DAL/Expressjet NO More

[GINCHBLASTER]

Another airline might get this flying, but its not going to mean Delta will be taking on any more 50 seaters... any flying you get here is going to be at the expense of loosing other flying. Its merely going to be a shift of airplanes from one set of routes to another.

So, don't get too excited.

Damn that loose flying!

In all seriousness though sorry to hear for the ExpressJet guys.

 

[johnsonrod]

Watch Colgan transfer Saabs from LGA to LAX. You heard it here first...

 

[TOOL CRIB]

From a Delta press release:

"With the losses we were experiencing from our Delta pro-rate flying combined with our ability to return aircraft to the lessor, this termination of service is in the best interest of our company," said Jim Ream, ExpressJet President and Chief Executive Officer.
After Sept. 1, ExpressJet will retain the 23 ERJ-145 aircraft it currently flies Delta Connection.

 

[CFI2766]

....as when CMR, ALG, PDT, Air Wisconsin and ACA all lost flying...This has been going on for some time and will continue to as long as ALPA ignores brand scope.....The current environment is every man for themselves....It hasn't paid to be "the best paid" for quite some time.....

It's very simple....Either we bargain as ONE unit at each brand or we bargain SEPARATELY within each brand and do what is best for number 1.....and that ain't the other guy....Which will it be?

Well, past and current events point towards each brand doing what is best for #1....which ain't the other guy. For the average American, is that right? Is that wrong? Depends on your beliefs.

For the pilot group, it's clearly a negative to have to fight other pilots for the award to do the cheapest flying. Unfortunatetly, I think the train has already left on brand scope. Not to absolve them from blame, but there is nothing that ALPA or any other union could do at this time to instill or force a unity amongst pilot groups. Without the ability to conduct an organized strike, there is no serious financial motivation for management to actually negotiate with pilot groups. Sure, we can 'work to rule' and 'fly safe', and these things have helped with ASA's negotiations, but not to the effect of an organized, specific work stoppage.

So, the average pilot asks him/herself, what good is ALPA (fill in the name of union here: Teamsters/SWAPA/girl scouts/etc...)? Sure, there are several things that ALPA does well. However, the main thing that pilots want and need a collective bargaining umbrella to do, i.e. increase wages and quality of life, ALPA can not do.

 

[CFI2766]

It should be acknowledged that it stinks that well-compensated pilots (XJT) will be harmed by this. I don't like the idea of another pilot out of work, and I certainly wouldn't (won't?) delight in doing work that was once done by someone else.

It's a harsh reality.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Let's not forget that XJT replaced ASA in LAX and Skywest in SLC....XJT underbid Skywest for the flying.....Welcome to RFPs and bidding...Hopefully some or all of this will come back to Skywest Inc.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Well, past and current events point towards each brand doing what is best for #1....which ain't the other guy. For the average American, is that right? Is that wrong? Depends on your beliefs.

For the pilot group, it's clearly a negative to have to fight other pilots for the award to do the cheapest flying. Unfortunatetly, I think the train has already left on brand scope. Not to absolve them from blame, but there is nothing that ALPA or any other union could do at this time to instill or force a unity amongst pilot groups. Without the ability to conduct an organized strike, there is no serious financial motivation for management to actually negotiate with pilot groups. Sure, we can 'work to rule' and 'fly safe', and these things have helped with ASA's negotiations, but not to the effect of an organized, specific work stoppage.

So, the average pilot asks him/herself, what good is ALPA (fill in the name of union here: Teamsters/SWAPA/girl scouts/etc...)? Sure, there are several things that ALPA does well. However, the main thing that pilots want and need a collective bargaining umbrella to do, i.e. increase wages and quality of life, ALPA can not do.

You may very well be right....If that is the case, then we all must do what is best for our individual companies....and in this environment any growth will come at someone elses expense....

 

[145BOSS]

Expressjet didn't have much of a choice. In the new capacity agreement with Continental, all the flying is to be done by the LR and XR models. To get the extra aircraft to comply with the agreement XJT had two options; end the agreement with Delta or end their own branded flying, which we all know is a cashcow...

 

[MJ42]

It should be acknowledged that it stinks that well-compensated pilots (XJT) will be harmed by this. I don't like the idea of another pilot out of work, and I certainly wouldn't (won't?) delight in doing work that was once done by someone else.

It's a harsh reality.

Like: 950 UAL pilots
180 Air Tran pilots
300 US Airways pilots
up to 500 CAL pilots

 

[JoeMerchant]

Like: 950 UAL pilots
180 Air Tran pilots
300 US Airways pilots
up to 500 CAL pilots

Actually you could say...

About 5,000 UAL
About 2,000 USAir
About 5,000 AMR
About 5,000 DAL

Look at the seniority lists of these companies in 2000....Looks like "scope" isn't working for either side of the fence....ALPA and the mainlines were warned.....

 

[TNPILOT]

Expressjet didn't have much of a choice. In the new capacity agreement with Continental, all the flying is to be done by the LR and XR models. To get the extra aircraft to comply with the agreement XJT had two options; end the agreement with Delta or end their own branded flying, which we all know is a cashcow...

I think you can count on the branded flying ending as well come January. Aircraft will be put into the CAL operation which is set at 205 aircraft for the next year and 190 after that. Some of the extra aircraft will go to the charter division which is growing. Furloughs will result from the parking of the 135s and perhaps the EPs.

 

[Texx]

Pick one...

1. The flying goes to Skywest Airlines BUT do they have enough airframes to cover the flying? If not, where would they come OR be transferred from?

2. JO puts all EMB pilots on RES for the month of July.
http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/major-national-lcc/mesa.html
"Ornstein predicts an "amicable solution."
Could the solution be a backfill with Freedom?

There will not be a new airline added to the group as stated by DAL that they are going to trim the number.

Remember,
"ExpressJet Delta Connection, chiefly operating out of Los Angeles and Salt Lake City, will cease by Sept. 1, the airlines said."

Someone is going to have to move very, very fast to start an operation.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Pick one...

1. The flying goes to Skywest Airlines BUT do they have enough airframes to cover the flying? If not, where would they come OR be transferred from?

2. JO puts all EMB pilots on RES for the month of July.
http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/major-national-lcc/mesa.html
"Ornstein predicts an "amicable solution."

There will not be a new airline added to the group as stated by DAL that they are going to trim the nuumber.

I'll take 1....but wouldn't be surprised at 2......

 

[cfi_greg]

It should be acknowledged that it stinks that well-compensated pilots (XJT) will be harmed by this. I don't like the idea of another pilot out of work, and I certainly wouldn't (won't?) delight in doing work that was once done by someone else.

It's a harsh reality.

This flying was already done by somebody else before XJT took it.

 

[WalterSobchak]

Pick one...

1. The flying goes to Skywest Airlines BUT do they have enough airframes to cover the flying? If not, where would they come OR be transferred from?

Last I checked, SkyWest's current DL operation is running at the minimum required flights per day as outlined in the contract...much, much fewer DLC flights per day than last summer with the same amount of airframes. Therefore, SKW has a bunch of under-utilized airdraft in the SLC system. As far as I can tell, a quick September sked re-work and SKW wouldn't have to find any planes...and might still have a spare or two.