What is more important, Labor friendly NMB and bankruptcy judges or tax cuts?

[JT12345]

What do you think will affect your income more?

Management has used bankrupcty against labor contracts after 20 years of trying because they had a Republican congress and executive branch that was anti-union.

The National Mediation Board members and bankruptcy judges were anti-union, and a part of an anti-union adminstration.

They have rolled back airline pilot wages to 1980 levels with 30-40% reductions in takehome pay for airline pilots.

For me a tax cut is not as important as our ability to get 20% back over the next ten years.

 

[Poahi]

What do you think will affect your income more?

FUEL COSTS. That can bring your income to $0.

 

[LearLove]

I'm gonna say its a combo but lean towards labor friendly because if nobody has a job then there won't be anyone working to collect taxes from.

Also I gotta say of course I don't want to pay higher taxes but dipsh1t bush has got this country in such a financial hole I think we all need to pony up to get the US financial house in order. we need to repay all the $$ we owe and get the deficit back to the plus side and a lot of this economy mess will clear up.

 

[Flynfish]

By far we need labor friendly courts and an administration that is pro labor.
Labor friendly courts make unions stronger, which gives us better wages and work rules.
Tax cuts don't mean much when you don't have a job.

 

[General Lee]

You get both with Obama. Labor Friendly Democrats in the courts, and a tax cut if you make less than $250,000 a year (or at least not a tax raise). If you make more than $250,000 a year (like I do thanks to my wife), that is just the way it goes. But, I still want the labor friendly democrats. Enough of the Republican doctrine that is pro management. You've had your time.....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

You get both with Obama. Labor Friendly Democrats in the courts, and a tax cut if you make less than $250,000 a year (or at least not a tax raise). If you make more than $250,000 a year (like I do thanks to my wife), that is just the way it goes. But, I still want the labor friendly democrats. Enough of the Republican doctrine that is pro management. You've had your time.....


Bye Bye--General Lee

So what is the plan? buy another house? 401k or IRA deposits...

I've never made more than 100k.... what do you do with all that extra cabbage? And how will you lower your tax liability...

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Yep, None of us are considered rich anymore.

 

[ROSWELL41]

Neither will be friendly to 'airline pilot' labor. Wait and see...

 

[spitfire1500]

Neither will be friendly to 'airline pilot' labor. Wait and see...

I have to agree...Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't a Democratic Clinton admin keep American from striking by ordering pilots to work!!

American Airlines Resuming Service After Clinton Stops Strike

By Brian Knowlton
Published: MONDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 1997

WASHINGTON: American Airlines service was nearly back to normal Sunday, a day after President Bill Clinton ordered pilots back to work. But the prospect that his action might merely delay a strike appeared certain to jostle and confuse domestic and international travel until a solution is reached.

Our national security trumps all of this. What kind of economy would there be with another 9-11. There would be no need for the NMB with no job!

 

[gt1900]

You guys have to get over the increased tax thing... Do you really think the people tha make over $250,000 a year don't have a ton of tax breaks? The folks that make the big money usually end up paying less in taxes then everyone else. Thats why the top 10% of the people in the U.S. who make 90% of the money only pay 40% of the taxes... The increased taxes that Obama is going to charge the rich won't hurt them at all... He11, finance another lake house and right off the intersest.... They will just find more right-offs so they don't pay the taxes and the general population will continue to support the country... There is ways to get around the high tax bracket.... The increadably wealthy know how it works...... Time for Fare tax....

 

[spitfire1500]

You guys have to get over the increased tax thing... Do you really think the people tha make over $250,000 a year don't have a ton of tax breaks? The folks that make the big money usually end up paying less in taxes then everyone else. Thats why the top 10% of the people in the U.S. who make 90% of the money only pay 40% of the taxes... The increased taxes that Obama is going to charge the rich won't hurt them at all... He11, finance another lake house and right off the intersest.... They will just find more right-offs so they don't pay the taxes and the general population will continue to support the country...

Yea and those who don't want to work get it all for free. I was in the hospital the other day with my son and a family next to me with no one working is sitting there with all their fancy blackberries and 200.00 sneakers typing away, talking and having a good old time yelling screaming, laughing and talking about how all their expenses at the hospital are covered (loud enough that security had to shut em up)while I get a $6000.00 bill for a broken wrist!! With an Obama administration this crap is going to run rampant!!

 

[gt1900]

$6000 bill for a broken wrist??? How much did your insurance pay??? You probably paid your copay and went home.. Maybe an extra $100 for the ER visit... You make it sound like its gonna cost you $6000 out of pocket....

 

[pipe]

I have to agree...Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't a Democratic Clinton admin keep American from striking by ordering pilots to work!!

American Airlines Resuming Service After Clinton Stops Strike

By Brian Knowlton
Published: MONDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 1997

WASHINGTON: American Airlines service was nearly back to normal Sunday, a day after President Bill Clinton ordered pilots back to work. But the prospect that his action might merely delay a strike appeared certain to jostle and confuse domestic and international travel until a solution is reached.

Our national security trumps all of this. What kind of economy would there be with another 9-11. There would be no need for the NMB with no job!

terrorism

noun
the calculated use of violence (or the threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimidation or coercion or instilling fear

So how many years do you intend to let the terrorism work on you? If you intend to give up your quality of life on a permanent basis then "they" have won anyway so your point is moot.

Believe it or not, it is possible for a politician to fight terrorism, keep our country secure, and not screw the worker. I don't really see anything that makes these things mutually exclusive.

The administration has used the fear of terrorism to a greater effect than even the terrorists have.

PIPE

 

[Citrusflyer]

Jumbo shrimp

Crisis Management,

Honest Lawyers,

Amicable Divorce,

Reagan Democrat,

Exact Estimate,

and the most laughable,

Labor friendly NMB.

 

[:-)]

Your question presupposes that Obama will in fact provide you with pro labor forces in government. Show me how the Democrats have been ALPA friendly over the last 20 years and I'll consider it. Until then, I'll vote against BOTH major party candidates.

 

[BoilerUP]

I'm all for a "fare tax". The only "fair" tax is called a flat tax, where EVERYBODY pays a flat percentage of their gross income.

The guy making $20,000/yr pays 10% just like the guy making $200,000/yr, just like the guy making $2M/year.

That way nobody can ever claim you're not paying your "fair share".

 

[Flyprdu]

I'm all for a "fare tax". The only "fair" tax is called a flat tax, where EVERYBODY pays a flat percentage of their gross income.

The guy making $20,000/yr pays 10% just like the guy making $200,000/yr, just like the guy making $2M/year.

That way nobody can ever claim you're not paying your "fair share".

That is the perfect way to bankrupt the government.

 

[BoilerUP]

That is the perfect way to bankrupt the government.

Really?

How so fellow Boilermaker, explain it to me.

 

[Flyprdu]

Really?

How so fellow Boilermaker, explain it to me.

If you reduce all tax brackets to 10%, there will be tremendous drop in revenue that the government receives. You will have to come up with the shortfall somewhere, which is why "Fair tax" plans come with a national sales tax.

Except this only shifts the burden even more disproportionally to the lower classes, as people need the same amount of basic consumables to survive.

So, in reality, a wealthy person takes far more of his or her income home, while it is the lowest individual who pays the highest percentage of his/her income in taxes.

Nothing fair about that. Didn't Carney teach you ethics?

 

[Citrusflyer]

So, in reality, a wealthy person takes far more of his or her income home, while it is the lowest individual who pays the highest percentage of his/her income in taxes.

THAT is the key statement here....his or her income. It's not Uncle Sam's, it's ours. If you don't make much you pay higher percentages for EVERYTHING; taxes, gas, groceries, iphones, and on and on. Besides, the government will never go "bankrupt", if trillion $$ deficits can't do it, nothing will.

 

[Alcatraz]

So, in reality, a wealthy person takes far more of his or her income home, while it is the lowest individual who pays the highest percentage of his/her income in taxes.

Nothing fair about that. Didn't Carney teach you ethics?

Not exactly. Under the Fair Tax plan, everyone would receive a rebate to reimburse us for the taxes on the basic consumables like food... so if you were so poor and were "starving," you would continue to live tax free. If you were "poor" and still bought an iPod (a luxury item), you pay taxes on the luxury item. If you were "rich" and you bought a huge yacht as a "second home" (sometimes this is tax deductible) you would pay taxes on it, too. Even illegal immigrants would be forced to start paying taxes!

AND we'd all stop paying embedded taxes on capital gains and corporate taxes!

AND you wouldn't spend a fortune calculating your taxes... it would be automatic!

An equal percentage IS fair... the more you spend (which should be relative to what you make), the more taxes you pay, since you can afford it.

BTW, TQC is somewhat of a liberal (nice guy, though!).

 

[Flyprdu]

THAT is the key statement here....his or her income. It's not Uncle Sam's, it's ours. If you don't make much you pay higher percentages for EVERYTHING; taxes, gas, groceries, iphones, and on and on. Besides, the government will never go "bankrupt", if trillion $$ deficits can't do it, nothing will.

I have an idea... why don't we just tear the f*cker down. Since you see no value in government, you're right.. why pay anything? I guess we don't need roads, cops, fire protection, utilities, or healthcare.

Oliver Wendell Holmes put it best by saying: "I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization."

You are so brainwashed that we have been in this 30 year decline and dissolution of our own infrastructure in the name of easy money. Unreal.

 

[Box-Hauler]

Flyprdu,

The "Fair Tax" is an actual tax plan to abolish our current tax system and replace it with a flat tax. It is based on a national sales tax. This tax hits everybody the same. In the FairTax there is a prebate (government check) to everyone to cover the basic cost of living up to the poverty level. This make it so someone living on very little money pays no taxes. The FairTax also hits the underground economy that everyone has used. Who has not paid for something in cash to keep it off the books, be it your yard guy, an electrician moving an outlet, or the local crack dealer. All of the above will be hit with the FairTax when they take their cash and buy that new Lexus.

If you read the book by John Linder "The Fair Tax" it explains it all better than some dumb airline pilot ever could. Suffice it to say it will kill the power in Washington and return the power to the people. It will also bring in Billions of dollars that are offshore in foreign accounts. You ask why has no politician gotten on the bandwagon, because the lobbyist who pay off our beloved elected officials would then all be on unemployment, just like a lot of pilots are now thanks to our government. (referencing the government induced slowdown we are in, and if you think that the government did not cause this mess you should vote for your current incumbent idiot politician, and I will see you in the food stamp line.)

 

[BoilerUP]

If you reduce all tax brackets to 10%, there will be tremendous drop in revenue that the government receives.

Okay, fair enough...raise it to 15%, 18%, 22%. 10% was an arbitrary figure and is a matter for discussion; after all, I'm a pilot not an economist.

You will have to come up with the shortfall somewhere, which is why "Fair tax" plans come with a national sales tax.

Except this only shifts the burden even more disproportionally to the lower classes, as people need the same amount of basic consumables to survive.

So, in reality, a wealthy person takes far more of his or her income home, while it is the lowest individual who pays the highest percentage of his/her income in taxes.

Nothing fair about that.

If everybody is paying the same percentage of their gross income then the argument can be made that everyone is paying equally toward the services that the federal government provides to them. That would be the epitome of "fair". Besides, there wouldn't necessarily be a NEED for a supplemental sales tax, depending on the flat tax percentage.

Additionally, with a vastly simplified tax structure there will be no need to maintain the IRS as it currently stands, resulting in a substantial reduction in size (and cost) for the administration and enforcement of federal tax code.

Didn't Carney teach you ethics?

Does your definition of ethics allow for increased income taxes on some in order to provide federal handouts to others, some of which don't contribute a penny in federal income taxes?

 

[Alcatraz]

The Fair Tax Plan is supposed to be cost neutral... so it's not a tax cut or raise.

Arguments on excessive or wasteful spending by governments should be a separate issue. (and yes, government does a lot of very necessary things)

 

[Flyprdu]

The FairTax also hits the underground economy that everyone has used. Who has not paid for something in cash to keep it off the books, be it your yard guy, an electrician moving an outlet, or the local crack dealer. All of the above will be hit with the FairTax when they take their cash and buy that new Lexus.

That is the best reason for a national sales tax I have heard.

But I am still in favor of a progressive tax. Perhaps a hybrid could be considered.

 

[ROSWELL41]

Remember, the public and subsequently the politicians care about one thing in regard to air travel: price. Air travel will remain affordable to the consumer, that is the mandate of the politicians. No party will support airline pilots right to self help, no party will prevent cabotage if ticket prices are sky high. We need a new game plan, looking for a savior in Washington is a lost cause.

 

[Box-Hauler]

I have an idea... why don't we just tear the f*cker down. Since you see no value in government, you're right.. why pay anything? I guess we don't need roads, cops, fire protection, utilities, or healthcare.

Oliver Wendell Holmes put it best by saying: "I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization."

You are so brainwashed that we have been in this 30 year decline and dissolution of our own infrastructure in the name of easy money. Unreal.

Fly,

Where in the Constitution does it say anything about roads, cops, fire or HEALTHCARE.

Those are all items that the local States should take care of, if the people of the State deem it worthwhile.

Even I, a person with a Kentucky public education am able to read what the limits of goverment (according to the Constituion)are supposed to be, and healthcare is not one of them. If you would like a cradle to grave government there are plenty in this world (France, Canada, most of Europe) please move there and leave the "Land of the Free", to the people who would like to be free.


Fly sorry if the above come across as mean spirited, I re-read it and realized it could appear that way. I am simply stating that our government does way more than was originaly envisioned by the framer. They wanted as much as possible to be done at a local, not a federal level............ Thanks for letting me clarify my ramblings.

 

[Smarta$$]

Under a fair tax plan, ultimately, the very high paid people will keep, save and invest a higher percentage of their money then they do now. They will also keep a higher percentage of their money then the middle class. That, I do not think is the direction we need to go.

 

[BoilerUP]

Even I, a person with a Kentucky public education

Something we have in common!

:beer:

(well, except for that whole higher learnin' thing)