At the NEW Delta...looks like MEM will....stick around...article

[generaltso]

Really General!? Our domestic product sucks. Come ride in the back of my 50 seat RJ from CVG to JFK while the packs keep the passengers comfortable at 95 + degrees. After your long flight sitting right across from the smelly bathroom next to some overweight guy who takes up half of your already small seat you land at JFK wait for a parking space for an hour. You try and look out your window to see what the hold up is and quickly realize you can't because the window is down by your waist. Now that the flight has finally ended, we dump you out on a noisy and flooded ramp in the middle of a thunderstorm. You are soaked and your bags are soaked as you stand in four inches of water. Oh yeah, don't trip on the steps off the airplane and be careful walking up those steps back up into the terminal (I have seen one passenger shatter her nose in our galley when her face hit the floor after tripping on the top step).

After that wonderful plane ride you get to have a pleasant conversation with the only gate agent that will acknowledge you in the terminal to try and find your connection because it is the most effed up piece of sheet terminal on the planet.

Other than that, we have a great product.

AMEN to that! Something must be done about JFK, it is pathetic and embarrassing.

 

[johnboy99]

AMEN to that! Something must be done about JFK, it is pathetic and embarrassing.

And that is before you get through the front door at terminal 3.

 

[atlcrashpad]

Lies lies an mo lies..... DAL MGT is full of it.......... tell ya whats ya wanna hear den day is gwoin ta slam it down yo throat....... economics has dun changed an we so sorry butt......
bouyyyyyyyyy....

 

[737 Pylt]

So, have you worked on Wall Street? What financial experience do you have? Or are you just offering your unqualified opinion?

OYS....
Unfortunately the only financial experience this little prick understands is in the service of his $5 tricks he performs on the street corner. Unfortunately I can still read his BS when someone quotes him. Don't waste your time responding to the little ********************, he's just a scared little boy hiding behind a compute keyboard!

737

 

[General Lee]

Really General!? Our domestic product sucks. Come ride in the back of my 50 seat RJ from CVG to JFK while the packs keep the passengers comfortable at 95 + degrees. After your long flight sitting right across from the smelly bathroom next to some overweight guy who takes up half of your already small seat you land at JFK wait for a parking space for an hour. You try and look out your window to see what the hold up is and quickly realize you can't because the window is down by your waist. Now that the flight has finally ended, we dump you out on a noisy and flooded ramp in the middle of a thunderstorm. You are soaked and your bags are soaked as you stand in four inches of water. Oh yeah, don't trip on the steps off the airplane and be careful walking up those steps back up into the terminal (I have seen one passenger shatter her nose in our galley when her face hit the floor after tripping on the top step).

After that wonderful plane ride you get to have a pleasant conversation with the only gate agent that will acknowledge you in the terminal to try and find your connection because it is the most effed up piece of sheet terminal on the planet.

Other than that, we have a great product.

Unfortunately YOUR PRODUCT is mixed in with OUR product. What we need is less RJs at JFK. Do we need feed from the smaller cities? How about 1 flight a day instead of a few? If we got rid of most of your 50 seaters and AA Eage 37 seaters, the airport would probably run smoother and we wouldn't lose as much money. How many times have I been stuck trying to get into Lima Alpha at our terminal with a few money losing 50 seaters cloggin up everything trying to get to commuterworld? Ridiculous. A few of your CR9s could be used to go to larger cities, but that would be enough. We can only pray......


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[rtmcfi]

Unfortunately YOUR PRODUCT is mixed in with OUR product.

Nope, it is still your product. Your mgmnt hired them, it is your product. You sell it as your own. Perception is reality.

What we need is your ABSENCE at JFK. Why do we fly money losing 50 seat RJs at JFK? Do we need feed from the smaller cities?

You do need the feed from smaller cities, like it or not. The cities that are too small for the likes of SWA are the only cities domesticly that you are going to be able charge a fare for that will allow a much of a profit.

If we got rid of your 50 seaters and AA Eage 37 seaters, the airport would probably run smoother

Yep, cause with the loss of the RJ's, and the resultant loss of connecting pax, all traffic would shrink dramatically

A few of your CR9s could be used to go to larger cities, but that would be enough. We can only pray......

Unfortunatly for pilots as a whole, it will be more than a few.

 

[General Lee]

Nope, it is still your product. Your mgmnt hired them, it is your product. You sell it as your own. Perception is reality.

Well, that is why we need to limit them. If you think RJs still make money in this environment, you are smoking pot. That is why our management is AGGRESIVELY trying to park them. How many Freedom RJs were parked for June in FLO? 23. The injunction for Mesa will not last forever, and then those RJs are GONE.

You do need the feed from smaller cities, like it or not. The cities that are too small for the likes of SWA are the only cities domesticly that you are going to be able charge a fare for that will allow a much of a profit.

We do need feed from small cities, but only when our RJs are the only ones flying there. If we go up against Airtran 717s, we lose. If we go up against Jetblue E190s out of JFK to SYR, ROC, etc---we will lose. We only need one RJ a day to feed our INTL pushes, not 4 daily. The other 3 are money losers in this environment, and they will be gone in SEP.



Yep, cause with the loss of the RJ's, and the resultant loss of connecting pax, all traffic would shrink dramatically

Again, a lot of the flights into JFK do NOT connect pax to Europe. Those will be gone. They are money wasters. We do need feed for the big INTL pushes, and maybe 1 CR9 could do the trick early afternoons. Why is there a 10 am flight to JFK from some of these places? That is the problem.


Unfortunatly for pilots as a whole, it will be more than a few.

We still have limits on the and a 76 seat CR9 still can lose money against an Airtran 717. The CR9 also uses up an asset (the gate and jetway), that can be used by something larger when needed. Regardless, as good ole Boyd states, the days of CRJ-50s are numbered. That will help a lot.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[WMUSIGPI]

Interesting... Pinnacle gets much of its MSP flying shifted to Mesaba. Then looses the ATL flying. It sure smells of something rotten for them. Or is that just the normal foul odor in MEM?

 

[xjlifer]

Interesting... Pinnacle gets much of its MSP flying shifted to Mesaba. Then looses the ATL flying. It sure smells of something rotten for them. Or is that just the normal foul odor in MEM?

It smells of a airline in negotiations with NWA.

 

[JonnyKnoxville]

.....

 

[JonnyKnoxville]

Unfortunately YOUR PRODUCT is mixed in with OUR product. What we need is less RJs at JFK. Do we need feed from the smaller cities? How about 1 flight a day instead of a few? If we got rid of most of your 50 seaters and AA Eage 37 seaters, the airport would probably run smoother and we wouldn't lose as much money. How many times have I been stuck trying to get into Lima Alpha at our terminal with a few money losing 50 seaters cloggin up everything trying to get to commuterworld? Ridiculous. A few of your CR9s could be used to go to larger cities, but that would be enough. We can only pray......


Bye Bye--General Lee

THIS JUST IN: Comair is owned by Delta. Your product is our product. Yep, I am the guy in that little money losing RJ saying to ATC that we will follow our COMPANY 757 to the ramp. Same company period! When you look at it any other way management has won against our pilot groups.

The constant scope fight between pilot groups is so stupid. Let management fly whatever they want as long as it is by a Delta Pilot. If you don't want to do this kind of flying staple us to the bottom of your list and we will do it for our current wages.

I am not disputing economics of 50 seat regional jets. At these fuel prices I believe most of them will be going away. The shift will be back in the direction of larger aircraft and less frequency. It is all relative though. We will continue to get CRJ-900s and get rid of CRJ-200s. You will be getting rid of DC-9 and MD-80s and replacing them with 737s.

 

[General Lee]

THIS JUST IN: Comair is owned by Delta. Your product is our product. Yep, I am the guy in that little money losing RJ saying to ATC that we will follow our COMPANY 757 to the ramp. Same company period! When you look at it any other way management has won against our pilot groups.

The constant scope fight between pilot groups is so stupid. Let management fly whatever they want as long as it is by a Delta Pilot. If you don't want to do this kind of flying staple us to the bottom of your list and we will do it for our current wages.

I am not disputing economics of 50 seat regional jets. At these fuel prices I believe most of them will be going away. The shift will be back in the direction of larger aircraft and less frequency. It is all relative though. We will continue to get CRJ-900s and get rid of CRJ-200s. You will be getting rid of DC-9 and MD-80s and replacing them with 737s.

So, you're the guy saying "We will follow OUR COMPANY 757 to the ramp.."? Did you hear some chuckles?

I too see the CRJ-50s going away, but there is a problem with your thoughts on CR9s. We don't have the gates. They need a full gate and we don't have enough to replace your CRJ-50s one for one. Also, the MD88s will slowly go away, and I don't know for sure what will happen to the DC9s, although everyone around thinks they will be dumped. The 737s we are getting shortly (like the 6 we get this year) will be flying places the MD88s could not--like Quito and Vail. Not a direct trade.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Jmoney]

I will give you credit for pointing out on thing Jmoney. It is the credit issues for DAL. The deal will get done for that reason alone. I would bet dollars to donuts that our creditors told management that if we did not merger there would be no more loans for those big 777. With out those we can not sustain this business plan, alone or apart.
This deal will get done. It will be done quickly. Why? Because the next storm is already on the horizon. Open Skies, after that Foreign Ownership. Guys those are threats to management as well. They need this deal done to protect what is theirs. In turn it will protect what is ours.
The next three years MAY see us furlough and shrink a little as we get our ducks in a row. Fact is that after that, there will be no other airline in this country that can touch us. That is coming from people that know a lot more than you and I ever will.

This is what it all boils down to:

CREDIT-

If DAL can't finance this merger, they are absolutely done! If the credit rating firms downgrade their credit to "junk" status again, the credit card processors will demand a higher holdback amount, the credit markets will close to them, and the present creditors will accelerate thier payback demands.....

Long-story short-BK again... And tihs time without the ability to even finance it... Not good.

By playing this "look desperate" game with huge writeoff, DAL mgmt runs the very serious risk of actually becoming very desperate. Credit ratings do matter, and in this case, DAL's credit rating will determine if this merger happens and more significantly-if the airline survives.

-Don't underestimate what mistakes Anderson and company may be making.

 

[737 Pylt]

THIS JUST IN: Comair is owned by Delta. Your product is our product. Yep, I am the guy in that little money losing RJ saying to ATC that we will follow our COMPANY 757 to the ramp. Same company period! When you look at it any other way management has won against our pilot groups.

Just curious, what does your paycheck say? Delta or Comair? What does your uniform say? Delta or Comair?

The constant scope fight between pilot groups is so stupid. Let management fly whatever they want as long as it is by a Delta Pilot. If you don't want to do this kind of flying staple us to the bottom of your list and we will do it for our current wages.

The rjdc prevented that, and now because of them, that ship has sailed. You can profanely thank them for that!

I am not disputing economics of 50 seat regional jets. At these fuel prices I believe most of them will be going away. The shift will be back in the direction of larger aircraft and less frequency. It is all relative though. We will continue to get CRJ-900s and get rid of CRJ-200s. You will be getting rid of DC-9 and MD-80s and replacing them with 737s.

Well said!:beer:

737

 

[IXLR8]

Anderson is going to tell everybody what they want to hear, then once he's got what he wants it's going to be "Conditions have changed and we're forced to make some alterations to our business plan."

Exactly. Get the Pacific routes from NWA and then let the cuts begin....again, the layoffs wont be from the "merger" it will be due to fuel and whatever else these guys can think of..SARS, etc etc.....

 

[JonnyKnoxville]

So, you're the guy saying "We will follow OUR COMPANY 757 to the ramp.."? Did you hear some chuckles?

I too see the CRJ-50s going away, but there is a problem with your thoughts on CR9s. We don't have the gates. They need a full gate and we don't have enough to replace your CRJ-50s one for one. Also, the MD88s will slowly go away, and I don't know for sure what will happen to the DC9s, although everyone around thinks they will be dumped. The 737s we are getting shortly (like the 6 we get this year) will be flying places the MD88s could not--like Quito and Vail. Not a direct trade.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Yep, we always chuckle at that joke because you guys don't get it. The joke is on you. You keep letting scope go and the B-scale known as Comair, Mesaba, and Compass as we continue to grow. Not good for any pilot group. But just keep the lists independent of each other and continue to protect your ego.

 

[Superpilot92]

Yep, we always chuckle at that joke because you guys don't get it. The joke is on you. You keep letting scope go and the B-scale known as Comair, Mesaba, and Compass as we continue to grow. Not good for any pilot group. But just keep the lists independent of each other and continue to protect your ego.

admit it GL you got owned with this one and he is right. Scope giveaway's was/is a massive F-UP.

 

[JonnyKnoxville]

Just curious, what does your paycheck say? Delta or Comair? What does your uniform say? Delta or Comair?


The rjdc prevented that, and now because of them, that ship has sailed. You can profanely thank them for that!



Well said!:beer:

737

Just curious, do you know what a wholly-owned subsidiary means? What does the annual report say?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Yes, I know what it means, and CMR is lumped in to our financials. The reason that they are keeping you on the books is this. You are the best pressure relief valve that they could ask for. No one would ever sue DAL for breaking a contract with CMR, why you are wholly owned. So when the flying shifts away from RJ's eventually you will take the hit. I agree it is crap, but it is business and not personal. It has not happened yet, but if DAL looses these court battles rest assured they will look no further than CMR to make up the difference.
Also, most of us have a bad taste in our mouths over the whole RJDC thing and the not hiring of DAL guys after 9/11 with out seniority resignation. Fact is that most guys I fly with ask me this. They are 20+ year guys and were no way effected by the decision. I know that the majority of OH guys were either not there or had noting to do with it, but the fact remains. It is kind of like saying all DAL guys are a-holes. We all just get lumped in.
Because of this bad blood I do not see DAL ALPA ever putting you on the list. I agree that it is the best way to solve the outsourcing issues. Fact is that our MEC sees the DCI thing as a necessity. Why because we as DAL cannot assume the liability of all of the overhead. It is easier for us to outsource, and in fact protects the mother company from financial demise if the loans come do. I agree to some point, but the fact is that I still feel that we as a company and pilot group should do all flying. From an E-120 all the way to a 744. We can all dream. I guess I did for a second or two when Delta bought ASA in 1999. Then I woke up.
I can tell you this. These companies (DCI) are so different that mainline it is not even funny. I can say this because I have been on both sides. Fact is that the attitude that most Regional guys have would not work or fit in here. The mentality is so different.

 

[737 Pylt]

Just curious, do you know what a wholly-owned subsidiary means? What does the annual report say?

I know exactly what it means!
So, what does your uniform say, Delta or Comair?
What does your check say? Comair or Delta?
Its really not that difficult.
What I find funnier is no matter how much you guys hate us, you go around telling everyone you're one of us!

737