Delta in LAX

[michael707767]

I think we will miss the forever displacement rights at NWA.

yep. That is something we should have brought to our contract during JCBA talks.

 

[clippyrip]

If it happens pre-soc, put yourself in a position where you have minimal freeze time, and extract a paid move if you can.

A very interesting point.

I set it up so that the first displacement would be to the 742 in MSP. If I get displaced there, what is the freeze time? If I have to get a first time training in something else, what is the freeze time?

I was under the impression if you had a lesser category in you bid card ahead of your current category(different base) then you dont get pay protection if displaced to the lesser category. That influenced my card. Is this true?

Most importantly, how do I insure that I get a paid move?

 

[qxdash8]

A very interesting point.

I set it up so that the first displacement would be to the 742 in MSP. If I get displaced there, what is the freeze time? If I have to get a first time training in something else, what is the freeze time?

You get a seat lock if you've been displaced? That's one good thing DL brought to the JCBA - if you get displaced (as long as its a mandatory and not a voluntary displacement) there is no seat lock in your new category, even if training is involved.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I got the seniority... I plan on displacing someone out of LAX.

clippyrip

Do you just not care how your bold proclamation of taking someone else's job might be received?

No one got to "leapfrog" as they bid what their seniority would hold, prior to the merger.

Most of the FNWA guys at least try to be a little more considerate when perusing which FDAL's pilots' jobs they intend to take & displace.

 

[General Lee]

Do you just not care how your bold proclamation of taking someone else's job might be received?

No one got to "leapfrog" as they bid what their seniority would hold, prior to the merger.

Most of the FNWA guys at least try to be a little more considerate when perusing which FDAL's pilots' jobs they intend to take & displace.

If it happens pre-SOC, he will have to go to the DC9 first. It would be costly for DL to add the 742 to the new certificate and then dump it. Odds are they will be gone (or at least a displacement bid will occur) prior to the SOC. We'll see.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[clippyrip]

Do you just not care how your bold proclamation of taking someone else's job might be received?

I see what you are saying and have some sympathy. If it's after SOC and I can hold it and get displaced, then I'm not taking someone elses job, it's what what I can hold and mine for the taking. Change our contract in the future if you don't like it.

 

[clippyrip]

If it happens pre-SOC, he will have to go to the DC9 first.

Nope, I can hold the 320 my man. If it's pre SOC I plan to displace to the 742 in MSP so I don't get seatlocked. Then I will bid LAX after SOC. Fair and square.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Forget it.

 

[another cfii]

In the bizarro world where everybody swarms into the cold tundra known as Michekan, where the DC9 fills the sky and everybody wants to fly 4 legs a day, I'll come in and displace someone. Fair and Square.

 

[clippyrip]

In the bizarro world where everybody swarms into the cold tundra known as Michekan, where the DC9 fills the sky and everybody wants to fly 4 legs a day, I'll come in and displace someone. Fair and Square.

It may seem bizarre to you but half the country likes the North. The only reason this discussion exists on my end is because of getting displaced out of ANC which my hometown and the greatest place on Earth. Hands down, fair and square.

 

[General Lee]

Nope, I can hold the 320 my man. If it's pre SOC I plan to displace to the 742 in MSP so I don't get seatlocked. Then I will bid LAX after SOC. Fair and square.

Good for you. Remember that LAX is somewhat senior, and after all of the movings of planes it may even be more senior. It is unlikely that you would be mandatorily displaced out of the A320 (since most people senior to you probably will voluntarily displace themselves West or South of DTW/MSP), which means it will be harder to get a paid move at that point. You can try to get an Advanced Entitlement to LAX, but that would mean there would have to be open spots there, and the same goes for a Voluntary Displacement. If you are not very senior, then going West may be tougher than you think. Every FNWA guy living in CA or AZ will likely bid SLC or LAX, and every FNWA guy living in the SE will try to bid something in ATL. But, the good news is that your A320 spot in DTW will increase in seniority at the same time, and being a block holder will be in sight shortly.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

It may seem bizarre to you but half the country likes the North. The only reason this discussion exists on my end is because of getting displaced out of ANC which my hometown and the greatest place on Earth. Hands down, fair and square.

I bet you are hoping we buy Alaska Airlines.....

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[clippyrip]

I bet you are hoping we buy Alaska Airlines.....

Bye Bye--General Lee

So true! That would be the best of all options and make Seattle and LAX much easier for everyone.

 

[dalad]

Good for you. Remember that LAX is somewhat senior, and after all of the movings of planes it may even be more senior. It is unlikely that you would be mandatorily displaced out of the A320 (since most people senior to you probably will voluntarily displace themselves West or South of DTW/MSP), which means it will be harder to get a paid move at that point. You can try to get an Advanced Entitlement to LAX, but that would mean there would have to be open spots there, and the same goes for a Voluntary Displacement. If you are not very senior, then going West may be tougher than you think. Every FNWA guy living in CA or AZ will likely bid SLC or LAX, and every FNWA guy living in the SE will try to bid something in ATL. But, the good news is that your A320 spot in DTW will increase in seniority at the same time, and being a block holder will be in sight shortly.


Bye Bye---General Lee

LAX is no longer a senior base.

 

[~~~^~~~]

If AS got credit for the next ten years' attrition instantly and the arbitrators ignored status quo on seat and equipment, then very few of you might be able to hold SEA or LAX. AS is a stable, senior, carrier with a bunch of small jets.

Before you cheer for an Alaska merger, you might want to run it through the template for the NWA/DAL integration and see if you like the result.

 

[another cfii]

If we sign on AS anything more than codeshare, many of us won't see anything more than 737 for the rest of our careers, no matter how favorable the arbitrator will rule in our favor...

 

[General Lee]

If we sign on AS anything more than codeshare, many of us won't see anything more than 737 for the rest of our careers, no matter how favorable the arbitrator will rule in our favor...

But, you WILL get to see Juneau, in the Winter....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Mookie]

But, you WILL get to see Juneau, in the Winter....


Bye Bye--General Lee

Was there a few weeks ago. Sunny, no wind, absolutely gorgeous. a little chilly, but Eagle Creek ski area was open. I'd still rather go there than the northeast corridor in a blizzard. (and yes...I've done it before).

Mookie

 

[NuGuy]

Heyas,

I'm not quite sure what everyone is so cranky about. Lee Moak, our new fearless leader said is was a fair award....so why the griping?

Seriously, if we were to assume that the panel of arbitrators was "fair", then all the NWA airplanes "going away" were built into the miserable ratio and the crappy attrition credit.

If Clippy wants to bump into LAX, and the agreement permits him to, then tough cookies. The double digit gains in seniority percentle courtesy of the NWA guys was the compensation (too high, IMHO).

Personaly, I think most NWA guys got reamed on the SLI. The only compensation for this was the ability to use what seniority we do have, and the odd few that did better than DOH (got a 95 bro in with the 91 DAL guys... heh, score! He's going to go from DC-9 CA to ER CA... so that's at least one win out of 1000s of losses).

Nu

 

[General Lee]

Heyas,

I'm not quite sure what everyone is so cranky about. Lee Moak, our new fearless leader said is was a fair award....so why the griping?

Seriously, if we were to assume that the panel of arbitrators was "fair", then all the NWA airplanes "going away" were built into the miserable ratio and the crappy attrition credit.

If Clippy wants to bump into LAX, and the agreement permits him to, then tough cookies. The double digit gains in seniority percentle courtesy of the NWA guys was the compensation (too high, IMHO).

Personaly, I think most NWA guys got reamed on the SLI. The only compensation for this was the ability to use what seniority we do have, and the odd few that did better than DOH (got a 95 bro in with the 91 DAL guys... heh, score! He's going to go from DC-9 CA to ER CA... so that's at least one win out of 1000s of losses).

Nu

I don't think he (your 95 bro)will go to the ER, since a lot of 91 hires on this last displacement got kicked to something else. I know a junior 767 captain (91 hire) who got bumped to the 777 as an FO, and he is only at 50% on that as an FO(senior plane, especially in ATL). Maybe my friend will bid DC9 Captain? Nah, I doubt it---he likes the FMS too much.

I agree NU that this award was fair, but if DL is going to park something that we all knew would be parked, that doesn't mean our guys should take a hit. Regardless, IF it happens after SOC, then Clippy should be able to bid what he wants. If it happens prior, then he will go to the DC9 or bus and then have to eventually bid for LAX, which will get more and more senior as everything is metriculated together.


Bye Bye--General Lee