many issues regarding 121.471 have been resolved. One major area 121.471(g) - the FAA agrees that a flight crewmember can go over 8 hrs of flight time in 24 hours under certain conditions. Conditions are:
1. Circumstances beyond the control of Colgan Air such as ATC, Weather, and Diversions (not last leg - anytime during the day).
2. Your original schedule has not been modified where it would put you over 8 hours. Example, your original schedule is 4.3 hrs and your actual projection for the day is still 4.3 hrs. During the day your schedule is modified and added 2.0 hrs block time for a total of 6.3 hours
projected for that day. No issue, you can still exceed 8 hours due to circumstances beyond the control of the operator.​

3.

Crews that go over 8 hours of flight time, Colgan Air will keep a record on reasons why. This will protect Colgan Air and the applicable flight crew.

Additionally, if on the last day (not last flight) a pilot was approaching the weekly, monthly or annual maximum flight times (scheduled correctly to not exceed limitation), if circumstances beyond the control of the operator causes the pilot to go over these maximums, it is fully in compliance with the regulations.
The other item is regarding Part 91, tail end ferry. The interpretation is clear that Part 91 flying is not subject to 121 Duty Time Rules. Part 91 is not subject to 8 hrs or 16 hour duty day.
However, common sense and in the interest of Safety, Colgan Air will prohibit any flight activity
when duty will exceed 18 hours. Currently Colgan Air is working to finalizing a Risk Assessment
Tool for all repositioning and ferry flights. After any tail end Part 91 flying adequate rest must be accomplished prior to next 121 flight duties.
Since Flight and Duty time regulations are very difficult to interpret and apply, one of the best documents I have studied is the ALPA “Guide to Flight Time Limitations and Rest Requirements”, 6-A edition, June 2004. This document supports FAA Legal Interpretations and is in-line with airline industry practices. Please check the ALPA website to obtain a copy which provides excellent clarity by means of Q&A’s. This document will provide you proper guidance to comply with 121.471, including accurate guidance on the limited conditions which allow more than 8 hours of flight time within 24 hours.​

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Thank you for your support and understanding in this very important matter.​

And they wonder why morale is low?​

V1​

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[zasca]

God you Colgan guys are lame, no duty limit in your contract? Is there even a contract?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

FWIW I am 99% sure that this is a proprietary memo. What that means is you can get in deep deep do do for having it up here. Just a word of caution.
Like most companies I am sure it is copyright protected et al.

 

[quinnlake]

God you Colgan guys are lame, no duty limit in your contract? Is there even a contract?

No they don't have a contract. Until recently, they were not a union airline,

 

[suupah]

No they don't have a contract. Until recently, they were not a union airline,

once again, why are you using my girlfriend as your avatar?

 

[bizicmo]

FWIW I am 99% sure that this is a proprietary memo. What that means is you can get in deep deep do do for having it up here. Just a word of caution.
Like most companies I am sure it is copyright protected et al.

whistleblower

 

[ace6453]

if anyone is flying tail end ferries that takes you up to 18 hours of duty you are an idiot! 18 hours of duty is beyond ridiculous.

 

[altimaklr]

Your memos have been pinnaclized!

 

[Paladin]

Colgan sucks...

 

[Afraid to Fly]

V1,

I was pissed off about this as well and called my rep today about it. He said that they are on top of it and will be putting out something late tonight or tommorow concerning this.

 

[propsarebest]

18 hour duty days are VERY common here in the non sked world... Get used to it.

 

[Abernathy]

18 hour duty days are VERY common here in the non sked world... Get used to it.

f**k your mother.

 

[ace6453]

18 hour duty days are VERY common here in the non sked world... Get used to it.

no one cares, we're not talking non sked

 

[dcfu69]

HM is a spineless F**%! .... Well for that matter most of HEF mgt is. ANYONE who would actually go to 18hrs duty is dumb. I will be droppin the F word on them if they pull this ********************.

 

[deadstick]

50 dead isn't enough, I guess. After all, they are only risking 4 lives, right? Unless, of course it plows into a grade school. I just don't get it.

<CUT><PASTE>
<email> callin'[email protected]

 

[dingo222]

all your memo's are belong to us.....

 

[mynameisjim]

50 dead isn't enough, I guess. After all, they are only risking 4 lives, right? Unless, of course it plows into a grade school. I just don't get it.

<CUT><PASTE>
<email> callin'[email protected]

Actually they have a handy form on their website, that way you don't have to give your name or email address.

 

[suupah]

Actually they have a handy form on their website, that way you don't have to give your name or email address.

Please post link here so we can all keep everyone in the loop on this circus show aka CJC

 

[mynameisjim]

Please post link here so we can all keep everyone in the loop on this circus show aka CJC

http://www.cnn.com/feedback/tips/index.html

 

[propsarebest]

f**k your mother.

Geez, all I am saying is when you move on from your regional job and you happen to get on with a non sked 18 hour duty days are a simple fact of life.

 

[30West]

Geez, all I am saying is when you move on from your regional job and you happen to get on with a non sked 18 hour duty days are a simple fact of life.

Agreed. I didn't know what fatigue was until I left the regionals for ACMI. But since it's only boxes nobody cares.

 

[SLUF4]

Maybe they shouldn't be a fact of life no matter what type of operation you're flying. I know some military missions have lasted much longer, though.

 

[Nevets]

One of the reasons why ALPA supports H.R. 915. It has this language in it thanks to ALPA:

SEC. 816. DUTY PERIODS AND FLIGHT TIME LIMITATIONS APPLICABLE TO FLIGHT CREWMEMBERS.

Not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this Act, the Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration shall initiate a rulemaking proceeding for the following purposes:

(1) To require a flight crewmember who is employed by an air carrier conducting operations under part 121 of title 14, Code of Federal Regulations, and who accepts an additional assignment for flying under part 91 of such title from the air carrier or from any other air carrier conducting operations under part 121 or 135 of such title, to apply the period of the additional assignment (regardless of whether the assignment is performed by the flight crewmember before or after an assignment to fly under part 121 of such title) toward any limitation applicable to the flight crewmember relating to duty periods or flight times under part 121 of such title.


(2) To require a flight crewmember who is employed by an air carrier conducting operations under part 135 of title 14, Code of Federal Regulations, and who accepts an additional assignment for flying under part 91 of such title from the air carrier or any other air carrier conducting operations under part 121 or 135 of such title, to apply the period of the additional assignment (regardless of whether the assignment is performed by the flight crewmember before or after an assignment to fly under part 135 of such title) toward any limitation applicable to the flight crewmember relating to duty periods or flight times under part 135 of such title.

Call your Senator and tell them to insert this language into S.1451.

 

[Jar Jar]

I can't believe this is legal. I really dislike hearing Colgan fly over my house knowing that they are pushing hour 18.

 

[Browntothebone]

How often does Colgan go to 18hrs?

 

[Snaab]

RARE, I must say. Been a while since I worked near 16 hours. FYI, this is only myself, not sure about other crewmembers. On a sidenote, CJC and our STUPID FSDO have hemmed and hawed in the past 9 months about duty and flight time regs., and their interpretation. That's a whole other thread. HOWEVER, if anyone is getting near 15-16 hours duty, nowadays, CALL FATIGUE!! That's what I'll be doing. As they said in the hearing "non-punitive fatigue policy."

May favorite part: It states on the Dispatch Release something to the effect of "I certify myself physically fit to conduct this flight." That's what I'll stand behind!!!

 

[suupah]

How often does Colgan go to 18hrs?

I have done it once. I have exceeded 16 hours 2 other times. All three times were completely avoidable if SOC ran a tighter ship.

I will NEVER do this again.

 

[Browntothebone]

I have done it once. I have exceeded 16 hours 2 other times. All three times were completely avoidable if SOC ran a tighter ship.

I will NEVER do this again.

What if it is your last leg of your trip and you are going home vs. paying for a hotel out of your own pocket?

 

[suupah]

What if it is your last leg of your trip and you are going home vs. paying for a hotel out of your own pocket?

I don't think you are getting the picture. This is a safety issue, not a convenience issue.

 

[Browntothebone]

I don't think you are getting the picture. This is a safety issue, not a convenience issue.

On demand and 135 guys have been doing this for DECADES, and they haven't been falling out of the skies like regionals have been lately. I can see it now, the regional pilots are going to use the "fatigue card" to try and screw their airlines operations up and therefore, screw the very people that support their livelihood.